Though it may feel 'gamey' IMO Glyn has the correct interpretation. So, declare the target formation and choose which formations are intermingled. These than become the single target formation, and as such the attacker merely has to move within 15cm of some part of the target.

AFAIK the rules do not require the attacker to be able to reach the target when declaring a charge - if it fails to get into 15cm of the target, the charge stalls.

So in an extreme case, the attacker could be positioned to one side of formation A, but declare B as the target and intermingle both A and C. Clearly units from C and B will not be able to participate in the assault though they will be included as part of the assault resolution (so numbers and any inspiring characters).

As the others say, intermingling is potentially very savage and a lesson that most learn the hard way (as part of a 'clipping' assault). However if you want to combine formations for an assault under a commander, you just have to make sure the formations are close enough together to be able to fight if they are the target of an assault (usually necessary if they are to take part in the assault). The main problem arises where the formations are only just intermingled.

Thanks guys, between the FAQ and rereading the quoted sections I think we've got enough to keep on with our interpretation.

But play it the way you want to play it. It's your game now more than ever.

_________________
Dave

Blog

NetEA Tournament Pack Website

Squats 2019-10-17

As an E:A "noob", this concerns me.

The game's big innovation against NetEpic is the fact that units move and fire in the one movement, a big improvement IMO. But the complexity of the rules means that long discussions about the minutiae of the ruleset can bog things down and take you out of the game. I'm sticking with it to see if it begins to sink in, but if seasoned players have differing opinions on what the rules mean, I'm worried.

_________________
Clickable links for more Epic goodness:

Life of Die Channel including Epic Podcasts and Battle Reports

Epic 40K Players Page on Facebook
Net Epic Evolution Rules
Net Epic War! Campaign Rules

It's an edge case, though - we're talking about a situation where the defender has put himself in a horribly vulnerable position, and we're discussing just how badly the attacker can punish him. In most games it will be moot, as no matter how you play it it's such a bad idea that you should go to great lengths to avoid it.

The way I've always played (and seen intermingled played at events) is that you have to get within 15cm of the initial target formation (formation B in this case).

It was agreed in the old days (specialist games forum is now lost forever so cannot be produced for confirmation) that the attackers had to get within 15cm of the formation you wanted to assault and then drag in the other formations that were intermingled with them.

The rules state that the whole defenders are treat as 1 big formation for the duration of the assault (not the entire Engage Action).

Here is an FAQ from the 2012 FAQ part 1 (additions to be added to the Master FAQ and has a consensus from the Rules Committee).
This is from overwatch but I have highlighted the part which will affect the positioning of the attackers.


So for me, if it has already been agreed that the assault does not start until after the charge move has been made, then in the situation above the attackers would have to get within 15cm of formation B to be able to drag in A and C and the assault take place and not stall.

Bissler, to be fair, the rules are 'relatively' simple though they can kick out some questions on interpretation, hence the FAQ and the new 'compendium' which attempts to clarify those wrinkles in what is an enjoyable ruleset. The overriding rule in such situations is to remember it is a *game* and have fun - 'extreme' dice can sometimes intervene to offset circumstances - and can be amusing in their own right. It is certainly not worth ruining friendships over some trivial minutiae.

dptdexys, I agree that the key question is at what point are the three formations deemed to be a single formation for the purposes of the assault. To be clear here I think you are suggesting that formations A & C are not deemed to be intermingled until after the charge move and crucially, not before the assault is initiated against B (to determine if the assault has stalled or not).

However the rule suggests they are declared to be intermingled when the charge is declared:-So in an extreme case, all the formations of an army could encircle and intermingle with a central formation, which an attacker can declare as the target of an assault, thus effectively assaulting the entire army - think back to one of rug's celebrated 'castles'.

So I think the issue is whether this was the original intention of the rules (which may not be the case as you indicate) and whether we need to 'fix' this or not.

Sorry, I didn't mean to give the impression that myself and my friend have been falling out; we haven't and have been having a laugh playing.

I've probably been playing NetEpic for far too long and have known the rules pretty much inside out for that game for 20 odd years. Because I haven't had the need to learn rules for so long it may just be the case that my now middle-aged brain hurts with E:A - or they aren't as straightforward as NetEpic.

What we have experienced is a lot of rules referring (and Jimmy Zimms messaging) while trying to get to grips with some of the concepts. I'm sure we'll get there...

_________________
Clickable links for more Epic goodness:

Life of Die Channel including Epic Podcasts and Battle Reports

Epic 40K Players Page on Facebook
Net Epic Evolution Rules
Net Epic War! Campaign Rules

Having tried many years ago to get into NetEpic...it's not that the rules are less straightforward.

I think games with people who know the rules a bit better will probably help. We just need to actually set one up!

_________________
The Apocrypha of Skaros 1.1
Rogue Trader Expedition 0.4
The Horus Heresy 0.5
Night Lords 0.1
My Trade Thread