well i'd be quite happy to nerf the MG's stats even more in order to get it's price down to 950 - not quite sure how to do that mind... possibly have the belly guns as 5x Big Gun and instead of 8BM MW and the mega lobba as a separate line item with 30cm 3BM MW might be a start

not proposing any changes right now mind - should let the list stew as it is for a good while

so just confirming that the mega gargant is supposed to not have RA?

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~Every Tool Is A Weapon, If You Hold It Right~

Confirmed. I see it as bigger, but not nessesarily better armoured. That'll help us balance it.

Another option would be to give it RA5+.

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Currently doing a plastic scenery kickstarter

righto. good to know. it does dish out a truly spectacular amount of firepower

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~Every Tool Is A Weapon, If You Hold It Right~

Shudder at DC16 4+RA!

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It's only my opinion, but as an Ork player I really would hate to see the Mega Gargant nerfed to make it viable at 3k. As I see it the Mega Gargant should be, well, Mega. I'd rather see it as an powerful yet expensive unit (a la the Imperator) which fits into bigger games, rather than turning up on a frequent basis it what are essentially epic scale moderate sized clashes.

Bit like when I was a kid playing Warhammer for the first few times, and someone would turn in with Tyrion or Teclis in a 1k game, and you'd sit there thinking "Really? He's going to show up in this game involving about 30 models a side...?!"

Makes it a bit more 'special' then when you do get to use your big shiny* specical toy then.

That said, I would be happy to see the Mega Kannon subsumed into the Soopagunz category - I'm a big fan of simple and it would mean that the shots could be rolled in one go.
How much benefit is the extra 15cm to people who have used it so far?

Thoughts?

Cheers
Reedar


*paint scheme dependant, of course....

well i quite understand your point there Darren. Thing is, this is a tournament list - designed to be played at actual tournaments The only tourney here in the UK that goes to 4k is britcon. Therefore I'd say that if it can't be made to work at 3k it shouldn't be in the list at all and remain in the collectors models section for fun games.

Note it has been nerfed quite a bit, in order to get it down to 1050 points (loss of RA being the biggest thing - with various implications) and yet is still utterly terrifying (nobody wants to look at it in the eye). And even if we went so far as to bring it down to 850 points like a Great Gargant (extreme I know), well how often do you see those?

Really, I do agree from a fluff point of view though, Mega Gargants and Imperators really should take part in Mega-Battles.

[edit] I'd just mention that I believe even in a 4k game a sensible person wouldn't take it - but should rather take two or 3 cheaper formations instead. Despite our best efforts I think that the chances are that it'll only be taken 'for fun'

the shots are rolled in one go anyway aren't they? You can fire only one barrage - if the range is 75cm then you only use the 2 BPs from the Mega Kannon

if 60cm then you add the 2BPs from the MG to the 8BPs from the Soops giving you a 10bp barrage.

Fair enough, but you're working at cross purposes here. You are adding the Kustom options, but then making them very hard to take in any way except as a Big Gunz upgrade. I still think you'd be better off sticking to basic Oddboyz (or possibly normal + powerfield option).


I don't think you necessarily need the Gunwagons. The combination of Battlewagons and Flakwagons is perfectly fine for a mech infantry formation.

0-2 Fortresses is probably the most elegant option. That would allow either 2 Gunforts or Gunfort + Battlefort as all-fortress transport options (with Oddboy upgrades). I don't think you'd need to worry about any combination appearing in large numbers because they would be fairly expensive in a list that already has a lot of expensive formations.


I don't have any mechanical objections to the EUK-style powerfield oddboy if you want to try to include that. IMHO, the EUK version is simply not worth the points, though, so you'd need to look at that.

Quick question
to what units may an oddboy be applied and what upgrades can he confer to that unit?

Oddboys may be applied to:

- Big Gunz units
- Gunfortresses

Oddboys may take Kustom or Big Kustom upgrades.


KUSTOM UPGRADE EFFECTS:

- Gattling Kannon : Soopagun or Zzap Gun weapon is replaced with a Gattling Kannon
- Bigga Generatas : Soopagun or Zzap Gun weapon is removed, and the unit gains 2d3 Power Fields (yes, really!)
- Megalobba : Soopagun or Zzap Gun weapon is replaced with a Megalobba
- Mega Choppa : Soopagun or Zzap Gun weapon is replaced with a Mega Choppa. Unit's CC rating is changed to 3+.
- Supa Zzap Gun : No effect as Zzap Gun is already available to Oddboys.
- Snappa : Not available to Oddboys as it is only allowed as a replacement for Gargant Belly Guns.

BIG KUSTOM UPGRADE EFFECTS:

- Grot Guided Mega Missiles : Soopagun or Zzap Gun weapon is replaced with 2x Grot Guided Mega Missiles
- Transporta : Not available for Oddboys as it is a Gargant only upgrade.
- Wyrdboy Tower : Adds a Wyrdboy Tower to whatever unit the Oddboy has been attached to (For example, allowing you to have a Gunfortress with a Zzap Gun and and Wyrdboy Tower.


The next version of the list will allow you to add Oddboys to Battlefortresses too, but only if they take the "Bigga Generatas" Kustom Upgrade.

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Currently doing a plastic scenery kickstarter

thanks

when a kustom upgrade is applied to a gunwagon, does it replace one of the big guns, as with the standard ork list? or is it in addition to the gunwagon's big guns?

There are no gunwagons in this list. I assume you mean Gunfortress?

Yes, Oddboys replace a Big Gun when applied to a Gun Fortress.
You can then upgrade the Oddboy to change his Zzap or Soopagun into something else (Kustom or Big Kustom).

I'm just about to post the latest version.

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Currently doing a plastic scenery kickstarter

The new version of the Gargant Bigmob list can now be found here: viewtopic.php?f=83&t=22042

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Currently doing a plastic scenery kickstarter

awsome Ben, checking it out now