Decimators are very good, but they're limited by being slow, short ranged and having a crit that pops them. I'd take a Shadowsword at 75 points less, or Warhound at 50 points less, any day.

Costs of things:

Shadowsword - 200pts
Decimator - 225pts
Warhound - 275pts


Decimator has effectively a sawn-off Vulcan Megabolter, and a sawn-off Quake Cannon, on a SHT hull (Plus CC4+, for no reason I've ever been able to understand) with great initiative & strategy rating... it's massively better than a Baneblade (A better comparison than a Shadowsword since they're both AP biased tanks) for only 25pts more; They're a total bargain mate. :-)

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How about a mixed formation, some Oblit stands and some other stands? That way they can't teleport, and the other units can be real crap, kinda like you have to take ork boyz to get extra grots.

Blargh. My brain is cream cheese. I'm thinking 250, 325, 275. Got Nurgle Contagions/Plague Tower on the brain which explains the 325, but no idea where the 250 came from.

Barring the Baneblade's ability to reach out and touch at 75cm, Decimator is better than the Baneblade. But the Baneblade is generally regarded as undergunned and crappy to start with...

And with the point that I've got completely the wrong points value in my head for Decimator, the Demonic Artillery becomes even more overpointed at 350.

Only the EUK stat Baneblades.
The NetEA stat ones, which have been in use here for 4-5 years now, are fine, lovely tanks... but they still get made to look like toy tankettes next to a mighty Decimator.

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I don't think the teleport is the biggest issue. As they stand, a 4-pack would just be used to park on the Blitz, providing a Fearless, very shooty, flak bubble. Adding chaff to the unit just makes them harder to suppress/break.

Personally, I'd say an Obliterator teleport assault would be pretty thematic. They wouldn't be as good as the Terminators at it as they don't have any extra attacks or melee macro weapons (and cost more per base).

Wouldn't you teleport and use your high strategy rating to then sustain fire?

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Well yeah, but I'd rather take 6 hits (4 if I've got cover) from 4 Oblits which I can save against, compared to 2.7 hits I can save against plus 3.3 macro hits, which 4 Terminators (plus Lord) are going to average in base-contact assault. (And, if the Terminators sustain against infantry in order to avoid melee hits or overwatch, the better AP on their Reapers just about makes up for the 3 shots per Oblit, so I'm still liking the Terminators over the Oblits.)

The only real thing about using Oblits over Terminators to teleport is that if it goes wrong and the Oblits get broken, they ain't getting hacked down like keeps happening to my Terminators...

(I'm fairly comfortable that my numbers are right this time. *coff*)

If the Oblits have you in crossfire however, it'd likely hurt like hell...

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Ah yeah, I never remember crossfire. But, the Terminators can claim the same bonus if they're shooting.

I did forget to do the maths against vehicles. Ok, so AT, the Oblits are much better than the Termies:

Obs: 12 shots at 5+ down to 4+ = 6 hits.
Terms: 8 shots at 6+ down to 5+ = 2.7 hits. And half that if it's IW Terminators.

(For reference, against Infantry in the open:
Obs: 12 shots at 5+ down to 4+ = 6 hits.
Terms: 8 shots at 4+ down to 3+ = 5.17 hits.
IW Terminators: 8 shots at 4+ down to 3+ = 5.17 hits.

And against infantry w. cover:
Obs: 12 shots at 5+ down to 4+ up to 5+ = 4 hits.
Terms: 8 shots at 4+ down to 3+ up to 4+ = 4 hits.
IW Terminators: 4 shots at 4+ down to 3+ up to 4+ = 2 hits. Plus 4 shots at 4+ down to 3+ = 2.7 hits. = 4.7 hits. )

Standard Terminators + Lord in Black Legion is 275. The only differences between that formation and this are that there's a Heavy Flamer instead of one of the two Reapers, and that the Lord doesn't get the Sorcerer (Macro in FF) option.

I think the Siege Dreadnought should should just have a normal 3+ save (maybe for less points) and not reinforced armour; a W40k Siege Dreadnought only has very slightly better armour than a normal Dreadnought.

Otherwise looks good for what I can see.

RA 3+ is something like a 95% 90% probability to save IIRC. It should be applied only to the most incredibly hardened units IMO.

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8/9 chance, so 89%, compared to 75% for 4+ Reinforced.

Yeah, that's a bit too much for a Dread. The only thing I've come across in any list so far with 3+ RA is the wing-less Demon Prince in the CSM/LatD list. Even the Greater Demons are only 4+ w. RA + Invulnerable (79%).

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