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Tyranid cyborg fleet idea
XmattX
 Post subject: Tyranid cyborg fleet idea
PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2007 9:42 pm 
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A bit of a crosspost with the SG forum, but I'm anxious for some more opinions :)
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I'd like some opinions on the following idea: what if like the hermit crab, a species of tyranid started to 'wear' derelict space ship parts and evolved to interface with them. This would create a kind of cyborgs. Would this be something:

- possible fluffwise within the 40k setting (I have limited knowledge of this)?
- interesting enough to make a BFG fleet out of?

I see this as sort of the scratchbuilders dreamfleet. You buy a box of 40k Gaunts and a few packs of chaos and imperial cruisers and build away :)

If people like the idea I'd like to start work on this list. (A good way to pass the time in the christmas holiday :))

edit:

Couldn't help myself and botched a picture together for these 'Technids':
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Warmaster Nice
 Post subject: Tyranid cyborg fleet idea
PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2007 11:13 pm 
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I have no idea about the flufinss of it but I really like the idea. Definietly one of the most original ones I've seen in a while. Whatever you end up doing make sure to post pics of the finished result :;):

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Ilushia
 Post subject: Tyranid cyborg fleet idea
PostPosted: Sat Dec 22, 2007 2:21 am 
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Fluff-wise I could picture them being Imperial 'survivors' fo a hive fleet attack. Where their ships got jumped by 'nids, won, but had spores land onboard. Over the long haul back to their command stations the spores matured into full sized 'nids and eventually took the ship over. Infesting its pieces and using what was available. A lack of biomass has resulted in them using the infastructure of the ships as their 'center' points. Would make for a very cool fluffy kinda hive-fleet.
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XmattX
 Post subject: Tyranid cyborg fleet idea
PostPosted: Sat Dec 22, 2007 1:26 pm 
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Well, with input from both the SG boards and this one we now have a possible 3 ways for a ship to become a Technid vessel:

- The ship was succesfully boarded by Genestealers who then infected the remaining crew and over time evolved ways to fill in the damaged parts and interface with the undamaged ones. (Think imperial vessel with a little tyranid stuff thrown in)
- The ship was destroyed of selfdestructed in a boarding action and afterwards salvaged by Technids which used the few remaining intact parts to 'upgrade' themselves. (Think Tyranid vessel with some imperial addictions)
- The imperial/chaos ship won the battle but was infected by spores, which took over the ship but because of their limited biomass evolved to interface most directly with the captured ship of all types, leading to a vessel which on first sight looks unchanged but has highly effective 'crossbreeds'of imperial and tyranid technology.
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vanvlak
 Post subject: Tyranid cyborg fleet idea
PostPosted: Sat Dec 22, 2007 1:52 pm 
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Nice artwork, by the way - and a grand idea, however unconventional and out of line with official fluff. Go for it :)

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XmattX
 Post subject: Tyranid cyborg fleet idea
PostPosted: Sat Dec 22, 2007 2:36 pm 
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(vanvlak @ Dec. 22 2007,12:52)
QUOTE
Nice artwork, by the way - and a grand idea, however unconventional and out of line with official fluff. Go for it :)

Well, thats what I'm trying to achieve, to integrate it more into the official fluff. Where would you say are the most jarring differences which would need to be resolved? Or is it just the entire idea? :)
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vanvlak
 Post subject: Tyranid cyborg fleet idea
PostPosted: Sat Dec 22, 2007 3:28 pm 
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I would say that it fits in the 40K universe, although I prefer the 'hermit crab concept'. Chaos vessels would be ideal as they are in fact older than the current Imperial designs.
Having said that, I do not see GW and SG proposing something of the sort; and they might not even endorse it. Still, be it as a rule set or a 'use as' fleet, I at least would have no problems - in fact, I love the idea. I do not think that any but the most hard-core fans would see anything wrong with this.
A very nice spin-off would see Ordo Xenos space marines fighting on board one of these in a Space Hulk scenario.

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Evil and Chaos
 Post subject: Tyranid cyborg fleet idea
PostPosted: Sat Dec 22, 2007 3:54 pm 
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I prefer the Hermit Crab idea, as the idea of Tyranids directly using technology doesn't really occur in the offical fluff.

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ragnarok
 Post subject: Tyranid cyborg fleet idea
PostPosted: Sat Dec 22, 2007 4:26 pm 
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I can actually see a ship benig infested by nids, who when cut off from the rest of the hive stafrt building their own on board the ship (kind of like when they get stranded on a planet and build a planetside hive).

In time they take over the entire ship and nid bits strat sprouting out of the hull.

They wouldn't interface with any of the ship systems (engines, weapons etc).  Rather they would rend them down for material ('nids do use metals in their constructs) and repace them with their own organic versions.

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XmattX
 Post subject: Tyranid cyborg fleet idea
PostPosted: Sat Dec 22, 2007 4:45 pm 
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(ragnarok @ Dec. 22 2007,15:26)
QUOTE
They wouldn't interface with any of the ship systems (engines, weapons etc).  Rather they would rend them down for material ('nids do use metals in their constructs) and repace them with their own organic versions.

The problem with this interpretation is that there will be very little differences with a normal Tyranid fleet, if they cannot interface with the technological aspects of the host hulls.

I'm leaning towards giving them the option to interface which would open the way to a more different fleet with different abilities. Would for example later generation Genestealers (the ones which look almost human) be able to operate and (crucially) connect the imperial (or chaos, which is essentially imperial as well) technology to the bio-ship-components?
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Evil and Chaos
 Post subject: Tyranid cyborg fleet idea
PostPosted: Sat Dec 22, 2007 4:56 pm 
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Would for example later generation Genestealers (the ones which look almost human) be able to operate and (crucially) connect the imperial (or chaos, which is essentially imperial as well) technology to the bio-ship-components?


In the official background?

Emphatically no.

The human/Genestealer hybrids would be quickly (and willingly) rendered for their biomass by the Tyranids in such a situation.

There isn't a single recorded instance of Tyranids even using technology (Such as a gun, or a tank) that I'm aware of. Having Tyranid/machine cyborgs is a step beyond that.


However, nothing's stopping you writing your own story / justification.

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blackhorizon
 Post subject: Tyranid cyborg fleet idea
PostPosted: Sat Dec 22, 2007 7:48 pm 
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Good idea, please go on.

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Ilushia
 Post subject: Tyranid cyborg fleet idea
PostPosted: Sat Dec 22, 2007 9:10 pm 
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There's LOTS of recorded instances in the older fluff of genestealer-cults which use technology. The 2nd edition 'nid codex, for instance, had an entire army list centered around them which were kinda low-tech IG with 'nid bits thrown in. If there weren't enough of them they might not summon a hive-fleet either. So I could totally picture a group of genestealer-hybrid running an imperial/tyranid fleet. Seeding planets across the galaxy with new genestealers to further the cause of the hive!
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CyberShadow
 Post subject: Tyranid cyborg fleet idea
PostPosted: Sat Dec 22, 2007 9:45 pm 
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Under the 'revised' background for the Cult, E&C is correct. The cultists and bio-orgs would be reabsorbed. However, with the original (and best) background, they would indeed. The original background for Space Hulk (the game) had the cult boarding a 'dead' vessel. The Hybrids and Brood Brothers would set up the technology, allowing the Purestrains in stasis, and they would then die off of old age (Purestrains are essentially immortal).

I would say that this kind of process would work just as well in your scenario.

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XmattX
 Post subject: Tyranid cyborg fleet idea
PostPosted: Sat Dec 22, 2007 10:50 pm 
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Here's a _very_ preliminary background for the Technids (anyone can think of a better name btw, or keep this one?) and a suggestion for a weapon type.
I have another question for the Tyranidologists here :) Are there still purestrain tyranids produced every fourth human-genestealer-hybrid generation as I read somewhere?

Also, my idea was that the purestrain tyranids become the organic part of the ship, while the hybrids run it. Is this at all possible?
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Technid Fleet
Most Technid ships originated as Imperial or Chaos Vessels which were unwittingly infected by spores after a Tyranid attack and were, sometimes years later, taken over by the resulting small Tyranid Genestealer force. Having very low amounts of biomass at their disposal and finding themselves out of reach of the Hive Mind, to survive these Tyranids evolved a way to link themselves to the captured ships and their systems and use them as a readymade ?shell?, eliminating the initial need for biomass in terms of armor and weaponry. They found ways to make use of existing weaponry, evolving replacement ammunition. In older Technid ships, some parts of the original ship have been replaced by organic matter. Day to day affairs on these Technid ships are run by Genestealer hybrids, the descendants of the original crew.

Sometimes a void creature cut off from a Hivefleet comes across a Technid fleet. The Technids, no longer under control of the Hive Mind, have trained the descendants of Imperial Navigators to act as a substitute, allowing them to bind these creatures to the fleet. The control is shaky at best, so most Technid fleets have only a limited number of void creatures in them.

Biomass batteries
Biomass batteries fire specially evolved spores which, while inflicting significant damage, also burst apart in a hail of infiltration organisms which are attracted to high energy systems. When a ship suffers a critical hit as a result of Biomass batteries, enough organisms have survived the initial impact and have rallied around a key ship component. They collectively project a signal back to the Technid fleet, guiding fire to this sensitive ship component. These organisms, though resilient, are only evolved for this one function and are easily dispatched by the enemy crew once located if they are not killed in the Technids own fire.

Biomass batteries function like regular batteries with the following distinction: when a critical hit is scored, for the remainder of the turn Technid hits on the stricken ship need one less on their roll for critical hits (usually scoring a critical hit on a 5+ instead of a 6+).
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edit: added a few more inspirational mockups of Technid escorts:
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