Hi there

Time to take out those Empire models and put them to use on the Warmaster battlefields..
(one of four unpainted armies I have).

I have this and would like to build a 2000 pts. force:



I googled quite a while and couldn't really find good suggestions on what to include in the army.
I played a couple of times years ago so my knowledge is very limited..

Thoughts?

Cheers
Draccan

I'm pretty sure you can only have one war alter in the entire army, and you're limited to 1 steam tank/1000 points. Have you seen Dave's warmaster army selector? Check his sig on specialist arms forum. It gives warnings about min/max limits.

That said, at 2k I go for two units of cannon, and 2 of flagellants, as these come into their own at 2k. There are two routes you can take with most WM armies: realistic (IMO), in which you don't max out on cavalry, take a lot of halberdiers, crossbowmen, and hand gunners beefed up with skirmisher stands, and fight on a board with dense terrain; OR, unrealistic/power-game it with maximum knights and pistoliers, minimum infantry. This works especially well on boards without a lot of linear obstacles and terrain features. The latter way leads to madness and annoying threads about how powerful/broken cavalry is (again see the specialist arms forum). It would depend a great deal on the local meta game and attitude of the players.
DWWFY.

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Let us playtest like the Greeks of old... You know the ones I mean

Hmm.. my post disappeared....

Yikes I just realized I need a minimum of 6 crossbowmen for my 3000 pts. of Empire that I gathered.
And I have 2.

Anyways great input CaptPiett.
How many heroes and wizards (outside of the mandatory general) would you field for 2000 pts.?
And is the War Wagon and Griffons worth it?

My bad, I saw "2000 point force" and didn't see that the table was what you had available, not the force you generated. Yeah, crossbowmen are a necessary commodity, so maybe trade for them...

The alter and griffon are cool models and definitely paint one of each for your collection. The alter's effect is pretty minimal in-game, but 15 pts is really cheap, so it's hard to say it's not worth it. Chariot mounts can't go into dense terrain, so your wizard is more likely to get caught too far from a friendly unit and destroyed if contacted by an enemy, but that's the only downside to the alter I can think of. The griffon is expensive enough to take the place of 1-2 units though, usually players opt for increasing their breakpoint instead of taking one. It's terror-causing ability is pretty nice, that's why I'd include one in a collection so you have it on deck.

I'd max out on wizards and go with 3-4 heroes at 2k. If you go for a large army, you'll need all that command to move the horde around.

Here's Dave's selector app, by the way:
http://wm-selector.appspot.com/army_sel ... ist=empire

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Let us playtest like the Greeks of old... You know the ones I mean

Thanks man! That is helpful information.

And yeah I amassed a lot of stuff without thinking too clearly on what I needed.
I guess in the short run I can double my crossbow men by putting halbardiers in the back for a temporary measure and that way have a legal 2000 pts. army.

Should I bother with magic items? Which are worth it?
I expect to fight Chaos or Dwarfs for the battle.

How about something all round such as this (no Griffon, no War Altar, only 10 pts of magic items, only 2 heroes):


Empire Army, 2000 points
----------------------------------------------------------------
225 - 5 Halberdiers
195 - 3 Handgunners
220 - 4 Crossbowmen
140 - 2 Flagellants
75 - 3 Skirmishers
220 - 2 Knights
190 - 2 Pistoliers
50 - 1 Helblaster
170 - 2 Cannon
130 - 1 Steam Tank
135 - 1 General
- 1 Sword of Destruction (10)
160 - 2 Hero
90 - 2 Wizard
----------------------------------------------------------------
2000 - 22/11

While I am at it. Which ruleset should I play with? I have the main rulebook, but no annuals. (And I have the Warmaster Ancients, Ancient Armies and Medieval armies).. Where are the latest rules and FAQs needed?

That looks like a good list to me. You're likely to outnumber dwarves and chaos significantly. If you concentrate on absorbing/minimizing the effectiveness of your opponents hardest units (knights/warriors), and picking off the weaker ones, you should come out on top. I might drop a skirmisher, the helblaster, and a magic item and get a third hero. 22 units makes for a lot of brigades.

For magic items, the orb of majesty is a good one to have. Crown of command also is very effective, but quite expensive. The lessor ones are good for rounding out leftover points. They rarely are decisive in a battle. A big cavalry charge could very well be decisive, that's why the orb and crown are popular.

You could separate the crossbowmen into singletons, and spread them out amongst the bases. Add in some spare halberdiers, and you have pretty good conversions and enough crossbow units

I use the warmaster fantasy rules with the current FAQ. Unfortunately I have them printed out and am not sure where they are online. Ancients is interesting, but has some major differences. I've heard no complaints about it though. There are different stats too, and obviously no magical creatures.

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Let us playtest like the Greeks of old... You know the ones I mean

Thanks a lot!

I wonder how one absorbs an opponents units..

The PDFs up on the WM army selector are the latest. Everyone I've played uses those.

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Dave

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Usually by sacrificing a few units of halberdiers then you counterattack with your knights next turn.

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Let us playtest like the Greeks of old... You know the ones I mean

I am thinking maybe I should limit to one cannon and get a third unit of knights squeezed in...?

My view on cannon is to take two or take none. Some of your army is going to be slowed down protecting them (so make the battery worth protecting) and having them next to each other gives you the chance to do some serious damage if they're charged.

However, this type of thing depends on player style, IMO. Play a couple games each with/without cannon. If you find them hard to use, or unfitting of your playstyle, then you have your answer.

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Let us playtest like the Greeks of old... You know the ones I mean

I agree on cannon, two or none. If you don't do enough wounds to kill a stand, you are wasting your time.

Empire is all about holding the center with cheap infantry, while the knight crash flanks. Protect the general!

Magic items are not worth much, a griffon hero can be useful for playing against hard hitting forces like chaos and lizardmen.

My friend and I have extended the game to 3000 pts. And I believe it may be happening this weekend or next week.
It sounds like I should maximize cannons and steamtanks.