Hi,

I've a little problem reading how to resolve the attack of a doomweaver. Gold Eldar Codex says:



From what I understand:

the eldar player rolls for each models under the doomweaver template, on a 4+, it's destroyed (unless it has a 1+ armor save). Until there, everything is clear. But about the wording "If the model makes the 4+ roll"...Does this mean, eldar opponent player has a 4+ roll to save the model hit by the doomweaver template ?

I think no, but how the sentence is turned, it's not clear...

About the warlock character:
If he uses the Psychic lock, what happen if the warlock is killed ?
Nothing states about this case, does the lock will still work until end phase ? Does the unit locked still have to do a 4+ roll in end phase to unlock ?

Yes is my understanding. Any unit that has a 2+ save or poorer has to make a 4+ save or be destroyed. If you're firing at something like a Land Raider, this is a good thing (they have to make a poorer save than normal to survive), but if it's infantry it's bad (most infantry doesn't have a save but the doomweaver template allows them the 4+ save). They're pretty naff which is why I rarely use 'em - although I do like the minis!

Don't ask me what happens if a unit has a fixed save, I'd reckon they'd get the 4+ save as normal AND then would roll to see if they make their fixed save. Or maybe you'd just do that all in the one roll...



No, the lock will be broken as soon as the warlock is killed. He is using his power to maintain the lock so once he is removed from existence, so too is his power.

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For the Doomweaver, going back to 2nd edition, the 4+ roll meant that the unit was able to move out of the way. It really doesn't matter who rolls, either way the model survives on 4+. The model would thus be destroyed on 1 to 3. I have the feeling that this is what NetEpic is trying to say, but whoever wrote that bit failed a couple of Int checks.


As to the Psychic Lock, I think it would last until the end of the turn in which the Warlock was killed, assuming the Warlock had already been activated for that turn. The Warlock only has to expend additional energy/effort to maintain the effect in subsequent turns, as the energy/effort to maintain it for that turn has already been spent. Thus, if the Warlock is killed after it has been activated during a turn in which it either initiated or maintained the Lock, the Lock would last until the end of that turn, when it would end automatically (no roll needed). If the Warlock is killed before it can act during a turn, the effect ends then.

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Its basically a "dodge" roll. Armor is irrelevant. That's why its a flat 4+. Goof for catching armored vehicles, not so good for infantry. Of course, even if you don't "hit" them, they are displaced from the original location. Which sometimes is jut as good.

Since I had to rewrite all of it from scratch to avoid getting crap from GW, I think I failed more than a couple of checks.




It lasts until the end of the turn. In the end phase all these effects are removed.

Primarch

I have another question:

Is the Master Mime card supposed to work on titan ?

According to description, it could:

"Master Mimes cannot affect AI, HQ, Daemonic, Robotic or Tyranid units."

But as was wondering that it could be quite terrible for eldar opponent when played on an Imperator Titan:

"Your 2000+ points unit can't do anything for the turn"

Imho, master mime should only be played on things with a morale value, not on detachments with morale "-".

I would have thought that a titan would simply be too large and complex for the Master Mime to be able to influence, so I would agree to tightening up the wording so that titans cannot be affected.

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Hi!

I guess someone forgot to add "titans are not affected".

Unless this is a psychic attack, then they get the shielded psi-save.

Primarch

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That's not a psychic attack Peter

In fact, with current wording, you need to read the example associated with master mime description:

you can not move or fire in FF segment but still can fire in advance firing segment.

Hi!

Makes it easier then, something like that should not affect titans. Way too powerful if it did.

I guess we add "titan's not affected" to the list.

Primarch

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Current description ends with:

"Master Mimes cannot affect AI, HQ, Daemonic, Robotic or Tyranid units."

Maybe we could change it to;

"Master Mimes cannot affect AI, HQ, Daemonic, Robotic, Tyranid or any unit without morale value"

This would cover the case of both titans, praetorians and others things that I may have forgotten.

I would be in favour of that. It is, after all, a mind trick, so those whose morale is not in any way represented by a number would, logically to my mind, not be affected.

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Hello, for me, the master mine affects the titans but at the end phase, titan pass automaticly is morale check like unit without morale value.

You must remember that a unit without order can fire during the Advance Fire segment. So, the titan can make something...

So, ok during one turn your titan has no order but you win one PV.

Master mine is more efficient against a ork clan because the ork morale value is very weak... and a ork clan can not recieve order until you don't roll 4+ in the end phase.

Special units which affects morale check (master mine, tyranid queen, Callidus assassin, mind shout of warlock titan, ...) are very strong but not too strong for me (and I play orks ^^).


But I have another question about the doomweavers
The rule says :
"Units with a hit location template and no shields are struck once on a random location for the highest damage listed in that particular template."

Do you mean against a titan (with three highest localtions) :
1) roll a d6 and 1-2 : it is the left location, 3-4 : it is the middle location, 5-6 : it is the right location.
2) the eldar player choose one of the three locations and roll the two hit location dices (up-down and right-left dices) and so, if the final location is out the titan or a invalid location, the doom miss the titan

Similary question about vibro-canon : the rules say : "any target that uses a template is hit on a leg or track location." do you mean without hit location dices roll or with hit location dices roll ? It is not clear ^^

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"If you break my tea, I break your ass !" Grakor Urg Margor, the ork big boss who like tea !
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It's not a question about playing Ork or not, it's more about making the thing more balanced through all factions. Why you can't play the master mime on unit that don't have a morale value (HQ, Nids, Robotic...) but still can play the card on an Imperator Titan ?
Have you already faced an Arlequin Army with several Mime Master support Cards ? OK, they grant 1PV when played but they make the difference each time they are played. How many chances would you have to win a close combat with your motojets engaging SM devastators on First Fire ? Now that they are on advance fire, you just can rip them. There are many more dirty applications for the mime card: for example, on an Evil Sunz clan that start the game in battle wagon transports...Play the card on the boyz, they won't be able to disembark anywhere...


Sounds clear for me, is hit, it's mean you target the lowest part of the template, and you hit this template cell. BUT you still roll the scatter dices, it's a hit, not an automatic damage. Even with the Tremor Cannon, if you cross the beams on a unit with a template and you automatically hit, you just don't roll the to-hit dice but the scatter dices should still be rolled and armor save still apply.

You're in my way when you say "on an Evil Sunz clan that start the game in battle wagon transports...Play the card on the boyz, they won't be able to disembark anywhere.." or "How many chances would you have to win a close combat with your motojets engaging SM devastators on First Fire". Why titans must be immunised against Master Mine and not the Evil Sune boyz ?

You can say "Master Mine is too strong !", I can understand it but if you say "Master Mine is too strong against titans !", I can not understand it.

And in this case, we must talk about tyranid queen, allidus assassin, mind shout of warlock titan...

We can always find some combo or unit which are stronger against these units ou these armies instead of all the armies have the same profils and no personality



I'm agree with it. But in the rule, it is not clear so, I prefer to ask (and report the miss ^^)

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"If you break my tea, I break your ass !" Grakor Urg Margor, the ork big boss who like tea !
(sea http://fbruntz.fr/lpt/regles/regles.html)

I would not have any problem with removing the moral test when using Callidus Assassin and reducing its cost to 50 points...

About others units with "morale test powers", they have to be within a range, it's not anywhere on the board without any dice roll...

Mime Master can be really interesting in many cases (in the game where fliers are strong and AA units more than useful, being able to remove the ability to snap fire on AA units is very good) so not letting it use its power on unit that don't have a morale value is not a big "down" for a 50 points unit, just something that should have been already there...