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epic versus future weapons

duz.holger

Post subject: epic versus future weapons

Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2008 10:04 am

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Joined: Thu Apr 07, 2005 11:50 pm
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Location: denmark

hi I just think there are a gab in the the epic line example in the god old days of warfare you had beast of burden to carry your equipment and the mastiff to protect you from surprises in the modern/near future battle field you would use robots for that line of work but in epic there is no burden for the troops but the heavy close support is still some men caring big guns and mortars but in the real world the arms industry is active working on putting these on a robot witch will follow the infantry like a dog and on command from the platoon bark and bite bullets or shells this should also be represented in epic

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Enderel

Post subject: epic versus future weapons

Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2008 1:18 pm

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Joined: Tue Mar 07, 2006 8:54 pm
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Location: Southampton - UK

I think I see what your getting at duz. The logistics (Quarter Master) and front line support aspect of Epic is not very well represented currently. ?We get the actual fighting vehicles on the battlefield but how are they delivered and kept in ammo? ?We get the infantry with heavy weapons but where is their transports and supply.

Take the Goliath mega cannon, ok how many shells does that need in a game and where are they? ?How does it get there? I could see those tracktor treads being part of a large movement mechanism but not the whole thing!

Marines might be able to fight for a few weeks without major sustenance but IG troops are going to start dying before then!

I think with Forgeworld doing more 6mm models and people like Exodus Wars and DRM doing alternate models we'll see an expansion on this.

Already there are towing vehicles and the like at 40k scale so expect them to come down to 6mm at some point as well (especially with IA around)

You can represent some of this yourself, I use extensively automated items such as tarantulars and robots. ?

I'd expect an Ad Mech army to make extensive use of (initially) non com units which can then convert to a military purpose when required. ?Servo skulls servitors and other automated support systems should be able to offer help.

I think the main point currently is that the model range isn't there to support the ideas.

Perhaps instead of the inidividual models you could do conversions and pay for upgrades to individual units.

e.g. Space Marine Techmarine can pay for servitors or servo skulls.

gun servitor - extra firepower
CC servitor - extra caf
servo skull - re roll to hit

the only limits then is your imagination. take the bomb disposal robots of new, they could be represented on field as could un manned spotters as bonuses to stat lines or additional abilities.

even do with tyranids (extra evolutions) orks (bomb disposal squigs)!

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duz.holger

Post subject: epic versus future weapons

Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2008 2:06 pm

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Joined: Thu Apr 07, 2005 11:50 pm
Posts: 993
Location: denmark

i was actually thinking of making a some reapiers in to front-line trooper support vehicles and making a unit that is meant to work like this you by 3 in a support card but it merge with the company and count as part of it it get the same orders it ads to the break point and VP, on figure per platoon, of course it has snapfire.

the actual conversion is meant to make it work as a mobile heavy bolter platform or a auto mortar or some other thing thin i haven't thought of yet.

i think i will call it "mastiff heavy support platform"

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duz.holger

Post subject: epic versus future weapons

Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2008 5:39 pm

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Joined: Thu Apr 07, 2005 11:50 pm
Posts: 993
Location: denmark

can you help me with this unit please spell check and suggest price

mastiff infantry heavy support robot

its a support vehicle ment as heavy lift transport platform for the imperial guard grunts on the ground
its an STC pattern vehicle how its machine spiret works is unknown even even to the tech-priests on mars. It behaves like a faithfull dog who will follow its master to the death and like that it will also defend its master. there is a variety of different versions of mastiffs from the "heavy loader transport version" to the "rocket armed anti air version" what draw them together is the machine spirits super fast reaktion time this gives the mastiff the snap fire ability

move 10cm
save 0
CAF 0

heavy loader version
gives +5% move to the platoon do to the lighten burden of the Guards

AA version
weapon: rocket lounsher
range: 75cm
attack dice: 2
to hit roll: 5+
TSM: -1
special: AA snapfire

heavy bolter version
weapon: Heavy bolter
range: 50cm
attack dice: 3
to hit roll: 5+
TSM: -1
special: snapfire

Mortar vesion
weapon: auto mortar
range: 60cm
attack dice: 2 barage points
to hit roll:
TSM: 0
special: snapfire fires 2 times

anti sniper vesion
weapon: Heavy sniper rifle
range: 50cm
attack dice: 1
to hit roll: 3+
TSM: -1
special: snapfire

Las cannon version
weapon: lascanon
range: 75cm
attack dice: 2
to hit roll: 5+
TSM: -1
special: snapfire

heavy flamer vesion
weapon: Heavy flamer
range: small tierdrop template
attack dice:
to hit roll: 5+
TSM: 0
special: snapfire

Multi melta vesion
weapon: multi melta
range: 25cm
attack dice: 1
to hit roll: 3+
TSM: -2
special: snapfire

auto cannon vesion
weapon: Heavy bolter
range: 50cm
attack dice: 3
to hit roll: 5+
TSM: -0
special: snapfire

support detachment

3 units (free choice between all vesions)
plus 3 to break point
plus (don't know)
point value (don't know)

notes: one mastiff per platoon per card

how to make them

if you can't find a apobriat proxy use a reipier an remove weapon ad a platform and the apropriat pay load

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Legion 4

Post subject: epic versus future weapons

Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2008 7:45 pm

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Joined: Thu Feb 13, 2003 5:13 pm
Posts: 36989
Location: Ohio - USA

Well I see what you are getting at. From a pure resupply/logistics standpoint (that was one of my jobs in Korea), Epic battles don't last long enough for resupply of Ammo, Fuel, etc. I'm not an NetEpic or SM2 player, but PM Primarch, he's the NetEpic creator. I'm sure he can help.

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primarch

Post subject: epic versus future weapons

Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2008 3:07 am

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Joined: Fri Feb 14, 2003 12:46 am
Posts: 27069
Location: Edmond, Oklahoma USA

Hi!

These should be support cards as per regular support cards (added to the company card).

The prices and stats are reasonable to me.

If you send them to me, I can get them in the optionals book.

Primarch

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Legion 4

Post subject: epic versus future weapons

Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2008 6:33 am

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Joined: Thu Feb 13, 2003 5:13 pm
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Location: Ohio - USA

See, I knew you'd help "P" !

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duz.holger

Post subject: epic versus future weapons

Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2008 8:43 am

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Joined: Thu Apr 07, 2005 11:50 pm
Posts: 993
Location: denmark

i still thing they should bee an add on just like the confessor and the whole idea is that they must be i coherency with the platoon they supports they are meant as a close support unit ' for the unit

i can't send the file too you primarch i don't have your mail adress

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Enderel

Post subject: epic versus future weapons

Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2008 9:00 am

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Joined: Tue Mar 07, 2006 8:54 pm
Posts: 1134
Location: Southampton - UK

The mastiff idea is excellent. ?However we're touching on an area here that needs discussion.

Do we integrate these into a formation as an upgrade or are they distinct enough for a support card of their own?

E:A goes with the formation upgrades. ?
NetEpic has predominately gone with support cards.

For small scale battles the upgrade would be feasible but at high points levels support cards would be more sensible.

If we open up the formation upgrade route though it would allow so much more customisation of units, such as mixed HQ units (Librarians, Chaplins, Commanders all on the one base)

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duz.holger

Post subject: epic versus future weapons

Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2008 10:24 am

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Joined: Thu Apr 07, 2005 11:50 pm
Posts: 993
Location: denmark

i know but there is some places in the IG list where it is an upgrade but still counts as a specific card (example the confessor is a special card but he merge with a specific platoon and bolster its break point an VP) and there i a few other examples my idea is its a support card that merge with a company and of course you can have up to five of them (5 cards of 3 mastiffs) but you can't have any other support card in that case. think like an orc formation and at first glance it sounds cool but in reality it is going to make a lot coherency trouble for the guards so i have by diffencion build a up and down side to the unit witch is making it balanced

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duz.holger

Post subject: epic versus future weapons

Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2008 10:52 am

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Joined: Thu Apr 07, 2005 11:50 pm
Posts: 993
Location: denmark

and the horror scenario of five mastiff groups roaming with infantry move rules with all that fire power and then the guard company moving in afterward and mop-up is not a good thing i would also make the rule that its only infantry company who is able to use them (first of all its meant as an infantry support unit and second it is actually to powerful for a bike squat or a tank unit)

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duz.holger

Post subject: epic versus future weapons

Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2008 5:36 pm

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Joined: Thu Apr 07, 2005 11:50 pm
Posts: 993
Location: denmark

still need a price

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you must be willing to pay the price for fighting in cities to do battle there
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primarch

Post subject: epic versus future weapons

Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2008 8:54 pm

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Joined: Fri Feb 14, 2003 12:46 am
Posts: 27069
Location: Edmond, Oklahoma USA

(duz.holger @ Apr. 22 2008,03:43)

QUOTE

Hi!

My e-mail:

pramos10@cox.net

Primarch

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primarch

Post subject: epic versus future weapons

Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2008 8:57 pm

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Joined: Fri Feb 14, 2003 12:46 am
Posts: 27069
Location: Edmond, Oklahoma USA

(Enderel @ Apr. 22 2008,04:00)

QUOTE

The mastiff idea is excellent. However we're touching on an area here that needs discussion.

Do we integrate these into a formation as an upgrade or are they distinct enough for a support card of their own?

E:A goes with the formation upgrades.
NetEpic has predominately gone with support cards.

For small scale battles the upgrade would be feasible but at high points levels support cards would be more sensible.

If we open up the formation upgrade route though it would allow so much more customisation of units, such as mixed HQ units (Librarians, Chaplins, Commanders all on the one base)

Hi!

Formation upgrades is a VERY interesting idea and would, I think, be easy to implement.

I think this would be a great topic to debate and suggest what exactly could we include as "upgrades"...

Primarch

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duz.holger

Post subject: epic versus future weapons

Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2008 10:44 pm

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Joined: Thu Apr 07, 2005 11:50 pm
Posts: 993
Location: denmark

send draft 2.0 to you primarch but i need a point value cost i have also asked for some feedback on some ideas

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