I certainly didn't find the EUK Blood Angels underpowered at britcon - 3 wins, 2 draws, 1 loss, 2nd overall

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Yeah, but you're actually good at the game, unlike me, so your innate skill can overcome other factors. :-)

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Isn't that part of the point though? In the hands of a less experienced player (or in my hands) they may well do worse - but that doesn't mean that the list is underpowered per se.

I hope others are sufficiently encouraged to take the Blood Angels to other tournaments so we can build up some more objective stats. Don't forget that part of the reasoning behind the UK championship is to provide an objective measure of the way the various lists perform against each other where all other conditions are as consistent as possible.

I was only being 33.3% serious. :-)

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I can't see any way that the blood angels list is better than the codex list really.

It'll probably still do alright in tournaments, since the codex list does very well with certain builds.

I never claimed it was better but it has options which are very useful which the Codex list does not have - death company, 6 strong assault formations, which make up for the lack of devastators. At most it is only a couple of % below the Codex list which, in experienced hands, is probably the strongest list.

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Totally not gonna debate this in a "hello guys!" type thread. :-)

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Please do! Information is power and all that. I might even learn something if I think carefully enough!

Okay then. :-)



Break it dowwwn!


Are Compulsory, and somewhat overpriced considering their abilities.

Compare their stats and price point to Terminators, and they're a much worse option that hits less hard, isn't as resilient, can't teleport, can't firefight or shoot at range... for a discount of just 50pts.

Add to that the removal of Devastators (Why? BA are a Codex Chapter with just as many Devastators as a Chapter like the Ultramarines) from the EUK BA list, and the change to the size of the Assault formation, means that the only formation type that can ride along with them in a Thunderhawk is a Scout formation (Which, while not completely terrible, is a lot worse than bringing a second Assault formation along for the ride as with the Codex list).

And you have to put them in a Thunderhawk or a Landing Craft to be sure of getting any use at all out of them (They can't shoot or firefight really so starting them on the ground would be inferior).

Basically, they're a moderately powerful hammer unit (Not a sledgehammer unit like Terminators though) with a specific target profile (They should target small to medium formations with poor armour values and poor CC values) that can only be used to full effect once in a game (because giving them jump packs is too expensive, making them cost the same as a Terminator formation) as once they're on the ground they'll be too slow to reach CC a second time.

So IMHO, having to take the Death Company in that list is a drawback, not a benefit. Their special note about ignoring BM's when Engaging is neat, but I can't see it getting much action as the formation is small enough (And can have nothing worthwhile to ride along with it in a Thunderhawk) that its first Engagement will likely see it denuded below "threat" level, meaning you likely won't actually want to Engage with it twice.

Maybe Jump Pack-equipped EUK Death Company are as good as Terminators, but I doubt it.


Which fit awkwardly into the Thunderhawk, meaning you'll not be bringing as much power to bear in your air assaults as a Codex list (Which can bring on more units per Thunderhawk with a more flexible combination of formations and character upgrades inside it).

I don't see how having an awkward formation size that restricts your combat power makes up for the complete removal of my favourite Marine formation type.*


* I freakin' love Devastators. They're pimp.

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Yes, the DC and Assault formations are drawbacks for wanting to be a Blood Angels player.

To me the a list is as much about what it can't do as to what it can do well. Many people have expressed and even more extreme view that the 'color coded' chapters are pretty irrelevant at Epic scale and producing lists is a waste of time and effort.

As ever you do what works for you, there are a multitude of available options out there.

Also, information may be power, but power corrupts.

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From using them the DC have been fantastic - they may not be as powerful as terminators but can still take down a warhound in an assault - 8 attacks on 3s and 1 MW, which is my primary size target for terminators as well, at britcon they killed 5.

Whilst they are not as powerful, though still good, as terminators they make up for this with extreme flexibility. Don't take jet packs and you can choose between drop podding, air assaulting or even rhino deploying them when seeing the enemy list.

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Ah, so you take the Chaplain upgrade, making them the same price as a Terminator formation.

I can see a Warhound type Titan as being a good target there. Small formation size, moderate armour, plus not the best CC ability meaning you'll likely only lose 1 unit at most in the Engagement.

I'd still rather have the 4 attacks on 3's and the 4 Macro Weapon attacks on 3's that a Terminator fm would generate... as you can throw Terminators against Reaver-sized Titans, whereas in the same situation the EUK Death Company would get stomped down.

So the EUK DC aren't useless, but they aren't as good for their points as a Terminator formation, IMO.
A "drawback" to wanting to paint your guys red at EUK tournaments, as Dave puts it.

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Ah, but a real fan paints them orange!

It's a choice and nothing to stop you using red marines with the codex list. Or even blue marines with the Blood Angels list, but that may cause some players heads to spin off their shoulders

It would be very, very rare that I would send terminators after a reaver-size target. For teleporting against SM, Eldar+ BL it is too much of a risk for the strategy roll, air assaulting and I'd only want to do it with support, no AA coverage and then, of the DC6 WEs, only against the reaver. terminators v reaver size is too much of a risk IMO.

DC are just as effective, if not quite as powerful, for the level of targets I'm going to be sending any air assault or teleport against and, as I said before, have greater versatility.

6 strong assault formations actually make the unit viable -whereas I doubt I would consider taking a standard assault formation (always with a Chaplain), as they can actually be sent, on their own, against warhounds+SHTs.

As has been said before the devs were dropped to make the BA fight more in the BA style rather than, as with many lists, having all the codex bits+extra bits+extra rules.

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