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New Epic Supplements
Chroma
 Post subject: New Epic Supplements
PostPosted: Mon Jun 09, 2008 2:46 am 
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(Moscovian @ Jun. 09 2008,02:07)
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Chroma, is the final count going to be 4 armies then for the Black Crusade?

Four is most likely the number of the counting, not five, not three, unless proceeding to four...

It's remotely possible that something like the Space Wolves 13th Company might make it in or another Space Marine variant list, but not much work has been done in that direction.?

1. Modeling sections?

Yes, plus scenery section.
2. Painting sections?
Yes, for all armies involved, even if I just have to do them myself!  *laugh*
3. Fictional story?
Yes, though it will most likely just be a "retelling" of the Eye of Terror fluff.
4. Scenarios?
Not sure about this yet. Swordwind didn't have scenarios, Raiders did.  The Eye of Terror is a pretty big area to cover with scenarios, but I will definitely think about it.
5. Are the other champs involved?
Both Chaos Champions are on board, while I'm looking after Ulthwe and the Cadians, hopefully with TRC's support.
6. Are you going to try to include the 13th Company or other lists?
This is still up in the Warp at the moment.

Maybe I am (more) blind but I really haven's seen much on the Cadians or Stigmatus lists.
Cadians haven't seen much testing outside my group of players.  The Stigmatus list is just the 'real' name of the Lost and the Damned army list.

Thanks for your input!

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Reaver
 Post subject: New Epic Supplements
PostPosted: Mon Jun 09, 2008 10:47 am 
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While AMTL is still the one I most want to see, I'm definitely leaning toward and Eastern Rim / Damocles gulf style supplement.

It should ideally have Tau, Nids, and Ultramarines in it, and be set just before the 13th Black Crusade.

I know that Ultramarines should really just be Codex Marines, but I see this as an opportunity to fix the SM list without actually having to get changes made to the original list.
So the points could be re-costed, maybe Termis limited in number, etc.

That would give us 3 lists for which there are already models (albeit in some cases OOP).

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blackhorizon
 Post subject: New Epic Supplements
PostPosted: Mon Jun 09, 2008 11:15 am 
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If any supplement needs some Battlefleet Gothic feedback (scenario, model pictures, etc) I be willing to cooperate again with you Epic people.

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Moscovian
 Post subject: New Epic Supplements
PostPosted: Mon Jun 09, 2008 11:48 am 
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I really see the Tau community split as a significant problem for putting the Tau in a supplement though, regardless of which side of the fence you may stand.  If that can be hammered out it would be my choice to see them in the next supplement.  It's not like the Necrons which everybody KNEW were overpowered.  For Tau, many experienced players believe there is nothing wrong with the list other than needing a few tweaks.  I'll post more on this on the Tau thread that recently came up so I don't derail my own topic. :p

With the Eldar titan legion added in as well would be a great mix.
I thought of that too.  AMTL, OGBM. and Lugganath would be interesting to throw together thematically.  Although I tend to be big on the justification behind the storyline and I don't see those three realistically coming against each other (two yes, three not really).  Besides (and I may be in the minority) but I was under the impression that the goal of AMTL and OGBM was to make the lists compatible with regular Epic armies.  By classifying them in one supplement all by themselves you've really isolated them in a sense.

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Chroma
 Post subject: New Epic Supplements
PostPosted: Mon Jun 09, 2008 12:13 pm 
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(Moscovian @ Jun. 09 2008,11:48)
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Besides (and I may be in the minority) but I was under the impression that the goal of AMTL and OGBM was to make the lists compatible with regular Epic armies. ?By classifying them in one supplement all by themselves you've really isolated them in a sense.

I really have to agree with Moscovian here!

Despite the thematic similarities, I don't think it's a good idea to lump all the "war engine" lists together in one supplement; much better to see them fighting "normal" forces to give a feel of their power and purpose, than just a "Titan SMASH!" game.

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Evil and Chaos
 Post subject: New Epic Supplements
PostPosted: Mon Jun 09, 2008 12:29 pm 
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I AGREE.

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Mephiston
 Post subject: New Epic Supplements
PostPosted: Mon Jun 09, 2008 2:14 pm 
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I think I prefer the idea of 3 or 4 different races per supplement rather than the codex race approach.

The only exception could be the many different Marine variants (BA, DA etc) that could be grouped together if they don't fit in a "campaign"?
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Tiny-Tim
 Post subject: New Epic Supplements
PostPosted: Mon Jun 09, 2008 4:47 pm 
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What I'd like to see is

Army Books

Black Crusade - Black Legion, Stigmatus Covenant Cultist and Ulthw? Eldar
(Plus Cadians if we want to create more work for ourselves)

Hive War - Tyranids (Phase IV), ?Iyanden Eldar and AMTL.
(Again plus Catachans if there is the desire)

So I pretty much agree with Chroma.

Black Cusade only needs the bones fleshing out as I would be happy to see BL and LatD reissued with the proposed existing tournament changes and Ulthwe has laid dormant in a semi complete state for a long time and only really needs some final playtesting to try and see if there are some killer combinations which need to be designed out.

Hive War would need firm grip taking of it, Nids need to be finalised. I was happy with them a year ago, but we suddenly had three lists and everything went up in the air again. Iyanden needs testing, testing and testing just as AMTL.

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nealhunt
 Post subject: New Epic Supplements
PostPosted: Mon Jun 09, 2008 5:01 pm 
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Hmm...  I'm trying to recall the original long-term goal and what was supposed to be in which supplement but it's been too long. Personally, I think there are a lot of cool ideas in here.  For personal preference, I?d say?

Black Crusade - BL, L&D, Ulthwe, Cadian (and possibly 13th Co)
Hive War - Nids, Iyanden, Marines (Ultramarines or Lamentors, possibly Ordo Xenos or Catachan)
The Greater Good ? Tau, Imperials (my Tau history is lacking - didn't the first Tau excursion run into Orks for another army option?)


I'd also like to see (names are just for fun):

The Fall of Gryphonne IV (per E&C) - AMTL, Tech Guard, Nid (possibly phase III - "hordes versus WEs")
Mean and Green - OGBM, Catachan and Dark Angels on Armageddon (Catachan in the jungle belt and there were 3 DA successor chapters present)
Drifting the Void ? Black Templars, Alaitoc
Heretics - Alpha Legion, L&D, Daemon Legion, Inquisition

For smaller ones:
Eldar versus Slaanesh/Emp Children
Space Wolves versus Thousand Sons

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Evil and Chaos
 Post subject: New Epic Supplements
PostPosted: Mon Jun 09, 2008 5:17 pm 
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I'm trying to recall the original long-term goal and what was supposed to be in which supplement but it's been too long


Black Templars versus Necrons?


The Fall of Gryphonne IV (per E&C) - AMTL, Tech Guard, Nid (possibly phase III - "hordes versus WEs")

My concept here was to do a spin on the 'nid list to make it reflect Hive Fleet Leviathan rather than the Hive Fleet Kraken of the Hamman's world list.

Mostly that just means dropping some of the bio-tanks, changing others to being Carnifex variants, and adding the Malanthrope... it was going to use the same base rules as the main 'nid list.

This is because it was HF Leviathan that attacked Gryphonne IV, rather than HF Kraken.

I've got a Leviathan units army list written but I never posted it online because frankly 'nid development has had enough going on already without further muddying the waters with my own proposed list (Actually it's a variant list rather than a main list, but still the world didn't need the hastle).




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Dwarf Supreme
 Post subject: New Epic Supplements
PostPosted: Mon Jun 09, 2008 5:31 pm 
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Well, I certainly would like to see Squats in a supplement. Maybe Squats vs OGBM or vs a specific clan, like Blood Axe which would provide an opportunity to include konvershuns of looted 'umiez equipment.

I like the idea of AMTL and Skitarii vs. Tyranids. It would be nice to see somewhere an Eldar Titan legion, also.

In general, I agree with the idea of grouping armies thematically in a supplement.

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BlackLegion
 Post subject: New Epic Supplements
PostPosted: Mon Jun 09, 2008 6:07 pm 
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Yes definately:

Eye of Terror:
Black Legion, Stigmatus Covenant Lost and the Damned, Ulthw? Eldar and Cadian Shock Troops

Gryphonne IV:
War Gryphons Adeptus Mechanicus Titan Legion, Skitarii, Hivefleet Leviathan Tyranids

And...crap...just realised that Red Corsairs would fit perfectly in Epic: Raiders :D

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nealhunt
 Post subject: New Epic Supplements
PostPosted: Mon Jun 09, 2008 6:08 pm 
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I'd be okay with OGBM v demiurg/squats if a consensus list develops.

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Evil and Chaos
 Post subject: New Epic Supplements
PostPosted: Mon Jun 09, 2008 6:12 pm 
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Neal:

You could easily add Speed Freaks to that mix too... and call the Supplement 'Warlords'.

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Moscovian
 Post subject: New Epic Supplements
PostPosted: Mon Jun 09, 2008 6:21 pm 
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Neal, you've been volunteered. ?If anyone was going to lead an OBGM supplement it would be you. ?And I think the Squats/Demiurg consensus is pretty achievable. ?The biggest hang-up is the name (ePilgrim hates me right now for bringing it up AGAIN) and I think that can be dealt with in time. ?That supplement could give the Speed Freaks a home and have a fun feel to it as well.

EDIT
And...crap...just realised that Red Corsairs would fit perfectly in Epic: Raiders.


NOW you say something!  We could have conceivably printed a book longer than Armageddon.




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