I gather EpicUK have a common ruling regarding how many units a WE counts as in an assault, just wondering what it is exactly?

The basic issue I'm fairly sure is that if a WE counts as 3 units, then it is not allowed to assault a normal unit because you can only put max 2 units in contact with each enemy unit. So I believe there's some sort of ruling that clarifies you can in fact assault with a warhound, but not sure how it affects the other conventions for base-to-base in assaults. If the ruling is "war engines count as a single unit for basing purposes" then this means it's not possible for a warlord to trap units into a transport, for example. And it would also mean that putting a gorgon into BtB with 2 infantry units would trap them inside.

Came up recently in a game (Avatar barged a bunch of infantry in valkyries). We let the infantry out (was not going to affect the outcome realistically) but discussed it a bit and recalled there being some inconsistency at tournaments etc about the topic.

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AFAIK The EpicUK ruling is that for assaults and the purposes of BTB and locking in, war engines count as a single model, at least that's how myself, Steve54, dptdexys and MikeT play it, and how I have played it at every tournament I've been to, I would also rule it that way when reffing

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Isn't this covered in 3.3.1, barging and how many units can be in base contact with the War Engine?

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Yeah - we play that as well. War engine is 1dc for the purpose of trapping units in transport but that's separate to the barge rule

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From the rule book






A WE counts as 1 unit, the only part of the game where a WE counts its DC as multiple units is for combat resolution.
The rules never state anywere else that a WEs DC = Units . The rules only state that DC is used for determinating number of CC/FF attacks, how many enemy units can be in base to base contact during an engagement/barging/pinning, How many BMs are needed for suppresion/breaking or for allocating hits before moving on to the next unit and so on.


A WE counts as 1 unit with 3.3.1 giving them their own rule for dealing with engagements.

The section you are looking for isSo a WE can move into contact with several enemy units, or several units can move into contact with a WE, up to 2x the WE DC.

The other point is that units being transported are locked inside when contacted by 2x the DC.

I agree with DPDexy but the problem is that the rules say "For most rules purposes, a war engine counts as being worth a number of units equal to its starting damage capacity" It arguably implies that this is the default. It would be better if it made it clear that it is worth 1 unit by default and its DC only in specific named instances.

Edit: P.S. which (at the risk of going offtopic) is why I have to conclude that, RAW, you don't get an extra BM for knocking a DC off (and not killing) a WE in a cross fire. You didn't kill a unit.

Can you quote chapter and verse on that?

I have always thought it would be hilarious if Warlord Titans had to roll 8 dice for dangerous terrain tests, but I'm not sure "it'd be really funny" is a sensible way to make a balanced game system.

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rolling 8 dice for terrain is not a game breaker. but not permitting a warhound to charge a normal unit is.

I'm saying the rules do not actually create that absurdity but could be more clear.

Its in the opening preamble to the war engine section, so 3.0 I guess...

It does then go on to describe all of the scenarios where you count the war engine as X number of units so I'd say it isn't that ambiguous...

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Again, I may be missing something but what part of this isn't covered by 3.3.1?




Yep.

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The Wargaming Trader
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I believe this is how the rules were intended:

Go by the rules in section 1 and assume the WE is a single unit unless section 3 tells you to treat it as a number of units equal to its DC in a certain situation.

It's the same theme for sections 2 and 4 as well. The introductory rhetoric in 3.0 is just that, it primes you for the rules that follow.

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3.3.1 just tells you e.g. that a baneblade can be contacted by a maximum of 6 units.

So if a DC 8 WE "counts as worth 8 units" can it contact a baneblade? That isn't covered in 3.3.1. But it is covered elsewhere (it can contact it obviously).

And that the Baneblade can contact up to six non-WE units.


Thanks. So the bit that isn't explicitly covered is War Engines contacting War Engines?

EDIT - just to be clear, I'm asking because I wasn't sure of what's still not covered. No sarcasm or bad tone intended...

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A Warlord can base to base a Baneblade. Both the Warlord and the Baneblade count as being in base to base with 1 unit though. The Warlord can be in base to base with 15 other units (WEs or not) and the Baneblade 5 more.

Nothing in 3.0 says that a WE counts as its starting DC in units when in base to base. 3.3.1 only allows 2x starting DC to be base contact with a WE.

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