Fully agreed.


Wasn't that "Epic" ?

_________________
Currently doing a plastic scenery kickstarter

Another thing:
Models are made with no army list for them. There are two Necron lists floating around which include the new units from the current Codex. Yet developement has stalled. Doesn't stop a certain modeler to CAD units for this.

_________________
We are returned!
http://www.epic-wargaming.de/

Here is the problem I see. We have 1710 members who have posted. Of those, 484 have more than 50 posts. There are 18 Approved army lists, 23 Developmental, and 28 Experimental. That means that lists in development outnumber completed lists by almost 3:1, and that there are about nine and a half contributors with 50 or more posts per list in development (assuming that each of those members wants to contribute). Why would we add more lists to the pile? We need to take those lists that have been stable for a long period and get them Approved. We need to move the existing lists along. Then we can think about how to move forward.

I do want to include modern 40k units in appropriate lists. I do want the new players we bring in to be able to recognize the game as largely modern. I think we need to tie up all the loose ends we can in order to allow that to heppen though.

_________________
SG

Ghost's Paint Blog, where everything goes that isn't something else.

Wow!

My next question, even though it may open up another can of worms is:

Do we need all of them?

_________________
My EPIC and BFG Blog: https://epicaddiction.wordpress.com/

Wh40k has 15 Codexes. This includes Space Marines and their 5 variant Codices.

_________________
We are returned!
http://www.epic-wargaming.de/

18 + 23 + 28 > 15

Of course some people might question if 15 codices are required as well, heh

However these are fantastic stats to see and I think should interest the community in spending some time really focusing on moving some lists to approved. I know I am going to draw some ire here but some lists and areas are so far from done (new Necrons I look at thee) that I hate to say it, but some triage needs to occur, and that they should be put on the back burner to focus on some others, just to get them over the finish line (Cadians for instance). in retrospect, if I had seen this number of unfinished lists I would never have advocated for opening the codex marines to Storm Talon inclusion to begin with.

_________________
He's a lawyer and a super-villian. That's like having a shark with a bazooka!

-I HAVE NO POINT
-Penal Legion-Fan list
-Help me make Whitescars not suck!

Probably not. There are some Experimental lists that haven't been playtested or have had Development effectively stopped that could be culled (with the author's permission). There may be lists that largely duplicate previous efforts that can be removed or consolidated. That would reduce the workload to complete lists, and could allow more concentrated effort on those that remain. This in turn would allow new lists to be added faster.

I think having a large number of lists is not a problem. Having a large number of unfinished lists is. Especially when many are in a position to be Approved, and just have to make the jump. I think the ACs and ERC should be more proactive about approving a list - if it is ready, contact the autor and see if they agree - don't wait for them to come to you. Many of us are perfectionists or tinkerers and would never say "Yep, it's done" without a prod.

_________________
SG

Ghost's Paint Blog, where everything goes that isn't something else.

No. Kull the space marine *green*red*black*yellow*polka chapter variant spam right back for a start But that would be very unpopular

But at the same time i seem to recall EA is meant to be designed to have lots of specific sub lists rather than generic race lists? If that is the intent of how epic lists were meant to be developed, we are pretty much stuck unless we change that fundamental aspect and create (slightly) broader core lists.

I don't think that mini availability should be an issue for deciding wether or not to do something, but i realise i am a tiny minority there and am happy to go with the flow

_________________
AFK with real life, still checking PMs

A lot of lists are "squatted" by absentee developers/idle champions and have been for years. Quite clearly they will never get finished. A number of other lists have never even been played.

_________________
Currently doing a plastic scenery kickstarter

I count 106 lists. Thats all official, approved, in developement, experimental and abandoned lists together i know of.
This also includes FOUR Space Wolves lists.
The majority are Space Marine and Chaos lists.

_________________
We are returned!
http://www.epic-wargaming.de/

This is a very interesting discussion, and some excellent points are being raised. It is clear that the process and community does need something of a 'jump start'. I almost wonder whether it would be worth putting all development on hold, and getting everyone to focus on a single suppliment encompassing a variant list for most core armies, hobby material, scenario design, etc as a single project that everyone can get involved in......

_________________
https://www.cybershadow.ninja - A brief look into my twisted world, including wargames and beyond.
https://www.net-armageddon.org - The official NetEA (Epic Armageddon) site and resource.

Not a bad suggestion.

But I think some blunt and responsible culling of idle army champions and even one or two ERC members would also help greatly. The community can't be led anywhere if half the "leaders" aren't "leading".

_________________
Currently doing a plastic scenery kickstarter

I think this could be great. Supplements are really visible signs that all the work done results in something.

Perhaps a supplement focused on the Eye of Terror or a Black Crusade? Chaos is definetly the most iconic army that isn't yet in a book. Chaos Space Marines, Cadians, Ulthwé, there's likely a Space Marine chapter hanging around too. Any way to get Orks involved?

I don't thank that forcing people to work on army lists they don't have an interest in will work.
Two year ago we hat Imperial Guard Month, Space Marine Month, etc. But this didn't stop developement of other armies.

As for supplements: I still have my Red Corsairs, Salamanders, Elysians supplement in my head. But i just aren't a good writer especially if i have to write the story in english.

_________________
We are returned!
http://www.epic-wargaming.de/

I agree that a 'review' of the current state of lists and development is probably in order, along with renewed commitment from ACs, etc.



I am not thinking of forcing anyone to work on a list if they don't want, but instead something like going to the Tyranid AC and saying 'I want a monstrous creature army list, that fits the background that I have written here and will be put against these lists, and here is a deadline.... please. This is a priority above other development in a small time window.'

We could also then set up groups for painting and modelling, terrain, scenarios/campaign within the background, battle report groups, suppliment layout and graphics, etc all with similar background and attempt to get as many people as possible involved in any way they wanted. I would be happy to steer this and tie it together with structure and background text, etc and co-ordinate development.

It would just be one project that everyone could get behind if they wanted, in some capacity which they considered their strength and would be another showcase for the game and development.

_________________
https://www.cybershadow.ninja - A brief look into my twisted world, including wargames and beyond.
https://www.net-armageddon.org - The official NetEA (Epic Armageddon) site and resource.