Gents
First of all thanks for the responses I am happy that we are getting some healthy perspectives for discussion. I will do my best to answer questions and queries you have but some I might have to leave for Tiny-Tim and or PFE100 depending their nature.
Ginger wrote:
Having skimmed the list, some comments
Spirit Wraithguard warhost
I do like the drop to 4 units with the option to add others They cost roughly 50-60points each if the earlier list is anything to go by, so 250 seems about right (allowing a premium for the higher activation capability). Lets try this at 275, but that may be a tad expensive. The reduced cost of the WraithLord may compensate, and I do like the idea of buying them individually
Ginger I agree with you here and I am maintaining an open mind regarding this comment.
Ginger wrote:
WraithBlade
Like others, I am a bit sceptical on WraithBlades. I am not sure why this was included in the first place, it certainly does not seem to be a good alternative to WraithGuard and there is no comparison with WraithLords. The main issues are the removal of MW and MW shooting.I also think the unit will prove very hard to balance, 40 points each is too high when compared with the WG and WL, and does not have any usefull synergies with other point upgrades as the rest of the upgrades work in steps of 25 and 50 pointsOn balance, I would recommend removing this unit altogether as an unnecessary complication.
Ok I hear you and recognise that the introduction of the WB is viewed by many with scepticism. I feel that they are worth exploring in the list and what they can potentially offer the list given the other restriction. Yes, they may be underpowered when compared to WG and WL but I felt that this was an appropriate place in which to test them before further adjustments. I am hoping to read some battle reports with them in before exploring further ideas of those adjustments, but I am happy to keep hearing peoples thoughts on them.
Ginger wrote:
I dislike animated construct. Hit and Run is a fundamental part of the Eldar list that should not be tampered with, and especially not in a single sub-list. Animated Construct also causes complications without really helping the game, and worse it is written as a 'negative' in that it takes away something unless a condition is present (Farsight). Finally, it is not something that could easily be applied to the Eldar formations as a whole, even if that were desirable (which it patently is not). Please remove this.
Your point is valid. However I would like to trial this rule as part of the list. Jim's post above is an accurate description of my own point of view. From my research into Iyanden it seems that people were either happy with the previous list or felt it was over powered, no one was stating that it was sub-par. I was concerned to hear and read that gamers in some groups were not enjoying their games against the Iyanden list, there could be a number of reasons for this but it is concerning none the less. This is why I felt it appropriate to explore some themed negative restrictions that captures the history and style of Iyanden. I stress that state of flux the list in presently so lets game test it.
Ginger wrote:
Spirit Wraithlord Warhost
Arguably a little too expensive at 350, especially if you are making them 50 points each elsewhere. Suggest that 325 might be more appropriateI am also unsure about making them a Warhost rather than a troupe, though I totally understand the reasoning which is the result of making the support troupes 1-1 with war hosts Warhost to troupe rationThe original list had a ratio of 1:3. Presuming that you feel this to large, I would recommend reducing the ratio to 1:2 rather than 1:1.
Yep, WL formations may be a tad expensive and I am open to see how they go, you could be on the money with 325. I do feel that WL belong in the troupe section for other craftworlds but not Iyanden, and yes it does help balance the one to one warhost to troupe ratio. On that topic of the one to one ratio, I don't feel the 1:3 or even 1:2 reflects the ravaged state of the Iyanden craftworld and skirts their dependence on wraith constructs. I am aware of the importance of having a delivery system for your WG/WB and Vampires come from WE, Wave serpents are an upgrade and Wraithgates don't count to the ratio. Its only Storm serpents that come into the ratio which leaves the remaining choices free to be used in whatever fashion a player wants to support their Wraith formations.
Ginger wrote:
Latest Eldar changes
I would be wary of adding the latest changes in this list, especially the reduced cost of the Phantom. I would suggest keeping in line with the various other Eldar lists, so that when / if these changes are approved, they can then be applied as a whole to all the lists. This approach also helps ensure that the list is balanced within the Eldar race as a whole
I am working with the other ACs and there will be a reflection of what happens in BT list for common units shared by the Iyanden list. I am sure Tiny-Tim and PFE100 could probably add more here.
carlisimo109 wrote:
However, I also had trouble finding it. It’s just a formatting issue – the list-specific “May not Garrison” special rule is there with a bold header on the front page, but the Eldar-wide special rules are in the back (with differently-formatted headers). I think a summary of the Eldar-wide rules would be helpful on the front page (just the rule itself, not the full-blown explanation and FAQ in the back).
Mate that's great feed back! I am keeping the formatting in line with the other elder lists however I will forward this on PFE100 and we will go from there.
Game test, battle reports, match results, After Actions reports I don't care what you call em, I just want them as they are key to moving forward from here
Anyone got plans to give the list a whirl over the weekend?
Cheers
Mic