Played a 5k game vs Man of Kent today and a few things came up in our game we weren’t sure on:

You can overwatch at SM when they drop pod in as they must immediately disembark from their drop pods and this can trigger overwatch, yes?

SM scouts drop podded nearby to two of my units, both of which were on overwatch. Ryan said because he had landed within 10cm of me and I was now in his Zone of Control I wouldn’t be able to overwatch fire at them because overwatching is a special form of shooting action and the only form of action you are allowed to do if you are within 10cm of scouts is to move away or to charge them. Was he right? I was dubious as this would seem to make scouts a bit good / potentially abusable, but we went with it.

Related question then; if my Deathstrike Silo (or any other move 0cm/immobile unit) had activated in a 10cm Zone of Control of enemy scouts, what happens? It can neither charge them nor leave. Can it activate to shoot as normal or can it not do anything for it’s action?

My Marauder that'd just bomber his Warlord happened to be nearby to a tactical detachment that Ryan wanted to collect up with a Thunderhawk. In doing so he flew within the 15cm AA range of the Marauder’s 2 heavy bolter shots, would it get to fire at him? Ryan thought not as the Thunderhawk wasn’t actually intercepting the Marauder, was he right?

If you double move, spending the entirety of both moves within a large piece of area terrain, do you have to take a dangerous terrain test for the move? Or one for each move within it? (they started in the terrain so didn’t need to test for entering it)

I am going to take a stab on these however I am sure others may have a differing opinion:



No. It is the end of the battleship movement and not part of the dropped Marines movement, so they do not enact overwatch as they have not finished a move.



This would be a correct use of the rules other than the fact that normal scouts (as far as I know), cannot use drop pods . This is probably the reason for that.



Good question. I would say it cannot do anything. Silly I know.



That is also a good question. I would say yes as it would act as Flak. You do not fly in front of enemy aircraft if it can be avoidded



If it is two seperate moves (as in a double), and they have to test for dangerous terrain as a stand, then yes, once for each move.

Hope this is all correct and helps

Cheers...

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As it cannot move away, it must attempt to Engage the Scouts in order to clear away their ZoC.


If it fails to activate, I believe it must 'Hold' and then use its Hold action to attempt to move away.

Obviously it will then fail to move away, and effectively do nothing, but at least it attempted to move away!  

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Disembarking from pods can trigger over-watch.

Scouts are no longer allowed in drop pods, and the rules about ZOC and movement are triggered when the formation activates. As the over watch formation has already activated (to go on over watch) they get to shoot without moving. So even if the scouts having podded put the over watching formation in their ZOC the over watchers can shoot.

The silo would have to engage.

If the thunderhawk lands or ends it move in range and fire arc of the bomber then it gets to flak, moving through the fire arc does not trigger the flak.

Not sure on the terrain, I'd need to look that up.

You can overwatch when a unit completes a move OR unloads troops / disembarks though and it's the latter I'd get them under. The SM drop pod rules state the SMs must immediately disembark when it lands. They may move activate properly themselves later, but I'm pretty sure the rules indicate you can overwatch them at the point they land, but this wasn't the way MoK read it initially so wanted to check here.

Thanks for taking the time to reply!

Good point with SM Scouts not being able to use Drop Pods, I'd forgotten that got changed.

The Thunderhawk did end it’s move landed within the Marauder’s 15cm range, yes, so it would have been able to fire then.

The DS needing to Engage, or failing to move on a failed activation, does make sense. I hadn’t looked at DS stats in detail, hadn’t realised it had a FF attack, let alone 3 x 4+. That’s pretty good.

Thought I was right on the still being able to overwatch thing as the action had already been taken. Were it not like that you’d get scouts rushing in close to things a hell of a lot more.

It's not undefended, there's guys inside firing Heavy Stubbers out at attackers!  

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Drat - others got there first, but I got the quotes  


A good set of questions.


Disembarking does trigger OW, but planetfall does not. From the 2008 FAQ

No this is NOT correct. A formation in an enemy ZoC has restricted activations, but firing a formation on OW is not an activation so the formation may blaze away. Indeed, you could have foolishly dropped into range of several formations on OW, each of which could then use their OW firing simultaneously on your unfortunate troops. Spot on Meph about the scouts not allowed in Pods


As other have said, it must either move away or engage the enemy. The best option if possible is for you to use other friendly formations to break the enemy, whereupon your Death Strikes are then free to use all their activation options.


IMHO Ryan is correct here. The Marauder's AA capability can only be used in self-defense against enemy that are attacking it. See 4.2.3 and 4.2.4



Briefly you must make a dangerous terrain test when you start in DT or when you enter DT (see 1.8.1) - so if you happened to make a double move entirely in DT, you would have to make 2x terrain tests (and are likely to come a cropper as a result ) However, you may move cautiously (5cm only) allowing a re-roll, and you automatically get a re-roll if you have the "walker" ability

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Go Ginger  


Sure for Planetfalling units generally, but specifically Drop Pod rules state you must immediately disembark from the not real unit they are once the Deathwinds are done.


That is what happened, though I would have rather used one of the formations within the Zone of Control to overwatch the scouts as I could maybe have used the other formation that fired in to target something else better instead.



I recognise now it is 2 and am fine with that but 4? Unless something’s been errata-ed you take dangerous terrain tests when entering difficult terrain or starting to move when already in difficult terrain, nothing about ending your move in there. I couldn’t move cautiously either as this was my Artillery Company BTS which broke and had to flee two moves worth away to get away from the nearby drop podded in Scouts. Pity I’d not known they weren’t meant to be able to drop in these days.

One other one: on broken troops the rulebook says “Units with a speed of 0cm obviously cannot move when making a withdrawal, so are destroyed if there are any enemy units within 15cm at the point they become broken.â€Â

. . . and since you must disembark from the Drop Pods, that is when the OW trips in. Note however that this is after any Deathwind attacks have taken place, whittling down the potential impact of the OW fire by suppressing at least one unit.

Yup you are right and I edited this before you replied

Wow.

I think everything has been answered, but...
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Disembarking triggers OW.  Since SMs must disembark from Drop Pods, they always trigger.  As Ginger points out, Deathwind attacks happen first and may impact the available OW fire before the marines actually disembark.

ZoC does not prevent OW fire.  The OW formation must move out when it next activates but it doesn't stop the current OW.

0cm move units in ZoC only have the option of Engaging.  On a failed activation it does nothing (it "attempts" to move away, but that obviously won't happen).

Aircraft only get to fire at other aircraft if the targets end their move in range/arc of AA shots.  They don't get the "fly by" attacks like ground flak.

Dangerous terrain should be one check per move (1, 2 or 3, for single, double, march).

Broken troops with 0cm move can be transported with a Withdrawal move.  Note that if there is not enough transport capacity, some will be left behind and, per 1.7.4 Formations, they are destroyed.  Out-of-formation destruction causes a BM on the rest of the formation.  Since the formation is broken, that BM will cause yet another casualty, meaning that attempting to retreat 0cm move field artillery can really suck.  As Jervis's quote in the Siegemaster FAQ, "life can be hard in a siege regiment."

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Neal

Unless you're moving through multiple "areas" of dangeous terrain with a single move, then it would be one test per area.

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Neal

I seem to have been playing dangerous terrain wrong all these years! I've been testing for going in and going out, so if you do both in one turn 2 tests. However to check if I double and end the first move in dangerous terrain do I count my second move as starting in dangerous terrain and therefore still end up with 2 checks?

Yes.

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