Is the AMTL list unbalanced then, or does it just need some specific practice against?

Because if it's the latter, there's only one way to get that experience.

Will the OGBM list compound the problem, or just lead to most people getting a little more expereince against titan lists, so an AMTL is less of a shock when on the table?

It's not unbalanced. Playing against formations that are as tough to kill as Titans takes a different mindset, one based on objectives and maneuver rather than assault and killing things. In other words, it's probably a good experience overall; these concepts are useful against any other army too, but the mindset is not always one that is easy to adjust to.

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SG

Ghost's Paint Blog, where everything goes that isn't something else.

and if you're keen on keeping a new players interest, making them lose their first few games while they're adjusting to that mindset is a pisspoor way of going about it.

when i said "titan list" i meant any titan based list. that means AMTL, OGBM, ETC, and DBT (or any of the chaos titan lists. of those, the one i would first introduce them too would be either AMTL (probably the most thoroughly playtested of the lot) or OGBM (while quite possibly the toughest of the lot to crack, the fact that void shields come back, and power firleds do not, means that the big mob will give players a sembelance of progress taking down the DC, not worrying it will recover. definitely would want to make a whacky options-heavy OGBM army though, taking a maxed out baseline gargant army will not be conducive to fun for most people, let alone a newbie)

honestly though, the best way to ease them into fighting a titan list, would be getting them to fight a 'light-engine'-centric build, like minervans or skitarii, where they will learn to fight vehicles they can reasonably kill, but probably cant kill all of them, so they'll learn to prioritise limiting objective access over just killing stuff

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~Every Tool Is A Weapon, If You Hold It Right~

Just wondering, I've often thought that an all-engine list is very likely unbalanced against a balanced list as it's totally invulnerable to AP fire and BM/assault resolution kills. Plus, battle titans aren't nearly as vulnerable to isolate-and-destroy tactics as other expensive formations, slightly mitigating the activation disadvantage. But I've only played against such a list this time, so perhaps it gets better as you go?

QFT.

Of course it gets easier as time goes on and you learn the tricks but it's still not very balanced for the reasons you've listed above.

Heh, we've had some similar experiences at our club to yours, Ulrik. One of the guys play the AMTL and does it very well, but after a couple of games and advice from Taccom I've sort of found a way to beat the titans (although it hasn't happened yet ). Patience will get a long way as well as chosing your battles wisely.

Our community startet up 2 years ago and we still give people intro games. Many of these guys are experienced wargamers, so leniency is not always necessary, although we had one guy giving an intro game a couple of weeks after he played EA for the first time. He took the Eldar titan list against a novice who played his biel tan list. Perhaps not the best introduction to the game

Pitting balanced list against each other, especially Codex Marines, Orks or Steel Legion, usually gives good games in our experience, but then again EA offers so many tactical possibilities, that playing a cheesy list sometimes will end up being a disadvantage.

Held og lykke med jeres næste turnering!
Thomas

And here I thought I replied on how all Titan lists can be frustrating to play against, be those Imperial, Chaos or Xenos. I see my error and will use the appropriate thread if I have comments on the Eldar list.

OT: Ulrik, you've already been given very constructive advice on how to deal with the ATML list. Patience and guile is key

I'm just happy to hear about your budding community and wish you well in your endeavors Good luck! PS a couple of us Danes have talked about going to the next Gothcon. They run an EA tourney. It could be loads fun meeting up with fellow Scandanavian EA gamers.

Eldar Titan list is wayyyyyy more OTT than the AMTL list, though.

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Oooh nice. I'll definetly try to gather up a group to go over there! There are already some boardgamers who travel to Gothcon, we could tag along with them. Gothcon seems like the ideal spot for a Scandinavian meetup.

As for the AMTL, personally I'm looking forward to meeting them again with my Necrons - a few tricks like actually using most of my activations on turn 1 might help! But I'll ask if they can stay out of tournaments, at least until most of us has played a game or two against them outside tournaments.

Agreed! I haven't played against it yet, but met his 35+ falcon eldars. He' a notorious power gamer and fielded a 60+ gun wagon ork horde in our last tourney, losing one game and winning the other.

Funny thing about power gamers is they usually whine a LOT when losing. This guy managed to whine for almost a full hour after beating the mentioned ATML player, very amusing to us others Not so much the ATML player

AoC was simply asking for any feedback you may have. Hard data on the ETC list is still very scarce and any input is appreciated. It's difficult to balance a list with so little data to support change.

He was not implying you were taking the thread OT or anything.

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SG

Ghost's Paint Blog, where everything goes that isn't something else.

AoC

My sincerest Apologies for misinterpreting your comment as overly sarcastic. I think my day just started badly with hot coffee spilled on hand as I was running for the train

We've actually talked about pitting the ATML against the fir iolarian many times, but since my phantoms and warlocks arent painted, it has sort of been all talk, no play. If we get a game going sometime in the near future, I'll make sure to post any comment in the etc thread.

Rgs
Thomas

All titan lists are definitely beatable, but not anything like the 'normal' lists we tend to play and face. I think every generalist list should be certain to include some moderate to long range MW or TK shooting units. Their simple presence forces the war engines to kill them, no titan list can allow things that reduce or ignore their armor to be in range when the shields go down.

And shields are the least of your worries if you have any AT at all. Personally I play IG so I have piles of tanks that just murder titans with the one two punch of stripping shields with Russes and then putting down the titan hard with Shadowswords or Deathstrikes. The most useful part of Deathstrikes is they can often make up their points even if they don't get to shoot, anyone who wants to keep their WEs has to kill them ASAP and that means giving up the maneuver advantage.