It's a Big Universe ... I got G/W's Aliens & Humans , Stargates, Henges, Cthulu, Moai, Buddha, DRM Lizardmen & Andriods, E/W Stunties, Andriods, GZG Kra'vak, etc., etc. ... So who needs[just] G/W ?          

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Legion 4 "Cry Havoc, and let slip the Dogs of War !" ... "People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf."

I`m used to the specific Wh40k background/fluff and the aesthetic look of the established ( = official)unit types. So i want to collect, build and paint models which reflect that.
Non-GW models are a poor substitue for me (only EW has some decent Space Skeletons) unless they are scratchbuilds.

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We are returned!
http://www.epic-wargaming.de/

Well, I do have to agree that the guys reaction to the quotes from the "Red Book" were rather "emotional" rather then rational, I still have to shake my head at GW partices.  Like everywhere else they seem to be saying one thing, and doing something quite different.  

Their prices are my big stumbling block.  Why is it I can order enough infantry to fill out the better have of two companies of IG for about 1/2 of what I would be charged by GW for 1 company?  And the proxies are metal.  I just have to laugh when I go to the GW site and see what they are charging for some of their products.  

Another silly question.  Why can you you get the IG company pack for about $26 CDN, but the Stormtrooper pack is $24 for 8 stands?

As everyone says we have options.  Case in point just procured a pack of 3 Hydras and 3 Demolishers on ebay for less the $20 CDN each.  Not a huge savings, but what the hey!  And I will be looking into ordering somethings from DRM and Exodus Wars to fill in some holes.  Anyway to get around the Evil Empire.

Because the Stormtroopers are metal.

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"Good ale, the true and proper drink of Englishmen. He is not deserving of the name of Englishman who speaketh against ale, that is good ale."
- George Borrow

Well any of the DRM, E/W, GZG Humans would work for IG/PDF ...  E/W Khazari & Edenites ... well we know what they could be. There are a number of PA troops that could work for SMs. And the list goes on  ... IMO ...  

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Legion 4 "Cry Havoc, and let slip the Dogs of War !" ... "People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf."

With a few exceptions, like Tyranid infantry, most everything is still swimming about on eBay.  You are only going to need proxies/scratchbuilds if you want to customize your force or reflect new entries.

Getting a new army of "official" models together is anything but difficult and you need SG for next to none of it.  Heck, I threw out 4 full Epic armies (Doh!) and have rebuilt 3 of those with 2nd hand merchandise and scratchbuilds.

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WAAARGH!!
The Lost & the Dipped

But for how long? If SG goes, then it's going to be pretty hard attracting new players if they can't even get hold of a company of marines.

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Uti possidetis, ita possideatis.
May your beer be laid under an enchantment of surpassing excellence for seven years!
An online epic force creator: Armyforge

well, IMHO is that FW/GW is no needed to play epic, if they are with us ok , great, more minis more backgrount etc... but as L4 and other says, a lot of 6mm manufactures are doing a good work, all that we need is, background, statistics and play tests, we have a good sets of rulebooks ( netepic, E:A or seeds of war ), IMHO again... the ball is in our side and we must demostrate that we can develop, test and play anythig that we want without any trademark limitation, I'm sure that that in this forums are greater modelers, writers and testers to do this, hehee ...kick the ball and play in 6mm. We need us, not much more is needed.

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Riau!!!!! O_o!
http://elbansblog.blogspot.com/

I have begun to wonder how long GW (and others) will matter at all. With the advent of 3D modeling & printing it seems like the current GW business model has a definite expiration date - one that is probably not more than a few years down the road.

Right now some of these processes are cost prohibitive for the small scale operator and yet we have plenty of examples in this community and others that it can be done quickly an efficiently - probably quicker than a company like GW can manage from concept to realization in some cases. It's a given that as time goes by, the costs associated with these processes will go down as more people get involved. I imagine that 10 years from now this process won't be difficult or excessively expensive at all & we'll see a lot of "homebrew" miniatures & model kits. 3D printers are expensive today, but they won't be forever, like most technology these devices will become better, simpler, cheaper, and more readily available & consumer friendly as time passes.

When I see discussions about $10,000 stainless steel molds for plastic sprues I wonder what these cost 15 years ago and where those costs will be at in another 5-10 years. I also wonder how long before we can outsource this type of work easily to places where labor & production costs are already dramatically lower. My wife runs a travel business and the bulk of her sales are cruises and packaged tours, but she recently showed me a package to China that is designed specifically for people seeking to have goods manufactured there. The tour includes participation in a design & manufacturing expo, factory tours, and meetings with business reps from various manufacturing industries in China. I imagine a person could learn quite a bit about the process and costs involved with outsourcing a plastic sprue of epic scale miniatures to there.

I'm actually a bit surprised that one of these Internet Figure Painting shops based in China or elsewhere in that region hasn't started offering manufacturing services for small run miniature projects. Maybe my impression of the tech required is ahead of where it's actually at?

"Because the Stormtroopers are metal."

Really?  Ok, that explains that. Then we come back to the why can other manufactures make a set of minis which furnishes enough troops for almost 2 coy (in metal), and GW is supplying a platoon worth for about twice the price?

I don't know I may be chasing my tail here, but there were 3 main reasons why I didn't get into WH40k;

1) Price.  
2) The large WH doesn't allow for battles of maneuver.  All the 40k games I've seen turn into parking lots.  You have more freedom of movement in Epic, which I like.

I am not including anyone on this forum who might also be a 40k gamer in this next point.  Please don't take offense.

3) 40k players.  I find the majority of these guys are really annoying.  Probably because most of them are 13 year old power gamers.  

So, as I will never spend any money on the 28mm WH40k game is it not a boon to GW that they have a game set in the 40k universe that I am interested in and willing, occasionally, to drop some bucks on it?  I really don't see Epic as a main line competitor, but as another doorway to bring in people who might just be interested in the larger scale game.  Guess that is just me.

BTW:  L4 those are great scenics.

Frankly, I'd bet on Epic models being available for a long, long time.

Considering I can still get my hands on limited edition 1980s Citadel models and full Epic sprues from almost 20 years ago, I don't think there is much to worry about.  Heck, you get on eBay UK and there are an amazing amount of Epic listings.

People leave The Hobby, sell their stuff, it in turn gets sold a few years down the road etc; all of which happens outside of SG.

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WAAARGH!!
The Lost & the Dipped

That's true while Epic isn't growing significantly, otherwise SG shutting down is very bad news. I would like to see a thousand Epic players in every city (esp. Wellington   ).

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Uti possidetis, ita possideatis.
May your beer be laid under an enchantment of surpassing excellence for seven years!
An online epic force creator: Armyforge

Epic is better on life support from GW than totally withdrawn, of that have no doubt.

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Currently doing a plastic scenery kickstarter

Agreed - and there is absolutely no indication that life support is going to stop - beyond a slither of hearsay.

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www.epic-uk.co.uk
NetEA NetERC Human Lists Chair
NetEA Chaos + Black Legion Champion

I'm using the Konami Aliens Dropships for Stormtrooper Valkyrie proxies.

As you say excellent stuff and even with inflated "collectible" prices still a fraction of GW pricing.

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The Cheese! The Cheese!