Ok, tried one of the super duper config titan lists to see if the critique was valid. My opponent came in on very late notice so we just grabbed the minervan list we used to test the knights the other day.

Heres my list:

Incompertus, 3000 POINTS
Legio Gryphonicus (NetEA v3.23 *UNDER DEVELOPMENT*)
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REAVER TITAN [850]
Single Weapon System Surcharge, 3 Plasma Destructor, Veteran Princeps

REAVER TITAN [825]
Single Weapon System Surcharge, 3 Plasma Destructor

REAVER TITAN [825]
Single Weapon System Surcharge, 3 Plasma Destructor

RECON COHORT [100]
4 Sentinels

RECON COHORT [100]
4 Sentinels

THUNDERBOLT SQUADRON [150]
2 Thunderbolts

THUNDERBOLT SQUADRON [150]
2 Thunderbolts

his list:

Incompertus, 3000 POINTS
Minervan Tank Legion (NetEA Tournament Pack 2013)
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SUPER-HEAVY TANK COMPANY [650]
Baneblade, 2 Shadowsword, Supreme Commander, Flak Support (Hydra)

TANK COMPANY [500]
10 Thunderer, Flak Support (Hydra), Salamander Command Vehicle

TANK COMPANY [500]
10 Thunderer, Flak Support (Hydra), Salamander Command Vehicle

FLAK BATTERY [150]
3 Hydra

DEATHSTRIKE MISSILE BATTERY [200]
2 Deathstrike Missile Launchers

ARTILLERY BATTERY [250]
3 Basilisks

WARHOUND [275]
1 Warhound Class Titan

WARHOUND [275]
1 Warhound Class Titan

SUPER-HEAVY TANK PLATOON [200]
Shadowsword

deployment:

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"You have a right to be offended" - Steve Hughes
"Your feelings are hurting my thoughts" - Aron Flam

Turn 1: Minervans win Initiative.

M: warhound in middle doubles and fires on reaver in city stripping 3 shields (1BM).
T: sentinels d oubles forward behins big hill.
M: flak battery holds and moves forward (1BM).
T: sentinels marches thru city on the left flank.
M: artilery sustains on reaver in city stripping it's last shield.
M: Deathstrikes retain and sustain on shieldless reaver doing a total of 8DC and destroys the titan.
T: thunderbolts ground attack flak battery for 1BM. the hydra AA does 1BM in return on the planes.
M: warhound on left flank doubles into city behind a building.
T: thunderbolts ground attacks SHT Co on left flank but are both shot down by the formations defensive AA fire.
M: tank co on right flank marches towards city.
T: BTS-Reaver advances and fires on tank co, killing everything except 2 tanks and breaks the formation! BOOM!
M: shadowsword on left flank marches into city behind building.
T: reaver titan doubles thru city and fires on tank co in middle of the board, destroying all but 2 tanks and breaks the formation. KA-BOOOM!!
M: SHT Co doubles towards city and fies on reaver. all 4 shields are stripped.

END PHASE:

Tank co raliies
Tank Co rallies.

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"You have a right to be offended" - Steve Hughes
"Your feelings are hurting my thoughts" - Aron Flam

TURN 2: AMTL wins initiative.

T: sentinels marches thru city and ZoC both SHT co and shadowsword.
T reaver retains and engages warhound. the reave rwins the combat doing 1DC for no hits in return. the warhound breaks.
M: flakbattery doubles around big hill and fires on sentinels for 1BM.
T: thunderbolts stand down.
M: tank Co on left flank advances and fires on sentinels for 1BM.
T: BTS-reaver doubles forward thru city.
M: artillery sustains on sentinels in city for 1BM.
T: sentinels on right flank advances and fires on flak battery for 1BM.
M: tank Co marches to AMTL blitz.
M: shadowsword advances and fires on sentinels killing 2 and breaks the formation. the sentinels can't get away from the enemy and are wiped out.
M: warhound outside city advances and fires on reaver stripping both shields (1BM).
M: SHT co sustains on the same reaver doing 5DC and breaks the titan.
M: deathstrikes marches forward on right flank.

END PHASE:

warhound rallies.
reaver rallies.

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https://epic40ksweden.wordpress.com/

"You have a right to be offended" - Steve Hughes
"Your feelings are hurting my thoughts" - Aron Flam

TURN 3: TITANS WINS INITIATIVE.

T: BTS-Reaver advances and fires on SHT Co. 1 shadowsword, the banelade and the hydra is destroyed. the last shadowsword gets 1 DC and the formaton breaks. KA-BA-BOOOMM!!!
M: artillery sustains on reaver stripping 1 shield (1BM).
M: warhound retains and advannces. it fires on the reaver for 1BM.
T: reaver marshalls (clearing 2BM:s and loading up 2 shields) and fires on warhound. the warhound gets 12DC in total and is vaporized!! SHAKA-BA-BA-BOOOM!!!
M: warhound advances and fires on reaver stripping 2 shields (1BM).
T: setinels marches up to the AMTL Blitz.
M: deathstrikes marches up to T&H objective on right flank.
T: thunderbolts ground attacks deathstrikes and wipes them out.
M: shadowsword sustains on reaver but misses (1BM).
M: flak battery advances and fires on sentinels by AMTL blitz killing 1 (2BM).
M: Tank Co on left flank marches towards middle.
M: Tank co by AMTL blitz advances with the help of the SC and fires on reaver breaking it.

END PHASE:

SHT co fails to rally
reaver rallies.

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https://epic40ksweden.wordpress.com/

"You have a right to be offended" - Steve Hughes
"Your feelings are hurting my thoughts" - Aron Flam

TURN 4: TITANS WIN INITIATIVE.

T: reaver engages (with the help of the SC) the warhound in front of it and destroys it for no hits.
T: BTS-Reaver retains and engages shadowsword. the tank is destroyed for no hits on the Titan.
M: tank co by AMTL blitz advances and fires on sentinels killing 1 and breaks the formation.
T: thunderbolts stand down.
M: artillery sustains on broken sentinels wiping them out.
M: flak battery marches to T&H objective on right flank.
M: tank co advances to objective on their side denying the titans the T&H.

game is called.
Minervans win 2 - 0 (T&H, Blitz)

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https://epic40ksweden.wordpress.com/

"You have a right to be offended" - Steve Hughes
"Your feelings are hurting my thoughts" - Aron Flam

My thoughts:

okay, 6 MW 2+ hits are crazy deadly. 18 on them on a titan is really friggin scary! If people think they should be dropped back to 4 shots i dont mind, but then the range should be increased. But as i expected i couldn't cover the whole board with so few activations. Yhe early death of 1 of the titans kinda closed off any real offense on the right flank for me. I end up losing a very even battle. if it would have ended up on points i would have won by alot though, thats what titans usually do though...

pics to follow later.

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https://epic40ksweden.wordpress.com/

"You have a right to be offended" - Steve Hughes
"Your feelings are hurting my thoughts" - Aron Flam

Thanks for the report. Result was what I would have expected.

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NetEA NetERC Xenos Lists Chair
NetEA Ork + Feral Ork + Speed Freak Champion

can I ask why the AMTL list didn't go after the deathstrikes with both sets of tbolts first activation? it's certainly what I would have done if I was using titans and my opponent had deathstrikes.... I think losing most of the planes to flak is probably a price worth paying in this instance

if you want to try the titan list again, I reckon taking the ark mechanicus would be a smart move, either use the template to force the opponent to spread his deployment, or pinpoint the shadowswords, it would make the "mega-reaver" list all the nastier

obviously I'm not suggesting ways to win as if this was a normal game, but I think the ark really synergises with the AMTL list, giving you options to knock out potential theats or disrupt the deployment to your advantage.....

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Just some guy

My hobby/painting threads

Army Forge List Co-ordinator

"Ka-boom!"

Mordoten I noticed you moved both sentinels in your first two activations. Would you normally Marshall with a titan that is low on shields etc? I always thought it common practice to help save a titan. Would it have mattered? Or was there something occurring that needed the sentinels' attention?

No, i actually voiced that to my opponent after finishing the second move. "That was probably a really bad idea". He just smiled and did his dirty work...

Iwas actually just waiting for hom to move up more units do i could try outvthe 18 shots ow MW. Got greedy i guess.

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https://epic40ksweden.wordpress.com/

"You have a right to be offended" - Steve Hughes
"Your feelings are hurting my thoughts" - Aron Flam

See that's an example of why playtest games need to be more collaborative in my view, by making a mistake which your opponent exploited it meant you didnt get the full test of the list, we can't expect every mistake to be pointed out of course, but I'd expect something major like that which may well have swung the game would be mentioned to remove major errors and player skill difference

I'd be really curious if it were possibke for you and your opponent to swap armies and play again to see how the result may have been affected....

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Just some guy

My hobby/painting threads

Army Forge List Co-ordinator

Hmmm... Between playtesting the knights list, the space wolves list and playing for sheer fun theres not much time for alot more games...

But if playtesting should be done with "flawless" plans it means that anyone not being a part of the tournament circuit for 5+ years is unfit for testing. Makes playtesting kinda almost impossible to do then...

But if some of the more experienced gamers want to do a mirror match i would be very interested in seeing the report! Would probably learn a few things about how to run theese lists in an optimal way.

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"You have a right to be offended" - Steve Hughes
"Your feelings are hurting my thoughts" - Aron Flam

Thanks for the report. The list performed about as I expected too. Impressive kills on a single formation but not enough damage overall to prevent the small stuff from being taken out and not enough activations at the end to win.

I agree hindsight is 20/20 and there are things you can do better if you look back, but the point isn't to play the "perfect" game or show how a unit performs under the most "idea" circumstances. We play, we make mistakes, we see how it performs overall. In the end, there'd still be at least one dead reaver if the deathstrikes were out of play and I doubt there would be a huge difference in the games outcome.

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-Vaaish

sorry what? "not enough overall damage"??

I mean what do you want? Minervans lost almost the whole army, while the Titans seem to still have most of it left.
It was probably evenly matched in miniatures on the table

And despite all that, AMTL lost the match 2 to 0. The point here being the firepower alone isn't enough to win. Even after 4 turns the titans didn't kill enough stuff to prevent the minervans from getting the blitz and T&H or have enough of their own formations remaining to push the game to points.

From what I can tell, AMTL ended the game with two reavers and one squadron of thunderbolts. They also very nearly lost a second reaver too, it just needed one more hit to drop it. That's a sizable chunk of the AMTL list.

It's also worth noting that despite the impressive kills on the tank companies it looks like AMTL only managed to completely kill the two warhounds, deathstrikes, and the lone shadowsword. Failure to eliminate the formations entirely means that as the game progresses that impressive firepower means less and less to the outcome of the game. It quite simply doesn't matter if you unload 18MW hits on a single formation t4 when there's still 5+ formations on the table.

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-Vaaish