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E:A Rise of the Dracon

consectari

Post subject: E:A Rise of the Dracon

Posted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 1:17 am

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Vermis: This is the point where I pull on the reins and clam up for a few days

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!! ?

That's really not necessary. ?

We are making great progress, thanks mostly to your work. ?

We are approaching concensus on most subjects. ?

Debate is lively, civil, and most of all productive.

The background gets better and more detailed every day.

I know we're along way from anything usable, but I like what's happing here.

Not that I'd ever ask you to neglect your own projects, but if you have time you want to devote to this, I don't think anyone wants to stand in your way (well maybe those Necron players) ? :;):

I know I don't and it was my idea to begin with. ?

You're the man with all the info!

Well, if you NEED to take that step back, those of us that remain will continue on and be here when you decide to return. ?

I'd keep an eye on us if I were you, so we don't screw it up ?(give them lizards an ice homeworld or something).

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orangesm

Post subject: E:A Rise of the Dracon

Posted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 1:52 am

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First off I like both of the sketches. Agree that the top is too tall and should be squashed a little and made wider. Probably the 40 mm base as the base to build the pyrmiad off off.

For way the army plays. Army requires units to coordinate attacks. Units will have odvious strenghts and weaknesses. Really shooty units are horrible at CC, lightly armored units are fast, etc. The army has lots of variety but all the units have to support each other, an isolated unit will easily be defeated by taking advantage of its weakness.

Does that give us a good idea of the feel of the army - united it is strong but divided it will fall apart against armies like Imperial Guard or Orks.

For background we I think are going for Space Lizardmen as the core of the army. They have developed their own technology to fill in where old one technology has fall into disrepair or a gap was left. The Lizardmen technology is based on the Old One tech but where once standard vehicles would have been skimmers they are now walkers. War Engines are the vehicles of the Old Ones themselves and operated by the Jakero, more serveants of the Old Ones. Lastly other units from some of the other races of Old Ones design.

Is that a fair summation? I also wanted to put out there where we are to answer dafrca hopefully.

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Post subject: E:A Rise of the Dracon

Posted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 2:34 am

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Thanks orangesm. ?I think that's a pretty accurate summary. ?

I can't begin to say how much I appreciate everyone who's contributed here.

I really don't think dafrca was looking for an answer as such. ?I'm sure he's read the posts and knows where we are. ?

He was just offering his input. ?Which is always welcome. ?

This is an open forum, we are guests here and he has as much right to offer input as anyone.

It certainly didn't appear to me that it was meant as criticism (well, maybe constructive criticism, but that's a good thing). ?

I really hope anyone who may have been offended (IF anyone was offended), will take another look at his post. ?

There is no reason we shouldn't consider the order in which we are doing things. ?Even the most experienced game designer can use outside input, this is the reason E:A is a "living rulebook". ?I'm always willing to consider that I may be making a mistake.

Instead of being defensive, I might suggest that taking that next step and fleshing out some units might give us a better idea of what works and what doesn't. ?Thereby giving us a clearer image of what should go into the background or army structure.

Sometimes the cart can go before the horse. ?Though, I can't say for sure if this is one of those times. ?We'll learn from our mistakes.

Remember guys, it's just a game.

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consectari

Post subject: E:A Rise of the Dracon

Posted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 2:58 am

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I really like Vermis' pyramids. Esp. the one on top. It has the right feel. I think is needs to be wider at the base, but I don't know if it needs to be shorter.

I don't see any reason we couldn't use a version of each as 2 different WE.

I'm currently pulling fluffy stuff of the various GW web sites and compiling it into a word doc for inspiration. If anyone is interested, I'll be happy to send it to you.

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Post subject: E:A Rise of the Dracon

Posted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 4:36 am

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More new posts transfered from our topic on the Temp. forum

Nerroth: Well, there is a reference to just such a race in the Necron Codex - with a scenario based on the Eldar defending the regressed children of the Old Ones (the C'tan's most favoured delicacy) from the wrath of the Yngir...

In terms of models, you could go crazy and use the Warmaster-scale minis... No reason to say that in the 40k universe the Skinks, Saurii and Slann aren't giant creatures compared to the Eldar or other such races!

(Thankfully, the current Warmaster Slann is a new model based on the 6th ed Warhammer figure - complete with floating chair!)

(sorry pic didn't survive the trip from the temp forum

)

Hee hee...

Gary

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consectari

Post subject: E:A Rise of the Dracon

Posted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 4:37 am

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And one more

Legion 4: Lizzy intell ... new W/D 319 has WHFB Lizzies outfitted with some Tau equipt. ! And they are Tau allies ! VERy Cool ! New ideas for Krays/Lizzies ! Kroot = Avian, Vespids = Bugs, Lizzies = Reptiles ! I think that covers it ! Air - Sea - Land ! Check out the new ish !

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Ilushia

Post subject: E:A Rise of the Dracon

Posted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 6:53 am

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Ok guys... Here's what I've got so far... I went through the DRM and Andreyada stuff and assigned stats based on what the model looks like and how I think it should work in combat... I think they work fairly well. Gonna need some good names. And I have NO IDEA how to price them. Right now I'm thinking that the formations should be self-contained with little (If any) possibility of 'mixed' formations of different types. Largely because each fills a very specific role in combat, I feel, and I don't think it'd be wise to let them mingle.

Prepare for spam!

Names: Legions of the Old Ones, Guardians of Life, Defenders of Sanctity, Masters of the Universe, Saviors of Creation.

Initiative: 2+, Old One vehicles are Initiative 1+

Strategy Rating: 4

"Born to Fight: All Saurus, Kroxigar, Saurus Guards and Kroxigar Assault Engines formations gain a +2 bonus to Rally checks at the end of the turn. This means that they will never have to test to rally unless Broken."

Regeneration: Models marked with 'Regeneration' trait regenerate 1 DC in each end-phase regardless of other conditions. Destroyed War Engines may not regenerate at all (It will take them longer then the span of the battle to recover to fighting capacity, though they typically will recover someday).

Battle Screens: Models marked as having Battle Screens have specialized warp shields around them designed to disrupt and turn aside even the mightiest of blows against their armored hulls. The vehicle gains a 4+ save against Titan Killer weapons, this save only applies to TK weapons however it may be taken in assaults and even when suffering crossfire. The save is never reduced for being hit by crossfire or sniper shots (It's a full 360 degree field with no weak points). Roll for each point of damage a TK weapon would inflict separately.

Slanni Mage-Priest.

Move: N/A. Type: N/A. Move: N/A. CC: N/A. FF: N/A

Weapons Range Firepower Notes
Warp Blast (15cm) Small Arms MW, EA +1
Lightning Strike 45cm MW4+ -

Notes: Character, Invulnerable Save, Supreme Commander.

Skinks (Kray Scouts)

Move: 15cm Type: Inf Armor: None CC: 6+ FF: 5+

Weapon Range Firepower Notes
Assault Rifles (15cm) Small Arms -
Grenade Launcher 30cm AP6+/AT6+ -

Notes: Scouts.

Chameleon Skinks (Upgraded Kray Scouts)

Move: 15cm Type: Inf Armor: 5+ CC: 5+ FF: 4+

Weapon Range Firepower Notes
Assault Rifles (15cm) Small Arms -
Sniper Rifle 30cm AP 5+ Sniper

Notes: First Strike, infiltrate, Scouts.

Saurus (Kray Med Infantry)

Move: 15cm. Type: Inf Armor: 4+ CC: 5+ FF: 4+

Weapon Range Firepower Notes
Sun Guns (15cm) Small Arms -
2x Machine Gun 30cm AP 5+ -

Notes: None.

Saurus Guards (Kray Guards)

Move: 15cm. Type: Inf Armor: 4+. CC: 4+. FF: 4+.

Weapons Range Firepower Notes
Crescent Blades Melee Assault -
2x Heavy MG 30cm AP4+/AT6+

Notes: None.

Kroxigores (Kray Heavy Infantry)

Move: 15cm Type: Inf Armor: 4+ CC: 4+. FF: 4+

Weapons Range Firepower Notes
Sun Guns (15cm) Small Arms -
2x Multi-Rockets 45cm AP5+/AT5+ -

Notes: None.

Kroxigore Assault Machine (Velite Walker)

Move: 25cm Type: AV Armor: 3+ CC: 3+ FF: 5+

Weapons Range Firepower Notes
Power Mace Melee Assault MW, EA +1
Heavy MG 30cm AP4+/AT6+ -

Notes: Walker.

Light Battle Walker (Verger Walker)

Move: 15cm Type: AV Armor: 3+ CC: 6+ FF: 4+

Weapons Range Firepower Notes
Plasma Missiles 45cm AP4+/AT5+ -
Ion Cannon 45cm AP4+/AT4+ -

Notes: Walker.

Battle Walker (Vorace Walker)

Move: 20cm Type: AV Armor: 4+ CC: 6+ FF: 3+

Weapons Range Firepower Notes
Heavy Ion Cannon 75cm AP4+/AT4+ -
3x Twin Heavy MG 30cm AP3+/AT5+ Forward Fire Arc

Notes: Reinforced Armor, Walker.

Support Walker (Varan Walker)

Move: 20cm. Type: AV. Armor: 5+. CC: 6+. FF: 5+.

Weapons Range Firepower Notes
Heavy MG 30cm AP4+/AT6+ -
Calliope Gun 60cm 3BP Indirect Fire, Slow Firing

Notes: Walker.

"Light" Old-One Tank. (Aurika Light Tank)

Move: 25cm. Type: AV. Armor: 4+. CC: 6+. FF: 5+

Weapons Range Firepower Notes
Warp Cannon 75cm MW4+ -

Notes: Skimmer.

Field Teleporter (Gara Transporter)

Move: 25cm. Type: WE. Armor: 4+. CC: 6+. FF: 6+.

Weapons Range Firepower Notes
2x Machine Gun 30cm AP 5+ -

DC 3. Critical: The Warp Field on the teleporter overloads, the vehicle takes an extra DC and every other model within 2d6 cm takes a MW hit on 5+.

Notes: Skimmer, Reinforced Armor, Thick Rear Armor, Fearless, Regenerate, Battlescreen, Teleporter.

Teleporter: The Field Teleporter carries a warp-matrix allowing it to pull nearby formations to itself over a distance. Only one formation per turn may make use of the teleporter. When a formation with at least one base within 30cm of the Teleporter activates, if that formation is made up entirely of Infantry, then it may take an action which allows a Move and use the Field Teleporter as it's starting point for movement of all units in the formation. Effectively the formation is re-deployed from the Teleporter.

Old-One Missile Tank (Arka Medium Tank)

Move: 25cm. Type: WE. Armor: 4+. CC: 6+. FF: 5+.

Weapons Range Firepower Notes
Vortex Launcher 45cm 3BP Ignore Cover, Disrupt, Indirect Fire

DC 3. Critical: The tank's Fire-Control system is damaged, it may no longer Indirect Fire. Any further criticals inflict an extra DC instead.

Notes: Skimmer, Reinforced Armor, Thick Rear Armor, Fearless, Regenerate, Battlescreen.

Old-One AA Tank. (Gerresh AA Tank)

Move: 25cm. Type: WE. Armor: 4+. CC: 6+. FF: 4+.

Weapons Range Firepower Notes
2x Twin Warp Gun 30cm MW4+ -
OR 30cm AA4+ Macro-Weapon

DC 3. Critical: The Anti-Grav engines are temporarily damaged. The Vehicle moves 1d6cm in a random direction then stops. If it contacts a piece of impassable terrain it takes an extra 1DC of damage and immediately stops. If it comes into contact with an enemy stand it stops immediately but does no further damage.

Notes: Skimmer, Reinforced Armor, Thick Rear Armor, Fearless, Regenerate, Battlescreen.

Old-One Heavy Battle Tank. (Arkalesh Heavy Tank)

Move: 25cm. Type: WE. Armor: 4+. CC: 6+. FF: 4+.

Weapons Range Firepower Notes
Warp Demolisher 75cm 2x MW 2+ TK(D3)
2x Multi-Rockets 45cm AP5+/AT5+ FxF Arc

DC 6. Critical: The Warp engines of the tank are damaged, the vehicle takes an extra DC and every unit within 2d6 cm takes a MW hit on a 4+.

Notes: Skimmer, Reinforced Armor, Thick Rear Armor, Fearless, Regenerate, Battlescreen.

Flying Temple

Move: 20cm. Type: WE. Armor: 4+. CC: 6+. FF: 3+.

Weapons Range Firepower Notes
4x Battle Heads (15cm) Small Arms MW, EA +1
Eye of Slann 120cm MW3+ TK(D3)
OR 120cm AA4+ TK(D3)
Wrath of Old 60cm 4BP MW, Ignore Cover.

DC 8. Critical: The ancient powers which hold the vessel aloft are overcome for a brief moment. The Temple drifts D6cm in a random direction, if it comes into contact with impassable terrain or an enemy base it stops immediately. At the end of this move every unit (including the Temple!) within 5cm of the temple takes an automatic MW hit as the temple crashes to the ground. The repair systems onboard will fix the damage before the vessel's next move.

Notes: Skimmer, Reinforced Armor, Thick Rear Armor, Fearless, Regenerate, Battlescreen, Transport (May carry up to 16 of the following: Skinks, Chameleon Skinks, Saurus, Saurus Guards, Kroxigores, Kroxigore Assault Machines or Light Battle Walkers. Kroxigore Assault Machines and Light Battle Walkers take up 2 spaces each.)

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Vermis

Post subject: E:A Rise of the Dracon

Posted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 9:46 am

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Con: don't worry - I'm not about to go off and become a hermit, or something.

Just taking a step back.

Like I say, I think I needed it. I was fully aware that I was spewing a lot of random ideas with little thought to establishing the basics. And when it comes to that - well, it's your baby.

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consectari

Post subject: E:A Rise of the Dracon

Posted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 2:58 pm

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Vermis: don't worry - I'm not about to go off and become a hermit, or something. Just taking a step back

Good to hear it. Just chime in whenever you feel ready.

well, it's your baby

While it was my original concept, I have no control over GW intellectual property.

Furthermore, if I had the familiarity with the Lizardmen background and E:A rules to do it on my own, I would have.

By coming to this forum and asking for help, I've allowed anyone who offers input to become part of a team effort.

I'm no longer the only one with an interest in this. It's yours and Ilushia's, and orangesm's, and anyone else who makes a contribution. All I meant when I said it was my idea, was that no one had the right to stand in your way on this project.

If it had been someone elses idea they could take their toys and go home and we couldn't stop them. Of course, we could also continue with our own ideas. I would expect anyone interested enough to do the same, if for some reason I quit participating.

Ideas are welcome, and we should take them all seriously. If in the end, if we decide to do something in a less organized or "right" way, we're allowed to do that.

Thanks for everything you've done Vermis, we'll be waiting for all the ideas you'll be accumulating. Since you aren't happy with the Rakkat riders, maybe you could take this time to scuplt us a nice cavalry piece!

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consectari

Post subject: E:A Rise of the Dracon

Posted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 3:05 pm

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I would like to make my position clear on this army list. I have specific ideas of what I think it should be.

That in no way indicates that if I hear a better idea, I won't change my position.

I was pretty set on ground vehicles until the idea of all walkers was presented. This was so distinctive and fit so well with the army that I jumped right on board.

I personally don't like the concept of the "fat toad", but if the army can include more than one leader option so that I can pick something I do like, I'm fine with that. I try to be as flexible as possible without completely caving in.

Every army is going to have things that you like and things that you don't. I'm enough of an adult to accept that. Also every army has multiple options, so you don't HAVE to take those things you don't like. That's one of the reasons I like this game.

Thanks

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Ilushia

Post subject: E:A Rise of the Dracon

Posted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 3:38 pm

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For the leader: Possibly a Saurus Scared-One? Or whatever they're called. The old and beaten Saurus guys, they can lead armies in WHF, and would seem like the more 'Normal' supreme commander. The guy who takes to the field in standard battles, while the Slann reserves themselves for battles of utmost importance.

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Post subject: E:A Rise of the Dracon

Posted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 3:47 pm

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OK, enough hugging and sobbing. Back to the fun stuff!

Ilushia's stat work:

I like alot of what you've got here. This is some good work.

That said, I'm going to pick it apart.

Masters of the Universe

?

Yeah, yeah, you have the power.

Don't forget orangesm's suggestion "Servants of the Old Ones" this really hits the nail on the head!

In all my comments, please keep in mind, I've read the book a dozen times, played only 2 or 3.

Take them with a grain of salt as I don't know what I'm talking about.

Strategy Rating: 4

"Born to Fight: All Saurus, Kroxigar, Saurus Guards and Kroxigar Assault Engines formations gain a +2 bonus to Rally checks at the end of the turn. This means that they will never have to test to rally unless Broken."

Strategy Rating 4, I'm not sure. They are described as a bit slow to react, but are born warriors. 3 might be a better representation.

"Born to Fight" (Warrior-Born might sound cooler) This looks good. I like it.

Slanni Mage-Priest.

Looks good, will there be a skimmer and non skimmer version, or should they actual have diff. stats?

Skinks

I'd really like to see that 20cm move on the Skink (but not the Chameleon).
These are our FF troops. Is FF 5+ good enough? I'm asking because I really don't know.

After reading more fluff, I've decided I was wrong. Giving all skinks scout ability is more appropriate to the way they operate.

Saurus

These are our CC troops, their CC def. needs to be better than their FF. Maybe just switch the 2 stats.

Kroxogor

Using the model you suggested is fine, but even though these guys will be carrying BIG guns, they won't be good shots. FF should be closer to 6+ or at least 5+

They should be even better than Saurus at CC. If we switch Saurus to 4+, could these guys be 3+ or is that just too much (fluff wise, there aren't that many of them)? If not, then stick with the 4+. Any other way to represent good CC without actually lowering CC?

Voran

I HATE slow firing, but this may be a necesary evil. Otherwise, great!

The Kray light grav vehicles.

While I like the idea of the OO vehicles being WE, these things are small. Mine came in the mail yesterday and they are closer to Eldar Falcons than Eldar Wave Serpents. Heavier construction and design might justify DC2, but I don't know how DC3 will be accepted.

The larger Arkalesh should be fine with a much higher DC, though I don't have it, so some outside input might help. If we need another hefty WE, I'd suggest the Vertex.

Temple

Looks good

Overall, great work. Remember, to take my comments in stride. I'm no rules lawyer.

Thanks for your efforts

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consectari

Post subject: E:A Rise of the Dracon

Posted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 3:59 pm

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The old and beaten Saurus guys, they can lead armies in WHF, and would seem like the more 'Normal' supreme commander. The guy who takes to the field in standard battles, while the Slann reserves themselves for battles of utmost importance.

These are Oldbloods and I was thinking something similar. ?The only problem is, that the fluff specifically states they don't get any better at warfare as they get older, just more heavily armored. ?Of course it also states they lead troops. ?Is there a way to give them some of the Leader-like abilities (inspiring, etc) but non of the actual abilities that contain Leader?

Most of the leaders in WFB are Skink Chiefs and Skink Commanders, though they will only be in Skink formations. ?Of course, the skinks will need more help w/ blast markers as they don't have the "Born to Fight/Warrior-born" special rule.

Of course we could always just make a "young" Slann leader. ?Use the Kray commander model. ?Only has a few thousand years experience, not yet one of the great mage priests. ?Yeah, I like this idea.

2 Supreme commander options, the Slann Mage Priest (most powerful, most expensive) and the Journeyman Slann or Slann Neophyte (less powerful, slightly less expensive).

Input on this?

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orangesm

Post subject: E:A Rise of the Dracon

Posted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 4:20 pm

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I think the standard Saurus needs to have a lighter armor 5+. I do not see them wearing power armor but an additional layer of armor over their already tough skin. I think the Saurus Guards should have it.

I also think that the Kroxigoers need to be made more destitinctive from the Saurus.

The Light Battle Walker seems to be the heaviest battle walker in terms of speed and armor. Should it not be the fastest and lightest?

We could get the Saurus +1 Attack in CC to show that they really excel there. I may even get rid of long range weapons for them, not even small arms - make it so their is a real need for them to assault and coordinate it with other units to provide fire fight.

I think it should be made odvious what these units are for.

Saurus (Kray Med Infantry/Warmaster Saurus)

Move: 15cm. Type: Inf Armor: 5+ CC: 4+ FF: 6+

Weapon Range Firepower Notes
Sun Guns (15cm) Small Arms -
Star Blades (base contact) Assault Weapons Extra Attack (+1)

Notes: Cold Blooded (+2 Rally)

Making similiar changes to the Saurus Guards. And figure out where to take the Koxigoers

Light Battle Walker (Verger Walker)

Rename Infantry Support Walker to be renamed something else.

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Ilushia

Post subject: E:A Rise of the Dracon

Posted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 4:21 pm

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OK, enough hugging and sobbing. ?Back to the fun stuff!

Ilushia's stat work:

I like alot of what you've got here. ?This is some good work.

That said, I'm going to pick it apart. ?

Masters of the Universe

?

Yeah, yeah, you have the power.

Don't forget orangesm's suggestion "Servants of the Old Ones" ?this really hits the nail on the head!

In all my comments, please keep in mind, I've read the book a dozen times, played only 2 or 3. ?

Take them with a grain of salt as I don't know what I'm talking about.

Strategy Rating: 4

"Born to Fight: All Saurus, Kroxigar, Saurus Guards and Kroxigar Assault Engines formations gain a +2 bonus to Rally checks at the end of the turn. This means that they will never have to test to rally unless Broken."

Strategy Rating 4, I'm not sure. ?They are described as a bit slow to react, but are born warriors. ?3 might be a better representation.

"Born to Fight" (Warrior-Born might sound cooler) This looks good. ?I like it.

I like how it came out a lot too. The idea being that they spring back easier then others, but still suffer battlefield deterioration the same way. I wanted to avoid the free-leaders, because I didn't feel that was right. They're not really better then others at regrouping, they just do so more seamlessly and without the outside influence to lead them. SR 3 would probably be better. The idea behind SR 4 was that they'd usually be lead by a Mage-Priest and thus would have some fore-warning of enemy movements.

Slanni Mage-Priest.

Looks good, will there be a skimmer and non skimmer version, or should they actual have diff. stats?

Well... I had considered that. But in Epic the stand represents the ENTIRE unit, not just one guy on it. Originally I had considered adding 'Skimmer' to his line... But that didn't feel right. Ideally you'll have a stand with one Slann on his hover-dias and a set of Saurus Guards standing around him protecting him. The idea was that he'd only be able to be added to the Pyramid or the Saurus Guards.

Skinks

I'd really like to see that 20cm move on the Skink (but not the Chameleon). ?
These are our FF troops. ?Is FF 5+ good enough? ?I'm asking because I really don't know.

After reading more fluff, I've decided I was wrong. ?Giving all skinks scout ability is more appropriate to the way they operate.

Originally I had Scouts on the normal guys as well. As for these guys: I'm picturing them as your 'Rank and File' troops. You'll get lots of them, they're cheap, and they win by outnumbering the enemy with ranged attacks. They probably should be FF 4+ instead of FF 5+ but I didn't want to make them too good in an assault. They win by numbers, rather then individual power.

Saurus

These are our CC troops, their CC def. needs to be better than their FF. ?Maybe just switch the 2 stats.

Actually I was thinking the Saurus Guards would be the CC troops. The normal Saurus being more long-range. They carry heavier ranged weapons then the Skinks do, on average. While I realize in WHF that the Saurus are traditionally the 'Close hitters' for the Lizardmen, I just thought ?it'd be more appropriate to see them shooting at range under a more modern military style. They're stronger then Skinks and can carry heavier ranged weapons, after all. If others feel strongly on this I'll change it, but I like the idea that their non-walkers are largely shooty instead of smashy.

Kroxogor

Using the model you suggested is fine, but even though these guys will be carrying BIG guns, they won't be good shots. ?FF should be closer to 6+ or at least 5+

They should be even better than Saurus at CC. ?If we switch Saurus to 4+, could these guys be 3+ or is that just too much (fluff wise, there aren't that many of them)? ?If not, then stick with the 4+. ?Any other way to represent good CC without actually lowering CC?

We could add an extra attack to them and leave them at worse CC. That'd allow them more 'average' hits and more 'potential' hits while remaining relatively un-responsive. Are these guys really that much worse then IG at shooting though? IG Fire Support Teams have 2 Autocannons and FF 4+, these guys have two multiple-rocket-launchers and FF 4+. Plus these guys also have several Sun Guns, so it seems like it'd even out. Weight-of-fire over accuracy!

Voran

I HATE slow firing, but this may be a necesary evil. ?Otherwise, great!

Well... I was trying to figure out how to make these things feel right. They've got 9 huge gun-barrels on them, plus a machine gun. How do I convey that kind of fire-power without it being too good? I made it Slow Firing because I felt it'd work right. They put out lots of fire but they lose lots too.

The Kray light grav vehicles.

While I like the idea of the OO vehicles being WE, these things are small. ?Mine came in the mail yesterday and they are closer to Eldar Falcons than Eldar Wave Serpents. ?Heavier construction and design might justify DC2, but I don't know how DC3 will be accepted. ?

The larger Arkalesh should be fine with a much higher DC, though I don't have it, so some outside input might help. ?If we need another hefty WE, I'd suggest the Vertex.

Consider if these guys were 'Titan Scale' as almost every other war-engine in the game except the SHTs of the Eldar and IG are. Comparatively Knights Paladin are not much larger then Voraces as far as model-size go. And they're actually not that big compared to Land Raiders either, but they're War Engines. Warhounds are quite small, being only maybe 30mm high. Ask yourself: Would it feel right if all these models were actually half the size the fluff says they are, the way that all the other heavy WEs in the game are? I like them being DC 3, personally. But if you really want to drop back to DC 2 that's fine.

Temple

Looks good

Thanks. You'll notice that this is the ONLY transport they get currently. It's intentional. The idea is that they use the Garas instead. Rather then trucking around in unreliable transports which might plow into a tree or get shot down, they use warp-teleporters of Old One origin. And a huge temple with grav-systems. Cus it's just awesome to picture a ten-story building set down and an army pour out of it onto your doorstep!

Overall, great work. ?Remember, to take my comments in stride. ?I'm no rules lawyer.

Thanks for your efforts

Glad to hear you like them! These took... I dunno, maybe 2 hours last night. It was actually a lot of fun. They still need a few aircraft, I think. But that can wait. No comments on the Vorace's fire-capacity or the Arka's BP abilities?

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