Oh I think it should definitely have ignores cover. Definitely return to original stats before adding any new special rules.

_________________
Currently doing a plastic scenery kickstarter

Yes, IMO. If Cobra(s) take down a Titan that means those AT shots could be used elsewhere - titans are rarly the only vehicle target in an army. Against battle guavas or a great gargant you'd normally have to use a lot of AT fire and sometimes not all shields might get stripped but now it would be irrelevant.

I'm fine with it having Ignore Cover generally as originally plus Ignore Shields. Rather than reducing its power versus non-WE targets and leaving it underpowered why not instead boost its effectiveness vs its primary titan targets and match how the weapon is meant to work.

Your games must be quite different than mine...

I think ignoring shields and cover would make Cobras viable.

_________________
SG

Ghost's Paint Blog, where everything goes that isn't something else.

Even with full Ignore Cover and that shield special rule, I still don't think it could accomplish its design intent.

It would need to be complemented with 45 cm range at the minimum (which by the way is compliant with its 40k stats).

I do think now that the simple 3BP upgrade would solve most issues, while still making it a very risky unit to use with a 30 cm range.

_________________
"War is not about who is right, but about who is left". - B. Russell

_________________

I am in favour of either of 2 solutions:

- Full IC, 45 cm range

- Current IC, 3BP


Chroma has expressed preference for the second option.

_________________
"War is not about who is right, but about who is left". - B. Russell

I'd like to see Full IC, Ignore Shields/Fields tested.

_________________

Oops, bad predictive text, I meant titans, not gauvas.

Ignore cover and shields would be plenty good enough to make out a good choice, 45cm as well would be OTT, particularly with the Eldar ability to move, fire, move. If 2 Cobras were to double forward and fire at a titan, then sustain fire at the start of the next turn as well, then they would on average kill it. The ability to take out a fully shielded Warlord, Banelord or Great Gargant like this is very powerful. The Cobra would be a niche titan killer, but very good in this role, just as it should be.

The rules and background are clear that its distortion cannon ignores shields so the same should be true for the Epic unit and this makes it the extremely deadly titan kilter it was always meant to be. I guess this might not have been discussed before as the Cobra has only recently had a model and rules in 40k.
Making it 3BP would be a bad idea, as it makes it more of an infantry killer, against the background for the unit, plus removing any point of taking a pair.

If it needs 5+ base to hit War Engines, it might be better to go back to the old "counts all targets as Infantry"-rule...

My arguments for a range increase are well documented in this thread. It would allow for an Eldar playstyle of the unit, and less of a kamikaze play, which is neither fluffy nor warranted balancewise considering the cost of the unit. If the argument of going by 40k abilities is anything to be considered, then I think adjusting its range to 40k abilites is more congruent with Epic deisgn than the addition of a special rule such as bypassing shields.

My argument concerning full IC is simply a question of avoiding another special rule and giving the unit a little more flexibility in its use (aka allowing to target other things than WEs with any decent chance of success).

The 3BP proposition has got to do with giving the Cobra a better to-hit chance against its prime targets, which the current BP rules don't really allow. If any special rule was to be given to the unit, then I would agree with Ulrik that the old proposition of treating all units as Infantry is the best option.

All things considered, my lobbying for a change in Cobra stats is due to the fact that the unit currently underperforms so much that many never pick it at all. If that is the motivation for change, then I believe it should be adressed properly, and not with a simple cosmetic change which does not adress the issue (like the bypassing of shiels, with which the Eldar have no problems in the first place, and limits the intervention of Killing WE to exclusively Multi-Cobra options, does not help it against WEs other than Titans and Gargants, and is of no use whatsoever against races that don't use Void/Power shields).

_________________
"War is not about who is right, but about who is left". - B. Russell

especially if glyn is playing with assorted tropical fruit instead of using miniatures
must be the ozzie sun getting to him!

_________________
MoK's Painting Blog
Now Showing:
Mok's Modular Modern Messy Guard Army

_________________

The reason that only 45 cm is not enough of a boost is linked to the fact that its use still remains too corner cased to large opposing WEs for it to be included in a list. Note that I think that 45 cm range would allow it to function as it should against its prime targets: WEs.

With full IC, you can reasonably include Cobras in a tournament going list. Without, you will always prefer to take Void Spinners or upgraded Scorpions, or not bother with EoV's at all and just take Revenants/Fire Prisms^.

The point of the change is to make Cobras more viable both as a pick and in their primary use.

Please note that if a cobra is allowed to double in order to be at range and shoot, that makes him hit on a 7+...

_________________
"War is not about who is right, but about who is left". - B. Russell

IC makes it a marine killer not a WE killer

Want to make it a WE killer? Make it TK(3) so needs one hit to kill an unshielded DC3 WE or 2 to kill a shielded WE

_________________
www.epic-uk.co.uk
NetEA NetERC Human Lists Chair
NetEA Chaos + Black Legion Champion