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skimmers and roads
zombocom
 Post subject: Re: skimmers and roads
PostPosted: Tue Nov 15, 2011 12:56 pm 
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Dave: We're in agreement on that, but the other issue is garrisoning; it specifically only refers to units with speed zero, not immobile...

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Evil and Chaos
 Post subject: Re: skimmers and roads
PostPosted: Tue Nov 15, 2011 1:05 pm 
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zombocom wrote:
Dave: We're in agreement on that, but the other issue is garrisoning; it specifically only refers to units with speed zero, not immobile...

Frankly the entire "0cm units may move 5cm when on roads" thing is an oversight in the rules, and not originally intended.

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AgeingHippy
 Post subject: Re: skimmers and roads
PostPosted: Tue Nov 15, 2011 1:12 pm 
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Evil and Chaos wrote:
zombocom wrote:
Dave: We're in agreement on that, but the other issue is garrisoning; it specifically only refers to units with speed zero, not immobile...

Frankly the entire "0cm units may move 5cm when on roads" thing is an oversight in the rules, and not originally intended.


Perhaps the FAQ should simply be ammended to state that units with a non-zero move get the road move bonus. Would that not remove the confusion surrounding 0 v immobile etc?
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Evil and Chaos
 Post subject: Re: skimmers and roads
PostPosted: Tue Nov 15, 2011 1:18 pm 
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AgeingHippy wrote:
Evil and Chaos wrote:
zombocom wrote:
Dave: We're in agreement on that, but the other issue is garrisoning; it specifically only refers to units with speed zero, not immobile...

Frankly the entire "0cm units may move 5cm when on roads" thing is an oversight in the rules, and not originally intended.


Perhaps the FAQ should simply be ammended to state that units with a non-zero move get the road move bonus. Would that not remove the confusion surrounding 0 v immobile etc?

It certainly would.

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Mephiston
 Post subject: Re: skimmers and roads
PostPosted: Tue Nov 15, 2011 1:23 pm 
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From the Master FAQ thread on these very forums

Quote:
Q: Can a 0cm move unit on a road claim the +5cm move bonus?
A: Yes and no. There is no clear distinction in the rules between 0cm move and truly immobile units. We recommend that units that could potentially be moved in an emergency situation, like field artillery pieces, be considered to have a move of 0cm. Truly immobile units such as a bunker in a scenario that has a unit data sheet should be considered as immobile under any circumstances.

A 0cm move unit would possibly benefit from the road movement bonus, allowing it to move 5cm per move. However, it may obviously not leave the road as it would then lose its bonus movement. Also, unit with a speed designated as “immobile” may not move, even on a road.

As always, if you anticipate any issue with this rule, for example you are playing Baran Siegemasters with many 0cm move units, go over it with your opponent during the 5 minute warm-up.
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zombocom
 Post subject: Re: skimmers and roads
PostPosted: Tue Nov 15, 2011 1:29 pm 
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Fine, but we still need an FAQ on the garrison issue.

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Mephiston
 Post subject: Re: skimmers and roads
PostPosted: Tue Nov 15, 2011 1:37 pm 
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How about these bits.... does any ground unit have a move stat of N/A or immobile?

Quote:
6.1 General Tournament Scenario

Q: Since a landed transport aircraft is a 0cm move War Engine, is it possible to garrison a loaded one, such as a Marine Landing Craft or Ork Landa?
A: No. 4.2 specifically states that aircraft must start off-board.

Q: Can a WE garrison?
A: Only if it has a move of 0cm or is part of a formation where over half the units are scouts.
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Evil and Chaos
 Post subject: Re: skimmers and roads
PostPosted: Tue Nov 15, 2011 1:38 pm 
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Quote:
Q: Can a WE garrison?
A: Only if it has a move of 0cm or is part of a formation where over half the units are scouts.

And therefore an Immobile War Engine may not garrison, whilst a 0cm War Engine may garrison.

I think RAW may have been taken a little far, here.

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zombocom
 Post subject: Re: skimmers and roads
PostPosted: Tue Nov 15, 2011 1:39 pm 
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Honestly, if speed 0 units can garrison and immobile ones can't, that's stupid and something Mephiston, as the FAQs/rules guy, should change.

For example, in Leviathan I need the Synapse Node to be able to garrison, but don't want it to magically move along roads.

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Mephiston
 Post subject: Re: skimmers and roads
PostPosted: Tue Nov 15, 2011 1:41 pm 
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Hence my question. What, if any, ground units exist that are specified as move immobile or N/A?

If all ground units have to have a move in cm, even if its 0, then we are covered?
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zombocom
 Post subject: Re: skimmers and roads
PostPosted: Tue Nov 15, 2011 1:42 pm 
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No, because as the other FAQ mentions, you can have things like bunkers (or synapse nodes) that should be speed immobile since they can't ever move. They should still be able to garrison though.

Another example would be the Deathstrike bunker thing in the Kreig list.

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Ulrik
 Post subject: Re: skimmers and roads
PostPosted: Tue Nov 15, 2011 1:45 pm 
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The Communication Bunker from Korps Grinda returns (war engine training scenario, main rulebook) is speed Immobile.
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Mephiston
 Post subject: Re: skimmers and roads
PostPosted: Tue Nov 15, 2011 1:49 pm 
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Well the krieg deathstrike can't garrison as it is immobile....which isn't all bad as it can't start on overwatch then!

So basically if the 0cm move FAQ was changed to say that any unit with a 0cm move, immobile or N/A speed stat doesn't gain the 5cm move?
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Evil and Chaos
 Post subject: Re: skimmers and roads
PostPosted: Tue Nov 15, 2011 2:02 pm 
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Quote:
if the 0cm move FAQ was changed to say that any unit with a 0cm move, immobile or N/A speed stat doesn't gain the 5cm move?

I feel that would be the most sensible solution. AFAIK the "can 0cm units move 5cm on roads?" question was never run by Jervis.

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GlynG
 Post subject: Re: skimmers and roads
PostPosted: Tue Nov 15, 2011 2:54 pm 
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Mephiston wrote:
So basically if the 0cm move FAQ was changed to say that any unit with a 0cm move, immobile or N/A speed stat doesn't gain the 5cm move?

I think that would be an excellent idea. Speed 0cm units being able to move, even on roads feels wrong.

It's also somewhat ludicrous considering the size and weight of some of the units - take the Krieg Earthshaker below, would it's 4-6 crew be able to push that all 14 tonnes of it along a road without their Trojan?

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