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Hybrid Rules for Epic

 Post subject: Hybrid Rules for Epic
PostPosted: Wed May 14, 2003 5:28 am 
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No reason why you couldn't use TPS, as a basis for campaign rules.   It's all good ... - Legion-4


What is TPS?

While this system could be used for any terrain, it would be particularly good for a cityfight type scenario (like a Hive City), with different sectors having different major features (Imperial shrines, spaceport, Administratum HQ, Manufactorium etc etc) - Tas


Would you gentlemen further describe this sytem that you propose for urban combat?

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 Post subject: Hybrid Rules for Epic
PostPosted: Wed May 14, 2003 6:00 am 
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>Would you gentlemen further describe this sytem that you propose for urban combat?

Sorry, the propensity for acronyms slips through again:;):

TPS = Turning Point Stalingrad, an old but very good boardgame for the Battle for Stalingrad. Unlike many (most?)boardgames, TPS cuts the city into big sectors or chunks of a few kilometers each.  Many are urban, some industrial, some rural ones at the edge etc.  Players assign units to sectors and move them between adjoining sectors.  When opposing units enter the same sector a battle is fought

What I am advocating is that it is a mechanism that would be easy to convert and it is very convenient.  And I'm lazy and dont see why I should make up a new one if this works fine :D

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 Post subject: Hybrid Rules for Epic
PostPosted: Wed May 14, 2003 6:28 am 
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Tas, I'm being jammed by the Romulans !!! ?Sometimes, my primitive system can only read the quotes and no text !!! ?So I can't read your or Max's posts with the quotes !!! ?Damn MSN !!! ? :angry:

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 Post subject: Hybrid Rules for Epic
PostPosted: Wed May 14, 2003 9:00 am 
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>Tas, I'm being jammed by the Romulans

No buddy, it those bad dudes from Orangeland.  We keep killing them off and laying waste to their homeland every exercise, but they are always back next time.

This time they are obviously starting with an Information Operations campaign to lower morale by disrupting the EpiComms networks!!!! :angry:

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 Post subject: Hybrid Rules for Epic
PostPosted: Wed May 14, 2003 3:24 pm 
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Tas,

How does TPS then determine the actual composition of a type of urban plate?

Are their specific map plates for different industrial areas?

Thanks also!

By the way, this sounds a lot like the Epic-40k Terrain Generator, which I love. Those tables are wonderful and I've worked to get terrain to build wither the Forgeworld or the Agriworld already. Those are the two main types of worlds we play on. I want to build some others as well, but haven't gotten to it yet.

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 Post subject: Hybrid Rules for Epic
PostPosted: Wed May 14, 2003 7:54 pm 
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We use the E40K terrain generation system sometimes, Max, or just use it as a general guide. I do like it and I like building & modelling terrain bitz & pieces, as well. ?Taz, I will have my buddy decode the missing text, from you & Max. I e-mail it to him, his super computer, the HAL 9000, downloads it and sends it back. ?It's like waiting for the intell guys to decode enemy transmissions, then the commo guys, send it back and you try to figure out what to do with it. ? ???? ?Either that or it is the Romulans, Kitty's hair cut is very Romulan-like, she might be a sleeper agent ...

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 Post subject: Hybrid Rules for Epic
PostPosted: Wed May 14, 2003 11:20 pm 
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Quote (MaksimSmelchak @ 15 2003 May,00:24)
How does TPS then determine the actual composition of a type of urban plate?

Are their specific map plates for different industrial areas?

It doesnt- it point of the boardgame was that you shove the counters into the sector and the sector type will determine what modifiers apply to the combat resolution.

My idea is to utilise the TPS system to that point, then switch to Epic for the combat resolution.  Thus TPS is used for operational level manoeuvre

So no, there are no specific plates available, but that doesnt mean we couldnt put those together as well.  Which is what I was refering to (vaguely and incomprehensibly!) about having specific features, such as Imperial shirne, forge complex etc in that district.  Each could have morale modifiers depending on who holds that location, which then adds direction and purpose to the assault (ie why attack in this sector today?  It is the continued push to take the Rebel HQ in Secotr 7G which if captured will chop their morale in half etc).  

>It's like waiting for the intell guys to decode enemy transmissions, then the commo guys, send it back and you try to figure out what to do with it.

At which time you find that they were complaining about the food 3 days ago! :;):

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 Post subject: Hybrid Rules for Epic
PostPosted: Wed May 14, 2003 11:44 pm 
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Have a look at this:

http://www.games-workshop.com/40kuniv....map.htm

TPS will give you the mechanism to move between the different sectors, Epic gives you the battles within them

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 Post subject: Hybrid Rules for Epic
PostPosted: Thu May 15, 2003 12:28 am 
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My buddy decode your past posts, and as I said, that would be a good system to use as a basis; should be fun. And I see Tas, you have worked with Intell types before ! :laugh: ?What you don't know can't hurt you ... no but it can kill you !!! :laugh: ?And I'll update you about some of our other IA rules, as time permits and we are satisfied with them. ? ?I'm going to check out that map you sent ... Thanks ? :)

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 Post subject: Hybrid Rules for Epic
PostPosted: Thu May 15, 2003 8:05 pm 
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Hi guys,

I am posting this before reading all the comments, but I just wanted to say that Legion does focus on some of the better aspects of all the Epic games, and wondered if there wasn't a document made for it.  I'd love to start one if there is not, as I do have all the rulebooks for epic.

As far as Flyers though, anyone remember SSI's classic 'STEEL PANTHERS' pc game? God that was awesome for its time.  Anyway, there were aircraft in that game, but you were limited and they only conducted ground attack missions, and you had to assume that there were dogfights going on way above that were out of the realm of the land battle.  I think that is how Epic should be.  I don't mind Epic40k approach, but I think a complicating procedure for resolving dogfights that occur over several miles is beyond what is taking place on the battlefield.  Lets be honest, we like to say Epic is about massive battles, but it is really not.  More like a few companies on each side.  

Also, as far as Organizational Templates, I thought they were okay.  I wasn't crazy about the Space Marines. The one thing I really liked about Epic40k was the ability to create rag-tag detachments.  What a detachment should look like on paper is one thing, but during a campaign vehicles break down, get destroyed, units get absorbed, or commandered, re-grouped, etc.  I like that approach, but it can be a little overwhelming if you haven't set up your detachments before a game.  Some of the army lists did seem too generous though. SM1 was okay in presenting what should be, but I don't know if it was worth all the effort.  I do use the counters as a way of knowing what units make up a detachment, but that is it.  Except the Orks though, as you pretty much have to follow the rules for warbands.  SM2 simply make the game very quick to set up, choose your forces, and start playing.

I really like EpicA's approach with fixed formations with upgrades.  That way you do have a set system easy to build with, with the advatage of using units left in your bitz box.

BTW, how do u use blastmarkers in SM1?  I prefer just to leave them out in that sort of system.

Also, I just wanted to say this as i just stripped the paint off one of my Reaver Titans to repaint it and man is that a fine looking mini.  I think that model was the main reason I even got into AT/SM to begin with, but like other Titans in Epic, including the Reaver, nothing captures the gothic feel 40k better than that machine.  I love it.  The Phantom is great too, but the Reaver, size, detail, looks, is simply the best.  Forge World's version blows.

See ya.

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 Post subject: Hybrid Rules for Epic
PostPosted: Thu May 15, 2003 9:28 pm 
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Yeah, you have to love the Reavers- One of my favourite GW models- Jes Goodwin is the GW sculptor, IMO- his stuff (both Epic and 40k) is consistently fantastic, and has been so for many years, unlike some of their other sculptors which have come on tremendously in recent years, from being mediocre at best... :D

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 Post subject: Hybrid Rules for Epic
PostPosted: Thu May 15, 2003 11:59 pm 
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Hi!

THe original reaver is such a great model and it was easy to convert too. Its the only old style titan to still have the newer form looks like it. THe new warhound and warlord look totally different from the old gothic ones, and not for the better IMO.

Gandalf have you checked out Heresy II? I'm curious to have your input.

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 Post subject: Hybrid Rules for Epic
PostPosted: Fri May 16, 2003 1:21 am 
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Quote (Gandalf the Grey @ 16 2003 May,05:05)
I'd love to start one if there is not, as I do have all the rulebooks for epic.

[Flyers] I think that is how Epic should be. ?I don't mind Epic40k approach

Epic is about massive battles, but it is really not. ?More like a few companies on each side. ?

Also, as far as Organizational Templates.....

In order...

a) Please do- sounds great to me! :;):   I'm sure that would be handy for L4 as well in compiling his tome of knowledge

b) yeah...but I want to be able to buy fighters to keep the strafers off my back too.  Doesnt mean I want to play 10min aircraft only turns though

c) I think that depends on how many figs you have....your own body weight ?? :laugh:   And a spare basketball court for a playing area of course!

d) I agree that EA is a good mixture, but much prefer 2nd ed style templates over e40k mishmash.  e40k allowed you to construct totally customised detachments true, but they often bore no sembalnce of the overall flavour of the force.  I found that quite annoying

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 Post subject: Hybrid Rules for Epic
PostPosted: Fri May 16, 2003 6:21 am 
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Gandalf, save for the partial list of some of the rules we use, that I mentioned earlier (and Max was good enough to reformat), we have some in my buddy's P.C., some hard copy, and some hand written in my war room. So feel free, to collect and collate as you see fit. :D ?As far as how you organize your armies, that's all a matter of personal preference. ?The strength of the rules is activation and integrated activation (IA), what TO&Es you use don't really effect that. ?Off the top of my head, IA comes into play when : mounting & dismounting troops, calling in Indirect fire on board, calling in airstrikes and off board assets, and towing guns. ?In those four cases (and I'm sure there are a few others) two separate detachments are integrated to do a specific action. ?So when you look at those examples any TO&E, SM1 Templates, SM2 Cards, E40K lists and E-A Charts should work. ?You could still integrate Dogfights the same way Flak is, it is like Snap-Fire, it would occur as a flight is ingressing/egressing to/from a target. However as I said before, we decided not to go that way, it's your call. ?BMs work with E40K and E-A and we went to the E40K system to replace the SM1 Combat Results System and we may go to the E-A system to replace the E40K system. ?You could use BMs with SM1 but it would quickly become ungainly, so we never even considered it. ?Glad you all have shown an interest and I'll let you what's up as time goes on. Thanks for the input ... :D

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 Post subject: Hybrid Rules for Epic
PostPosted: Sat May 17, 2003 5:52 pm 
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Hey all,

Now that netepic is now back up could someone give me a link, or tell me where to find the home grown army cards - I can't seem to find them ?:D

Cheers

Chris

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