Login |  Register |  FAQ
   
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 86 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6

BLACK LEGION REVIEW - CHANGES TO TEST

 Post subject: Re: BLACK LEGION REVIEW - CHANGES TO TEST
PostPosted: Sun Sep 02, 2012 12:37 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Sun Aug 21, 2011 1:32 pm
Posts: 695
Location: Geneva, Swizerland
Rug wrote:
I didn't think BL was meant to have a narrow tactical theme, it's one of the core lists and as such is pretty flexible (as are Steel Legion, Biel-tan, codex marines etc). Surely a WE focus is more an Iron Warriors thing, there are other legions which should have more of a drop focus than BL too.



Yes many options. So why remove the WE heavy option? What is so wrong with the 6 WE list?

@Carlos: Our group plays with all of the lists. Whatever a player wants to play and has a list for. The general opinion though is that FERC lists are a bit funky and weird, whereas NetEA and EUK are easily compatible. People use FERC only when they have no skill in english whatsoever and try something new.

The issue here is that if NetEA BL loses its WE list abilities, considering Steve's position with EUK, this will probabaly spill over to EUK list too, removing the list option totally. I dont' think the choice is justified. I don't see the WE heavy list having such great resuslts that it should be considered imbalanced. Perhaops the Deicimator is a tad too awesome but that's it. A stat change over a list structure change would solve the problem and not make the WE heavy list disappear.

Now I've said my thing in like 15 different ways, and considering the OP's influence here I suppose there is nothing I could say more to change what is likely to happen. But my group really feels this is wrong, and a real shame.

On a completely different note, Frogbear is nice enough to consider some modifications of the World Eaters list. Within that work, it has rather clearly appeared that perhaps Khorne Berzerkers are a little underpowered for their point cost/weakest of the cult marines. Any chance that their CC be modified to 4 + EA +1, or even 3+ EA +1? This would be of absolutely no consequence to the BL list, but would help WE a lot. After all , why should zerkers be less skilled than Eldar Scorpions in CC?

_________________
"War is not about who is right, but about who is left". - B. Russell


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: BLACK LEGION REVIEW - CHANGES TO TEST
PostPosted: Mon Sep 03, 2012 1:08 am 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Sun Feb 16, 2003 8:10 pm
Posts: 2642
Location: Edmonton, Alberta
Evil and Chaos wrote:
Part of the issue with the Black Legion army list is that they didn't have anything like as tight a development process as most other lists. They ended up without a strong central theme and big imbalances and it's taken years of revisions to try and poke them into a better shape.


The CSM list suffered from a few issues.

1) a defining design goal that was never kept to
2) a rushed development cycle to hit a release date that never came about
3) the inclusion of WEs that were added because they seemed neat
4) a very acrimonious public beta that really wasted a lot of time
5) the added complication of having to balance daemons which were a PITA

The entire CSM list is a total clusterf*ck and the best option is, IMNSHO, to scrap it and start over

_________________
Guns don't break formations. Blast Markers break formations.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: BLACK LEGION REVIEW - CHANGES TO TEST
PostPosted: Mon Sep 03, 2012 6:59 am 
Hybrid
Hybrid

Joined: Wed Sep 28, 2005 8:35 am
Posts: 4311
LordotMilk wrote:

The issue here is that if NetEA BL loses its WE list abilities

How is it losing it WE abilities? No proposal to remove any WE from the list, at 3k you can still take 4 decimators or 3 ferals or 2 ferals and 2 decimators. It only reduces the maximum possible number

_________________
www.epic-uk.co.uk
NetEA NetERC Human Lists Chair
NetEA Chaos + Black Legion Champion


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: BLACK LEGION REVIEW - CHANGES TO TEST
PostPosted: Mon Sep 03, 2012 7:01 am 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Fri May 05, 2006 2:57 am
Posts: 20887
Location: Harrogate, Yorkshire
Quote:
On a completely different note, Frogbear is nice enough to consider some modifications of the World Eaters list. Within that work, it has rather clearly appeared that perhaps Khorne Berzerkers are a little underpowered for their point cost/weakest of the cult marines. Any chance that their CC be modified to 4 + EA +1, or even 3+ EA +1? This would be of absolutely no consequence to the BL list, but would help WE a lot. After all , why should zerkers be less skilled than Eldar Scorpions in CC?

Khorne Berzerkers are brilliant in the Red Corsairs list, where they can take a Thunderhawk. :-)


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: BLACK LEGION REVIEW - CHANGES TO TEST
PostPosted: Mon Sep 03, 2012 9:29 am 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Sat Aug 02, 2008 3:22 pm
Posts: 5682
Location: Australia
Just be be clear, Frogbear is fine with the Khorne Berserker stats - hell he created a whole list around them!

As for Berserker effectiveness frim a Thunderhawk, well duh! Not too much imagination there :P What we DONT need is another marine tactic list.

_________________
Frogbear is responsible for...
Previous World Eaters
Previous Emperor's Children
Previous Death Guard
Previous Imperial Fists
Previous Chaos Squats


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: BLACK LEGION REVIEW - CHANGES TO TEST
PostPosted: Mon Sep 03, 2012 9:32 am 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Fri May 05, 2006 2:57 am
Posts: 20887
Location: Harrogate, Yorkshire
Oi, the Red Corsairs list is bloody good.

_________________
Currently doing a plastic scenery kickstarter


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: BLACK LEGION REVIEW - CHANGES TO TEST
PostPosted: Mon Sep 03, 2012 9:34 am 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Sat Aug 02, 2008 3:22 pm
Posts: 5682
Location: Australia
No doubt. Just don't need another one as in World Eaters adopting it. ;)

_________________
Frogbear is responsible for...
Previous World Eaters
Previous Emperor's Children
Previous Death Guard
Previous Imperial Fists
Previous Chaos Squats


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: BLACK LEGION REVIEW - CHANGES TO TEST
PostPosted: Mon Sep 03, 2012 1:49 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Sun Aug 21, 2011 1:32 pm
Posts: 695
Location: Geneva, Swizerland
It is just a bit weird to have WE marines to be statted better than cult marines, just soi WE formations are strong enough in CC.

But I guess this is less a request than a design consideration, and therefore the question is the following: will/can the berzerker stats be changed in the foreseeable future?

_________________
"War is not about who is right, but about who is left". - B. Russell


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: BLACK LEGION REVIEW - CHANGES TO TEST
PostPosted: Mon Sep 03, 2012 7:11 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Sun Aug 21, 2011 1:32 pm
Posts: 695
Location: Geneva, Swizerland
Evil and Chaos wrote:
Quote:
On a completely different note, Frogbear is nice enough to consider some modifications of the World Eaters list. Within that work, it has rather clearly appeared that perhaps Khorne Berzerkers are a little underpowered for their point cost/weakest of the cult marines. Any chance that their CC be modified to 4 + EA +1, or even 3+ EA +1? This would be of absolutely no consequence to the BL list, but would help WE a lot. After all , why should zerkers be less skilled than Eldar Scorpions in CC?

Khorne Berzerkers are brilliant in the Red Corsairs list, where they can take a Thunderhawk. :-)



Why would you pick Berzerkers over Plague marines for that use?

_________________
"War is not about who is right, but about who is left". - B. Russell


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: BLACK LEGION REVIEW - CHANGES TO TEST
PostPosted: Wed Sep 05, 2012 5:05 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Sat Nov 05, 2005 12:13 am
Posts: 8711
Location: Leipzig, Germany, Europe, Sol III, Orion Arm, Milky Way, Local Group, Virgo Supercluster, Universe
Words like "brilliant" and "bloody good" give me the impression that the Red Corsairs list is overpowered.

_________________
We are returned!
http://www.epic-wargaming.de/


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject: Re: BLACK LEGION REVIEW - CHANGES TO TEST
PostPosted: Thu Sep 06, 2012 10:15 pm 
Brood Brother
Brood Brother
User avatar

Joined: Sun Aug 21, 2011 1:32 pm
Posts: 695
Location: Geneva, Swizerland
BlackLegion wrote:
Words like "brilliant" and "bloody good" give me the impression that the Red Corsairs list is overpowered.


Well it's really strong. When compared to the Black Legion, it is pretty much better in all respects.

It has weaker and less choice of Daemons, and has less WE options, but with the proposed changes to the WE options, even that is going down the drain.

Why use the BL list as compared to the Red Corsairs in your opinion?

_________________
"War is not about who is right, but about who is left". - B. Russell


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 86 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 4 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  


Powered by phpBB ® Forum Software © phpBB Group
CoDFaction Style by Daniel St. Jules of Gamexe.net