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What Will GW's Next Game Be?
MaksimSmelchak	Post subject: What Will GW's Next Game Be? Posted: Sat Sep 13, 2003 3:29 pm
Brood Brother Joined: Sun Feb 16, 2003 4:43 pm Posts: 7258 Location: Sacramento, California, USA	L-4, Samson's Foxes, made famous during the 1st Arab-Israeli War? Generally speaking, most people call the 1st Arab-Israeli War the War for Israeli Independence. I don't recall a unit during 1948 called Samson's Foxes although the Golani infantry brigade has a recon detatchment called that. Where did you read about that, L-4? Perhaps, the most famous units were PALMACH (PALMACH were elite Kibbutznik commandos) ones. Moyshe Dayan, Yigal Allon and many other famous leaders got their start in the PALMACH, which was later disbanded. The most famous unit off the top of head would probably be the "Negev Beasts," a long-range jeep-mounted commando unit that reclaimed the Negev desert for Israel and penetrated deep into the Sinai when politics forced the Israelis to return the Sinai to Egypt while many of the Arab countries were allowed to keep what they possessed by the right of the conqueror." The UN has never been impartial or fair. Shabbat Shalom, Maksim-Smelchak. _________________ 6mm Sci-fi: http://games.groups.yahoo.com/group/6mm ... nWarGames/ My Personal Blog: http://6mm-minis.blogspot.com/

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Legion 4	Post subject: What Will GW's Next Game Be? Posted: Sat Sep 13, 2003 3:56 pm
Brood Brother Joined: Thu Feb 13, 2003 5:13 pm Posts: 36989 Location: Ohio - USA	Maksim, yes, my next guess about those names were that they had Mid-Eastern roots, but your linguistic skills are better than mine, not counting Klingon ! ? ?And IIRC, I read about Samson's Foxes in a series of books called Born in Battle about the IDF, I'll have to check. I thought they were a unit based on the SAS in the North Africa campaign of WWII. ?Mount in jeeps and light trucks, armed with MGs, and raising Hell in the Sinai or Negev. We normally refer to the Arab-Israeli Wars, by the date, '48, '56, '67, '73, but yes usually the '48 war is known as the War of Independence. ?And being a "student" of desert warfare, I have studied the actions in WWII and the Arab-Israeli Wars and I am very familiar the Palmach, Haganah, and even the Irgun and Stern Gang. As a young officer I was very impressed by the history of the IDF. And we had IDF officers in our Advanced Course, too. I'll check on Samson's Foxes, it has been a long time since I read those books. ?And had I been promoted to Major, before the US Army's tragic downsizing, I had been selected to be assigned to the US/UN mission in the Middle East whose HQs was at the time in Jerusalem, IIRC. ?But we all know how often the UN has become "political" in the past and currently ... _________________ Legion 4 "Cry Havoc, and let slip the Dogs of War !" ... "People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf."
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primarch	Post subject: What Will GW's Next Game Be? Posted: Sat Sep 13, 2003 10:40 pm
Brood Brother Joined: Fri Feb 14, 2003 12:46 am Posts: 27069 Location: Edmond, Oklahoma USA	Hi! I always enjoyed reading about the Russo-finnish war. The Finns really gave the initial Russian incursions a drubbing. Unfortunately with a population back them of 230 million Finland could not hold back the attritional war the ruskies so loved back then. Did the Germans ever give them REAL military back up? I wonder if it would have made a difference. Primarch _________________ Primarch The Primarchload Magnetized Titans Tutorial Net Epic Gold Heresy Rules
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primarch	Post subject: What Will GW's Next Game Be? Posted: Sat Sep 13, 2003 10:44 pm
Brood Brother Joined: Fri Feb 14, 2003 12:46 am Posts: 27069 Location: Edmond, Oklahoma USA	Hi! Oh I forgot, Maksim, what is the name at the great Israeli hero that was actually a spy in the Syrian government and passed on the information that was vital in taking the Golan hieghts? I was trying to remember his name, but I'm drawing a blank. He was very brave, too bad the syrians got him and executed him. Primarch _________________ Primarch The Primarchload Magnetized Titans Tutorial Net Epic Gold Heresy Rules
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Tas	Post subject: What Will GW's Next Game Be? Posted: Sun Sep 14, 2003 2:27 am
Brood Brother Joined: Thu Mar 06, 2003 10:01 am Posts: 7823 Location: Sydney, NSW	Quote (primarch @ 14 2003 Sep.,07:40) Did the Germans ever give them REAL military back up? I wonder if it would have made a difference. Certainly there were equipment transfers- Me 109s, AT guns, light armour, MG42 etc . I suppose the only signifciant help would have been in the seige of Leningrad where the Germans has a vested intrest.  I dont have any details to hand, maybe somebody else more informed could comment ? _________________ Tas My General blog: http://tasmancave.blogspot.com/ My VSF Blog: http://pauljamesog.blogspot.com/ My ECW Blog: http://declaresir.blogspot.com/
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primarch	Post subject: What Will GW's Next Game Be? Posted: Sun Sep 14, 2003 3:24 am
Brood Brother Joined: Fri Feb 14, 2003 12:46 am Posts: 27069 Location: Edmond, Oklahoma USA	Hi! One of the things the russians got from their victory is a corridor of territory north of leningrad (maybe Mojarn will know) that made it harder for the germans to encircle it later. Had that war not taken place perhaps leningrad would have fallen since its northern flank would have been finnish territory and the germans could siege it easier. So many "what if's" about WWII. Primarch _________________ Primarch The Primarchload Magnetized Titans Tutorial Net Epic Gold Heresy Rules
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Legion 4	Post subject: What Will GW's Next Game Be? Posted: Sun Sep 14, 2003 5:06 am
Brood Brother Joined: Thu Feb 13, 2003 5:13 pm Posts: 36989 Location: Ohio - USA	Well remember, when Finland was invaded by Russia in '39, the Finns had to go to war with what was available. ?German support really didn't start unit after the Germans invaded Russia and Finland "allied" itself in a "marriage of convenience", with Germany, to rid their country of the Russians. ?And IIRC the supply corridor to Leningrad was over the frozen Lake Ladoga (?) region. I'll have to check on that ... ?And Maksim, I have the book about Samson's Foxes, Born in Battle, Issue No.5. Originally published in Israel in '79 and in the first chapter it mentions and shows pictures of Samson's Foxes in SAS style jeeps and even a captured Egyptian Bren Carrier, in the Negev, 1948. ?So I took it as being accurate. ?More good history discussion, it may not have much to do with Epic, but it might cause some gamers to read ? more non-fiction ... ?Oh, and I believe the Israeli Agent's name was Cohen, I remember seeing a number of excellent programs on the History Channel about that. _________________ Legion 4 "Cry Havoc, and let slip the Dogs of War !" ... "People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf."
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MaksimSmelchak

Post subject: What Will GW's Next Game Be? Posted: Sun Sep 14, 2003 5:47 am

Brood Brother Joined: Sun Feb 16, 2003 4:43 pm Posts: 7258 Location: Sacramento, California, USA

Primarch, Oh I forgot, Maksim, what is the name at the great Israeli hero who was actually a spy in the Syrian government and passed on the information that was vital in taking the Golan Heights? L-4, good call! I beleive his name was Eli Cohen and Eli is short for Eleazar usually. He was a Sephardic Jew, born and bred in the Arab world so he spoke Arabic as his first language and was completely at home in the Arab Muslim culture. They hung him when they caught him, which is merciful considering what has happened to many spies in the Arab world. Shalom, Maksim-Smelchak. _________________ 6mm Sci-fi: http://games.groups.yahoo.com/group/6mm ... nWarGames/ My Personal Blog: http://6mm-minis.blogspot.com/

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MaksimSmelchak

Post subject: What Will GW's Next Game Be? Posted: Sun Sep 14, 2003 5:52 am

Brood Brother Joined: Sun Feb 16, 2003 4:43 pm Posts: 7258 Location: Sacramento, California, USA

L-4, And Maksim, I have the book about Samson's Foxes, Born in Battle, Issue No.5. Originally published in Israel in '79 and in the first chapter it mentions and shows pictures of Samson's Foxes in SAS style jeeps and even a captured Egyptian Bren Carrier, in the Negev, 1948. I really like the Born in Battle series. They're wonderful. Israeli military security can be pretty severe and the military censors very strict. Many early writers had to use "epithets" (am I using this word incorrectly?) or made-up names for units. Many of the unit numbers published in books are very fictional. The PALMACH unit in the desert was known as the Negev Beats, but maybe a smallier striking company was known as "Samson's Foxes." On the other hand, that may be a made-up name. I'm no expert, but I'm good. Shalom, Maksim-Smelchak. _________________ 6mm Sci-fi: http://games.groups.yahoo.com/group/6mm ... nWarGames/ My Personal Blog: http://6mm-minis.blogspot.com/

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Legion 4	Post subject: What Will GW's Next Game Be? Posted: Sun Sep 14, 2003 5:53 am
Brood Brother Joined: Thu Feb 13, 2003 5:13 pm Posts: 36989 Location: Ohio - USA	Yes, I remember now. I believe Israel was still trying to get his body back. _________________ Legion 4 "Cry Havoc, and let slip the Dogs of War !" ... "People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf."
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Legion 4	Post subject: What Will GW's Next Game Be? Posted: Sun Sep 14, 2003 6:01 am
Brood Brother Joined: Thu Feb 13, 2003 5:13 pm Posts: 36989 Location: Ohio - USA	Well either way, the series is well done and the SAS style raiding unit again proved effective. ?We (the US & UK) did it in the first Gulf War and as time goes on we'll see the US, UK and Aussies did the same thing a few months ago. ?Even Lawrence did it in WWI with camels ! _________________ Legion 4 "Cry Havoc, and let slip the Dogs of War !" ... "People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf."
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primarch	Post subject: What Will GW's Next Game Be? Posted: Sun Sep 14, 2003 3:10 pm
Brood Brother Joined: Fri Feb 14, 2003 12:46 am Posts: 27069 Location: Edmond, Oklahoma USA	Hi! Thanks Maksim, thats the guy! Primarch _________________ Primarch The Primarchload Magnetized Titans Tutorial Net Epic Gold Heresy Rules
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primarch	Post subject: What Will GW's Next Game Be? Posted: Sun Sep 14, 2003 3:12 pm
Brood Brother Joined: Fri Feb 14, 2003 12:46 am Posts: 27069 Location: Edmond, Oklahoma USA	Hi! Legion4, I saw the very same History channel documentaries. I marvel at the steel nuts that guy had to pull of his mission. Very few men would have pulled it off. Primarch _________________ Primarch The Primarchload Magnetized Titans Tutorial Net Epic Gold Heresy Rules
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Legion 4	Post subject: What Will GW's Next Game Be? Posted: Sun Sep 14, 2003 4:13 pm
Brood Brother Joined: Thu Feb 13, 2003 5:13 pm Posts: 36989 Location: Ohio - USA	It always amazes me, when I watch shows on the History or Discovery Channel and see how some people are just a whole other breed. ?And after 10 + years in the Infantry I had seen and done some very much "over-the-top" stuff. So I'm not easily impressed ! And yes, I checked my library, and frozen Lake Lagoda was the MSR into Leningrad (now back to St.Petersburg, IIRC), from Sep.'41 to Jan.'44 it was under siege. No siege could last that long today, the 24 hour News Networks wouldn't have it !!! _________________ Legion 4 "Cry Havoc, and let slip the Dogs of War !" ... "People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf."
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MaksimSmelchak

Post subject: What Will GW's Next Game Be? Posted: Sun Sep 14, 2003 4:25 pm

Brood Brother Joined: Sun Feb 16, 2003 4:43 pm Posts: 7258 Location: Sacramento, California, USA

L-4 and gang, Even Lawrence did it in W.W.I with camels! I don't want to pop any British's patriots' bubbles, but the whole Lawrence of Arabia excapade is a myth. It was invented at first by an American reporter trying to shore up the allies for W.W.II. Lawrence's book is full of melodrama and reads much like a soap opera script. He wasn't a very balanced individual either and had a number of "alternate lifestyle" issues. What the Turks did to him in captivity didn't help either. At any rate, the Lawrence of Arabia issue has done the world more of a disservice than a service. That whole episode has had lasting repercussions in the Arab world and very few of them positive in outlook. Shalom, Maksim-Smelchak. _________________ 6mm Sci-fi: http://games.groups.yahoo.com/group/6mm ... nWarGames/ My Personal Blog: http://6mm-minis.blogspot.com/

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