Yes, quite a few changes. I am still keeping with the 'no traitor' theme, but this time used:

Coven + Arch Heretic, Replace with Big Mutants (2), Land Transporters & Daemon Pack
Coven + Additional Cultist (1), Replace with Big Mutants (3), Chaos Altar & Daemon Pack
Coven + Replace with Big Mutants (2), Chaos Altar & Daemon Pack
Coven + Land Transporters & Daemon Pack
Infestation - Zombies
Subjugators (2) - BTS
Hellfire Cannons
Defilers
Defilers
Daemon Pool - Lesser Daemons (12)

Used BL Defiler profiles & costs. LatD still gor beaten up quite badly, but this time had the speed and range to cause more damage & the infestation helped disrupt the back line which had been untouched in my game against the Marines. Only faced a pair of Thunderbolts, which stayed clear of the Altars. Game was helped with the LatD recovering all their broken formations at the end of turn 2 and Ulani failing two activations in turn 3 to hold objectives.

Will probably continue with this list for a bit to see if it was just luck on the last game.

How did you find the Hellfire cannons worked for you btw? I have been having trouble using mine well.

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My EPIC and BFG Blog: https://epicaddiction.wordpress.com/

Not too bad. They garrisoned in cover on overwatch. LatD got first turn and they activated to shoot at a formation of Tank Hunters in cover. 3 hits, 1 dead Tank Hunter and the formation broke (further TH lost to difficult terraine test ) Return fire was limited as there were better targets to hit.

I tend to use the formation in a garrisoned position sat on overwatch and if they survive I snipe at small formations or use them to prep for another formation to engage. A steal at 200pts, but not a must take formation with Defilers having equal range and better CC/FF.

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FIFY.

And this is the purpose of this exercise, to see if the LatD can be effective without the need of key traitor units. Currently if I wanted to stop a Cultist army before it started I would make sure that they couldn't gain access to Hydras or Thunderbolts. Are there any other traitor units that you would say are key to the LatD list?

I find the traitor artillery to be exceptionally useful to the LatD

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My EPIC and BFG Blog: https://epicaddiction.wordpress.com/

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The problem is that this goes directly against the design goals of epic. Several, more focused lists, over one big do-it-all list. A list that can represent a traitor guard regiment, a cult that has risen up on a hive world AND an incursion from a daemon world is very unfocused.

How did that cult get Silver Towers? Why is the daemon world force using Hydras and Basilisks when the rest of the force is a chaotic mishmash of warped daemon engines and mutants who have lived directly under the chaos gods for millennia?

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Well I haven't decided that the list will be chopped up or not as yet, but I'm looking at options and giving it some tests. & I will repeat that it is what is lacking from a list which makes it interesting to play.

Two games played this weekend vs different Marine players one win, one loss (on points) Thoughts later.

I disagree with this. In the same manner, the possibilities contained within a wide-ranging list make it interesting to play for me, and much more interesting to collect.

If you want to play with a tightly themed army, just impose limitations on your own list building rather than changing the core list.

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My EPIC and BFG Blog: https://epicaddiction.wordpress.com/

So over this weekend I got two games in with the LatD. Both games were against Marine lists but with very different emphasises. The first game was versus a ground based force with 8 Land Raiders (acting as transports) and several Razorbacks and Hunters. Game finished after three turns with the LatD winning 2-0 with Defend the Flag and They Shall Not Pass. The game should probably have gone into the fourth turn, but my opponent was not aggressive enough with his forces to push me back.

Second game was against AgingHippy and his Marine force with a Warlord.... I was playing with a pair of Subjugators, which could have caused the Warlord some trouble, but was not prepared to leave them in a position to engage at the end of turn as they were my BTS and I didn’t want the Warlord firing on them. The game turned into a bit of a ‘Cat and Mouse’ with the LatD hiding behind or in cover and snipping at Marine formation which came in range whilst manoeuvring to stay away from the Warlord’s fire. I was playing with two Chaos Altars to give me a decent AA presence, but managed to fail a difficult terrain test with the first move of one of them only for AH to roll a critical and destroy it. Luckily only two further units were lost to the critical effect. The game went to four turns and ended 1-1. On points count back the Marines won convincingly as I had not been able to touch the Warlord and AH’s Thunderhawk and Thunderbolts, whilst most of my formations were down to half strength, broken or both.

Thoughts from the games: I really like the Chaos Altar and it provides a big boost to a coven, but as an AA platform it is really poor. For the cost of the two Altars in my list I can take 6 Hydras (Although more likely, I would take 3 Hydras and a pair of Thunderbolts.) Covens are given a boost by the increased summoning, focus & inspirational aspects, but Altars are not a substitute for Hydras.

Defilers are going to undergo a change from their current LatD stats & cost. My feelings at the moment to follow the lead of the NetEA BL list and use that profile although AgingHippy did note that he liked the EpicUK LatD stats & cost from our previous game more than the NetEA BL. I would like to hear some battle reports from others trying these stats out to help me make up my mind.

I'm afraid that I only go as far as dummy (pacifier for those on the other side of the drink) spitting or toy throwing & I need a new pram for that.