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Thoughts on the v3.11 Imperator
semajnollissor
 Post subject: Thoughts on the v3.11 Imperator
PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2008 5:13 pm 
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A few of us played a couple of games with the Imperator last weekend, and even though they were large point number games (4500-5000), they did help to illustrate some odd things about the unit.

First, because of the size of the model, the Imperator will almost always have line of sight to everything that isn't derectly behind a wall. Sloped hills are no good. This is especially apparent with enemy WEs, which tend to be hard to hide anyway.

Second, there is a weird interaction between the quake cannon and the hellstorm cannon. At long range, you get a single template MW, but at mid-range, this switches to 3 templates (non-MW) that generate 3 extra BMs. I don't know, it feels weird not being able to separate the two effects without having to give up so much. Maybe if the quake cannon was renamed, and both weapons were given alternate firing modes...

current effective barrage:
60-90cm: 1 template AP4+/AT5+ MW
<60cm: ? ?3 template AP4+/AT5+ +3BP
? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?1 template AP4+/AT5+ MW

Maybe this would be better:
60-90cm: 2 template AP4+/AT5+
<60cm: ? ?3 template AP4+/AT5+ +3BP
? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?2 template AP4+/AT5+ MW

This could be accomplished with the following weapons replacing the quake and hellstorm cannons:
Shake cannon ? ? 90cm 5BP
Hailstorm cannon 60cm 5BP MW
? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?? ?60cm 10BP

I dunno, maybe it's just me, but the Imperator doesn't seem to have much firepower when compared to a Warlord. The thing is, even though it's is possible for the Imperator to wipe out an entire formation in a single turn, it's really only likely if the target is a WE formation without any shields. Large infantry formations aren't bothered by it a great deal (for it's given point cost)

In our games, the Imperator was neutralized by an assault by a bunch of orks in Crawlas in the first game and then a group of 2 Cobras and a Scorpion in the second game (we used the latest OGBM and Eldar revised lists).
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Evil and Chaos
 Post subject: Thoughts on the v3.11 Imperator
PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2008 5:21 pm 
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because of the size of the model, the Imperator will almost always have line of sight to everything that isn't derectly behind a wall. Sloped hills are no good. This is especially apparent with enemy WEs, which tend to be hard to hide anyway.


I'd take this as being a feature of this truly titanic war machine.


there is a weird interaction between the quake cannon and the hellstorm cannon.

What about a special note to the tune of: 'The Imperator may fire the Quake Cannon & the Hellstorm Cannon as two distinct attacks, rather than combining the BP into a single attack'?

(for it's given point cost)

Do you think it's overpriced?

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semajnollissor
 Post subject: Thoughts on the v3.11 Imperator
PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2008 5:32 pm 
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(Evil and Chaos @ Jun. 03 2008,11:21)
QUOTE
What about a special note to the tune of: 'The Imperator may fire the Quake Cannon & the Hellstorm Cannon as two distinct attacks, rather than combining the BP into a single attack'?

I'm not sure it's worth creating specific rules to do this (especially since there are so many other special rules that we could think of for this bad boy). Why open up that can of worms?

Do you think it's overpriced?

I'm not sure, but I was more referring to the fact that it is more geared to taking out WEs than it is to taking out infantry. An ork 'uge mob probably won't worry too much about it. It would only kill 9 infantry stands per turn (on average, assuming vehicle cover), which doesn't seem too scary for a 1250 pt unit.

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zombocom
 Post subject: Thoughts on the v3.11 Imperator
PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2008 5:35 pm 
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It seems to me to be a good thing that the Imperator isn't ridiculously awesome at wiping out whatever it shoots at. That sort of thing is impossible to ballance. A lack of AP fire seems a reasonable downside. After all, it's a machine designed for wiping other titans off the map, not infantry.

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Evil and Chaos
 Post subject: Thoughts on the v3.11 Imperator
PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2008 5:37 pm 
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An ork 'uge mob probably won't worry too much about it.


Ork mobs laugh at standard config Warlord Titans too.




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semajnollissor
 Post subject: Thoughts on the v3.11 Imperator
PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2008 7:09 pm 
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A few other things I remembered...

It wouldn't seem unreasonable to make the extra attacks it gets in FF macro weapons. If only because it seems odd that it just gets 14 4+ FF attacks, 12+2MW 4+ FF attacks isn't at all over the top.

Consider givng it the scout ability too, since it looks like it should be able to command a larger than normal ZoC. Thick rear armour wouldn't be bad either. Neither of those additions would be unbalancing at the given point cost.

And as for that critical effect, maybe expand the blast radius to 10 or 15cm. It's pretty pointless at 5cm if people are avoiding intermingling (not that it would probably even come up in an AMTL army with 5 activations). Or change the critical completely.

I'd really like to hear other people's experiences when taking this guy. It seemed like my Eldar were able to wait outside of its range until after it activated. It did wipe out my Warlock titan (damn tall models), but the other 3- or 4-volcano cannon titans would have done that, too (in the same game a Phantom was just as handily vaporized by a 4xvolcano warlord).
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The_Real_Chris
 Post subject: Thoughts on the v3.11 Imperator
PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2008 11:31 pm 
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14 4+ FF vs 8 3+FF from a warlord - 7 hits vs 5 1/3, not much of a difference!

Anyway a standard config warlord, say 4 gats or 4 tlds would get on straight rolls 8-5 1/3 (gat, 4+ and at -1) infantry or 10 2/3's armour (TLD) hits.

Of course a barrage weapon ensures the enemy don't bunch up to much, which has its own benifits.

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