Really ? with a 16.66 % increase in armour, 16.66 % increase in Hits and 16.66 % increase in activating (meaning an even bigger increase in the hits percentage should be taken into account as the stormtalons will be activated more often over the course of games).

A 25 point increase looks too way small for me for the improvements but will they be a viable choice at a higher points cost.

Getting 16% better in everything wouldn't (logically) require going up more than 16% in cost.

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The Apocrypha of Skaros 1.1
Rogue Trader Expedition 0.4
The Horus Heresy 0.5
Night Lords 0.1
My Trade Thread

agreed. one aspect improving raises cost at the sqrt of the aspect. so the hits and weapons together take it to 204 but id bump it to 225 becuase of the int. we can always drop it later

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My shifting projects

That's completely illogical.

If you change two values the effect will usually add up, depending on what values you change.

Doubling the number of shots and doubling the to hit probability will not double your chances for a kill but quadruple it.

Doubling the save at the same time, will reduce your losses by half.

So doubling every value will not double the value but, restricting us to hits and losses, will be worth 8 times.

And where is a 16% increase ?

Going from 5+ to hit to 4+ to hit will change the probability from 2/6 to 3/6 that's an 50% increase in hits.

Not all values have the same importance and some values change their importance with the way they change (the change from 6+ to 5+ is more pronounced than that from 3+ to 2+).

I grant you that the importance of some properties is difficult to judge and that the importance of some properties changes with your opponent and battle situation,
but that an 16% increase in every feature will result in a 16% change of value is a misconception.

Regards
Stephan

No it's not, and you missed my point.

16% increases in every stat might produce more than a 16% overall increase in utility, yes. But a 16% increase in performance shouldn't (barring considerations like "well, you need only one of them instead of 1 1/6 of them").

What's being looked at here is the increases in effectiveness: i.e. the quadrupling you refer to. That's the stage being considered (not the raw stats). And at that stage, being 16% better at everything doesn't somehow make something more than 16% more valuable.

Example time!

If Unit A produces 1.0 hits and takes 1.0 hits to kill, and Unit B produces 2.0 hits and takes 2.0 hits to kill, Unit B is logically worth twice as much as Unit A.

A Storm Talon will produce 1 1/6 hits, vs 1 hit for a Thunderbolt. It can take 1 1/3 hits, vs 1 1/6 for a Thunderbolt.

That's a 17% increase and a 14% increase, respectively.

The increase in initiative may indeed create the effect you suggest, however. As might an increase in speed/maneuverability.



See, that's just wrong.

Let's say Unit A produces 1.0 hits and takes 1.0 hits to kill. Unit C produces 4.0 (quadrupling, as you say) and takes 2.0 (doubling, as you say) to kill.

It's not worth eight times what Unit A is. It can kill as much as 4 As, and take as much damage as 2. So (assuming other factors are equal), it's worth between twice and four times as much as A.

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The Apocrypha of Skaros 1.1
Rogue Trader Expedition 0.4
The Horus Heresy 0.5
Night Lords 0.1
My Trade Thread

Ok how do I link to a particular post in any particular thread?

I posted my thoughts in the Storm Talon thread.

the easiest way is to click on the pm button on that post, and copy the quote text out of the pm.

there is a faster way, but can't remember it.

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My shifting projects

Click the page icon next to the timestamp in the upper right of the post, and it will take you to a page with just that post. You can then copy the url as normal.

i.e. viewtopic.php?p=451517#p451517

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SG

Ghost's Paint Blog, where everything goes that isn't something else.