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Iron Cow ... ?
Legion 4
 Post subject: Iron Cow ... ?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 30, 2008 2:58 am 
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Quote: (Erik M @ 29 Oct. 2008, 19:30 )

Off course it's lightened up in Epic/SoW, but it's still one and then the other. Alternating side and alternating units isn't that big a difference. Anyhow...

Yes, simplicity is nice, and not. One might be as angry that a unit can't do a certain thing it ought to be able to as a unit doing things it can't possibly do as well as to many things to choose from and combine. Anyhow...

HQ's and their whereabout is probably more a token to show from where the lowest level is active. But I could also believe that low level officers have to act a lot on their own. Either because operations are quite small or because counter-measures are so severe. Anyhow...

Anyhow...!
Yes?

I've realised where our most common games for Fan-Sci 6mm goes wrong, INMNSHO. We have half-squads as the smallest. But not, so to speak, two wounds on ordinary vehicles. Time to rectify that. I'll be back in a year or so...

Well the things I don't like about  IGO-UGO ... is Player A moves all his units ... (Player B maybe Snapfire/Oppertunity fire ?) Player A shoots ... B dies - switch and repeat ... Activation is more realistic, IMO as well as more like chess. Player A activates moves, shoots, etc. a unit - 4-6-8-10 models/stands etc.  (B may Snapfire) ... B activates ... does not wait around until A is done shooting at B's units.  It is closer to simultaneous. And Players get to react to each other, as well, IMO.                                And being a former junior officer, you do and are expected to use your initiative ... :;):




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Legion 4
 Post subject: Iron Cow ... ?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 30, 2008 3:08 am 
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Quote: (Erik M @ 29 Oct. 2008, 19:44 )

L4, just adjusting your bipedal equipment...  :whistle:

Well being considered a bipedal primate, I've been known to walk upright as well as slither on my belly like a snake ... :D But that's not considered abnormal for most infantrymen ! :laugh:  Even former ones ! :vD




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javelin98
 Post subject: Iron Cow ... ?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 30, 2008 6:38 am 
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Quote: (Legion 4 @ 29 Oct. 2008, 18:08 )

But that's not considered abnormal for most infantrymen ! :laugh: ?Even former ones ! :vD

Yeah, but that's why we drag our knuckles, right?  Gotta stay upright somehow!

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Erik M
 Post subject: Iron Cow ... ?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 30, 2008 9:56 am 
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Wheelchair anyone?  :blush:

Well L4, I don't see really see Alternate Activation as an improvement. In that case I feel Full Turn as better, but less to do each turn.

jav~, I'll looked over DirtSide II again, even got it all printed out.
No, not a chance, I want as clean a table as possible and not clutter it with markers. Atleast when TTG'ing. Boardgames are, of course, quite another thing.
That said I will look into a "cluttered" system anyhow, but far less and very much more direct.

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Lion in the Stars
 Post subject: Iron Cow ... ?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 30, 2008 10:46 pm 
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Erik, while you're on the GZG site, grab the Stargrunt 2 rules.  I like the SG2 vehicle rules better than DS2, no chit-pulling.  It's a little slower than chits if you've got a vehicle-heavy force, but it's not unplayable.

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Legion 4
 Post subject: Iron Cow ... ?
PostPosted: Fri Oct 31, 2008 1:38 am 
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Quote: (javelin98 @ 30 Oct. 2008, 05:38 )

Quote: (Legion 4 @ 29 Oct. 2008, 18:08 )

But that's not considered abnormal for most infantrymen ! :laugh: ?Even former ones ! :vD

Yeah, but that's why we drag our knuckles, right?  Gotta stay upright somehow!

We are hunter-killer primates ! :D It's a jungle out there, Baby !!  :laugh:

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Legion 4
 Post subject: Iron Cow ... ?
PostPosted: Fri Oct 31, 2008 1:44 am 
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Quote: (Erik M @ 30 Oct. 2008, 08:56 )

Wheelchair anyone?  :blush:

Well L4, I don't see really see Alternate Activation as an improvement. In that case I feel Full Turn as better, but less to do each turn.

jav~, I'll looked over DirtSide II again, even got it all printed out.
No, not a chance, I want as clean a table as possible and not clutter it with markers. Atleast when TTG'ing. Boardgames are, of course, quite another thing.
That said I will look into a "cluttered" system anyhow, but far less and very much more direct.

Well always do what works for you ! :D  But I like activation and order counters !  :)

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Erik M
 Post subject: Iron Cow ... ?
PostPosted: Fri Oct 31, 2008 7:05 am 
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Order counters - check
Activation - not käckt

But we'll see... ;)

Lion~, I've looked at them too. But right now I'm closest to SoW anyhow.
Just got to crunch it two-ways first.

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Legion 4
 Post subject: Iron Cow ... ?
PostPosted: Fri Oct 31, 2008 2:47 pm 
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Yep, SoW and FWC are certainly tied for the top of my list ... :agree:

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Erik M
 Post subject: Iron Cow ... ?
PostPosted: Fri Oct 31, 2008 5:22 pm 
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So, time to jump in at the deep end over the weekend.

But first  some clarifications:
1) It's not percentage, it's plus and minus of modifiers towards a R100.
So 70 - 50% = 20%, or rather it's 70 - 50 = 20 (not 70*0.50=35).
2) Check and recheck the turn sequence, it's fairly neat.

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javelin98
 Post subject: Iron Cow ... ?
PostPosted: Fri Oct 31, 2008 5:41 pm 
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Quote: (Erik M @ 31 Oct. 2008, 08:22 )

So, time to jump in at the deep end over the weekend.

But first  some clarifications:
1) It's not percentage, it's plus and minus of modifiers towards a R100.
So 70 - 50% = 20%, or rather it's 70 - 50 = 20 (not 70*0.50=35).
2) Check and recheck the turn sequence, it's fairly neat.

That's right;  sorry if I came across incorrectly there.  For the movement, the modifier a percentage multiplied against the base speed;  for firing, the modifier is added to/subtracted from the base percentage.

The turn sequence is indeed pretty straightforward:

Initiative
Orders
Jamming
Player A move
Player A fire as desired
Player B move
Player A fire remaining units
Player B fire

I think the discussion above was really around the IGOUGO-ish nature of the system.  One player moves everything and fires up to everything before the second player gets a chance to do anything at all.  The alternating activation approach would let Player A move and shoot with one formation, then Player B, then back to Player A, etc.  The Iron Cow approach certainly puts the player who loses initiative at a significant disadvantage!

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Legion 4
 Post subject: Iron Cow ... ?
PostPosted: Fri Oct 31, 2008 9:15 pm 
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That's the real problem with IGO-UGO ... the player that shoots all his units first ... trashes the other player before he does anything !!!!!!!! :_(

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javelin98
 Post subject: Iron Cow ... ?
PostPosted: Fri Oct 31, 2008 10:56 pm 
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Quote: (Legion 4 @ 31 Oct. 2008, 12:15 )

That's the real problem with IGO-UGO ... the player that shoots all his units first ... trashes the other player before he does anything !!!!!!!! :_(

True, unless there's some sort of return-fire mechanic where the dead units get a return shot before being smothered in a cloud of cotton-ball fluff.

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Legion 4
 Post subject: Iron Cow ... ?
PostPosted: Fri Oct 31, 2008 11:07 pm 
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That's the real beauty of detachment activation ... Player A may shoot first with one unit and kill or damage one of B's units. But B still can do something besides die. And the players can react and as I said, like chess - Move, counter move, etc.




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Erik M
 Post subject: Iron Cow ... ?
PostPosted: Fri Oct 31, 2008 11:26 pm 
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The one first shoot at is still dead thou.
As I said earlier, the Dragon Pass system with double strength on return fire isn't to bad.
But we'll see what emerge. Right now we got a couple of games to keep us both satisfied and occupied.  8v)

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