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Black Legion playtest changes

 Post subject: Black Legion playtest changes
PostPosted: Sat Sep 06, 2008 11:42 pm 
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Quote: (pixelgeek @ 06 Sep. 2008, 22:37 )

Depends on how the rest of the rules would change as well.

If you aren't buying a Daemonic Pact and/or a Chaos Champion for summoning then having to buy cultists to mark the formation might be fun.

Depends on how far the rest of the list changes structurally. Upgrade slots are tight with the current summoning system so unless that was loosened somehow the requirement to buy Cult Marines would be a bit too much.

There is also the issue that you'd be asking players to pay for something they used to do for free so unless there was some give in the rest of the summoning system this would seem like a penalty compared to how it used to be done

Yes good point - I guess in the current summoning system cult marines could have a demonic upgrade automatically? So saving as it were 25 points for a formation and the upgrade slot?

So instead of paying points you are paying with your activation percentage (the more big formations around the less overall)?

Would also perhaps encourage more cult marines to the table beyond the obvious shooting choices.

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 Post subject: Black Legion playtest changes
PostPosted: Sun Sep 07, 2008 12:10 am 
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Quote: (The_Real_Chris @ 06 Sep. 2008, 15:42 )

Would also perhaps encourage more cult marines to the table beyond the obvious shooting choices.

Aside from Noise Marines and Bezerkers I don't recall seeing a lot of Plague Marines or Thousand Sons upgrades unless they are for character reasons.

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 Post subject: Black Legion playtest changes
PostPosted: Sun Sep 07, 2008 4:56 am 
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Quote: (pixelgeek @ 07 Sep. 2008, 00:10 )

Quote: (The_Real_Chris @ 06 Sep. 2008, 15:42 )

Would also perhaps encourage more cult marines to the table beyond the obvious shooting choices.

Aside from Noise Marines and Bezerkers I don't recall seeing a lot of Plague Marines or Thousand Sons upgrades unless they are for character reasons.

That's almost certainly due to the more readily available models for Noise Marines and Berzerkers.

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 Post subject: Black Legion playtest changes
PostPosted: Sun Sep 07, 2008 11:45 am 
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Quote: (pixelgeek @ 07 Sep. 2008, 00:10 )

Aside from Noise Marines and Bezerkers I don't recall seeing a lot of Plague Marines or Thousand Sons upgrades unless they are for character reasons.

That's odd, I (and another player who sadly quit the game) really liked thousand sons for that 4+ RA wall. Especially great on your BTS due to fearless.

And I'd go with plague marines over berzerkers anytime (unless for character reasons). Better save, better firefight, not as good but still pretty darn good close combat (which they might not reach anyway) score.


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 Post subject: Black Legion playtest changes
PostPosted: Fri Oct 24, 2008 7:16 am 
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bump

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 Post subject: Black Legion playtest changes
PostPosted: Fri Oct 24, 2008 11:52 am 
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I played a game with these revisions the other day with a Space Marine army, at 1500pts.

Turns out, the Black Legion is horribly overpowered at 1500pts... I'm shocked.  :))



I'll try and get a proper sized game in with them tomorrow.




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 Post subject: Black Legion playtest changes
PostPosted: Fri Oct 24, 2008 3:06 pm 
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Next you'll tell us you don't like the Tau list :p

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 Post subject: Black Legion playtest changes
PostPosted: Mon Nov 03, 2008 2:20 pm 
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Hi guys,

Got a game in with BL against Guard over the weekend. Whilst it is a pretty much agreed change, I would like to confirm the need to combine Assault Companies with Titan allotment.

I played with 4 Death Wheels, 3 Ferals, 5 Raptors, 3 Predators and 9 Land Raiders.

Game went to fourth turn with a 4-0 victory to BL having only lost 1 Land Raider and there only being five guard stands remaining. Void Shields & Reinforced Armour are great.

With regard to Defilers - I would like to see them remain at speed 15cm as this allows them to garrison, something that I have done with them in BL, LatD and Emperors Children armies.

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 Post subject: Black Legion playtest changes
PostPosted: Thu Nov 27, 2008 10:32 pm 
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Hi all.

Relative nwebie player here, currently running a Black Legion army, and looking to conribute to the list if possible.

I've played a fair few games now using the version of the list from the vault without the ammendments proposed here. However, I'm looking to test the changes over the next few weeks, assuming that my opponents agree :) . Great job on them by the way!

From reading through the proposed changes I do have a few thoughts / comments, obviously these are purely based on opinion so feel free to take with a pinch of salt.
Firstly, the Stalker, is this a unit too many? It seems to me that with the Desecrator unit filling the Obliterator's old role in a more balanced (i.e. your opponent can actually target them seperately from the rest of a formation, at least as long as there are no other vehicles) way, and the focus being on making the Hellblades a better choice than the Swiftdeath was that the Stalker seems a little too much *ducks*.

Also, I agree with moving the DeathWheel to the Titan allocation, as it stands it's too easy to put down a lot of void-shielded Fearless units (particularly in low points games), but I think that dragging the rest of the Assault Company formation with it is a bit far. Again to me this puts a lot of pressure on the 1/3 of your points to spend on War engines and Aircraft, especially as you may well want Hell Talons to answer for the non-existent artillery, this might also be a good place to fit an all-defiler formation ;).

Finally (honestly) I like the idea of making undivided a worthwhile choice. Maybe something like 'Marking' a formation takes up an upgrade slot, and some points (on top of Daemonic Pact, which maybe only gives the ability to summon Daemonic Beasts), once a formation is marked it gets some soft of god-specific aleration to it's abilities and the ability to summon it's Daemons.

Anyway, I'm looking forward to trying the changes out, and will be sure to post my experiences!


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 Post subject: Black Legion playtest changes
PostPosted: Fri Nov 28, 2008 1:19 am 
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My word tim, no free SC?

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 Post subject: Black Legion playtest changes
PostPosted: Fri Nov 28, 2008 3:13 pm 
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Quote: (The_Real_Chris @ 28 Nov. 2008, 00:19 )

My word tim, no free SC?

Raptors have lord included so he was up-graded to the supreme commander. Otherwise I would have used more predators.

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 Post subject: Black Legion playtest changes
PostPosted: Fri Nov 28, 2008 3:53 pm 
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Silly me :)

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 Post subject: Black Legion playtest changes
PostPosted: Fri Nov 28, 2008 3:59 pm 
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It made a pleasant change playing with only 24 units instead of my usual 100+ odd hoards, almost took me back to AT days.

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 Post subject: Black Legion playtest changes
PostPosted: Sat Dec 06, 2008 5:41 am 
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Some interesting observations on another board. The tank AA is seen as a boring copy of the hunter and its felt too much aa is being added to the list, mitigating one of its few weaknesses.

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 Post subject: Black Legion playtest changes
PostPosted: Sat Dec 06, 2008 6:45 am 
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Quote: (The_Real_Chris @ 05 Dec. 2008, 20:41 )

Some interesting observations on another board. The tank AA is seen as a boring copy of the hunter and its felt too much aa is being added to the list, mitigating one of its few weaknesses.

Its probably not an unwarranted comment. Perhaps the list only needs one AA unit.

Or just plenty of cheap and effective interceptors.

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