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Andy Hall on SG future

 Post subject: Andy Hall on SG future
PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2007 2:23 am 
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(Heresiarch @ Oct. 09 2007,14:11)
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(alansa @ Oct. 08 2007,05:44)
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Further I don't believe anyone has any right to berate GW just because they allowed their hopes and wants to get in the way of reasonable expectations.

:laugh:

Expectations? I'm afraid to say GW did nothing but fulfill exactly some of our expectations. Which would be do a half ass job of it until they cancel any support.

Offloading it onto the fans isn't support by GW it's a cop-out as well I might add. by that standard they may have well just pointed people directly to NetEpic in the first place.

So as it would appear they were indeed "reasonable" expectations after all.

Hi!

Good point. While I love my netepic, its NOT bonafide support. Its fan based support. A different beast altogether. GW/SG....promised.. A LOT for Epic A. Heck guys just read firepower. It was that promised we'd get a full line and even plastic titans!!

What hurts is that they really COULD have done it. It's not an unreasonable expectation, because they did it once before and it WORKED!! That they wanted more than what it produced back then, sure, businesses always want more. But offering a non-complete product line, via internet only (in most cases) a lousy retailer discount (less than half than the standard trader discount from most products including other non-epic GW products), so they can't carry it and rules that only a "fan based" cadre is carrying on its shoulders, IS NOT SUPPORT. Support is when the company actively and pro actively invests in the games promotion. NO such thing happens with epic from GW.

I also would like to point out that these conversations on this topic are totally skewed to the point of view of the "epic fanatic", which is basically all of us who even care about epic. The kind of "support" GW supposedly offers does nothing to attract new gamers or casual gamers interested in epic.

Any hobby needs to grow to have a viable player base, but GW's policies and non-support virtually condemns epic to an ever dwindling player base. Only the die hards remain, as always.  :;):

I'm resigned to another "dark age" of no support. I can only fervently hope that the next time epic resurfaces, GW will license it out to someone else (even if it is FW) that can TRULY support it.

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 Post subject: Andy Hall on SG future
PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2007 2:25 am 
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I guess the Epic after-market will be rising in value!  Good thing I invested in Epic rather than gold :)

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 Post subject: Andy Hall on SG future
PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2007 2:31 am 
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I wonder if things with GW and Epic might have been different if LOTR hadn't happened...

Indeed it does seem like Epic could do well.  $20 million sales certainly wouldn't be anything to sniff at. Maybe one day they will see the light...

Ah well, as I've said before, GW's loss is DR's and EW's gain :)

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 Post subject: Andy Hall on SG future
PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2007 4:15 am 
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Indeed, good news for Doug & Tom ... And us ! :D

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 Post subject: Andy Hall on SG future
PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2007 4:29 am 
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(Markconz @ Oct. 09 2007,21:31)
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I wonder if things with GW and Epic might have been different if LOTR hadn't happened...

Indeed it does seem like Epic could do well.  $20 million sales certainly wouldn't be anything to sniff at. Maybe one day they will see the light...

Ah well, as I've said before, GW's loss is DR's and EW's gain :)

Hi!

All too true! I fully expect EW and DRM to capitalize on having no real competition on the 6mm sci-fi front!

As for LoTR's, I don't know. I guess we'll never know.But it seems to me even before it came along GW wasn't taking epic seriously, even when Epic A was in the making. I think it has more to do with their lack of enthusiasm that a competing product line.

Sigh, some questions just dont have answers.....  :(

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 Post subject: Andy Hall on SG future
PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2007 4:33 am 
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(Moscovian @ Oct. 08 2007,19:19)
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FYI when I reach 40 signatures I'll be submitting the petition to Andy.  We are at 39 right now.

Hi!

By the way, I wanted to mention that it takes a lot of guts to do what your trying to do and post it on the SG forums.

I respect initiative and action to back up words.

Kudos to you sir!

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 Post subject: Andy Hall on SG future
PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2007 4:46 am 
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What amount does BFG stand for in sales?

On Epic Armageddon:
Maybe GW didn't go full steam on this system since Netepic already gained a lot of following as a fan-driven system?

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 Post subject: Andy Hall on SG future
PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2007 6:44 am 
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Seems unlikely....if they'd made a decent game and supported it properly all us NetEpicers probably would have come over.  Alas they did neither.

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 Post subject: Andy Hall on SG future
PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2007 9:56 am 
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(Heresiarch @ Oct. 09 2007,19:11)
QUOTE

(alansa @ Oct. 08 2007,05:44)
QUOTE
Further I don't believe anyone has any right to berate GW just because they allowed their hopes and wants to get in the way of reasonable expectations.

:laugh:

Expectations? I'm afraid to say GW did nothing but fulfill exactly some of our expectations. Which would be do a half ass job of it until they cancel any support.

Offloading it onto the fans isn't support by GW it's a cop-out as well I might add. by that standard they may have well just pointed people directly to NetEpic in the first place.

So as it would appear they were indeed "reasonable" expectations after all.

You're right there Heresiarch. There are some, like me, and you it would seem, who expected nothing. (Though I for one was pleasantly surprised we got anything at all!)

There are others who expected EA to herald the glory days of SM2/TL and are bitterly dissappointed . I don't believe Jervis or GW ever promised that.

They could, however, have done a better job of explaining that the extra and more ambitious plans for epic (on top of the core game) where more an ambition than a iron-clad promise.





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 Post subject: Andy Hall on SG future
PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2007 12:59 pm 
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(primarch @ Oct. 09 2007,23:33)
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(Moscovian @ Oct. 08 2007,19:19)
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FYI when I reach 40 signatures I'll be submitting the petition to Andy. ?We are at 39 right now.

Hi!

By the way, I wanted to mention that it takes a lot of guts to do what your trying to do and post it on the SG forums.  I respect initiative and action to back up words. Kudos to you sir!

Primarch

Thanks.  I did it for two reasons:
1. We need to move forward if Epic is going to survive as a game. This is my selfish motivation - I want people to play against!

2. I like Greg Lane. This may seem counterintuitive but as the discussions here and on SG went on, some not so nice things started to bubble up to the surface.  The petition was coming no matter what.  I wanted to be in control of it so nothing personal was said about Greg, so I initiated it.

Besides, what are they going to do? Tell me not to post? Call me a bad person? Disagree? I don't consider it gutsy simply because there is little at risk here (besides my friendship with Greg that is).  However, it seems that not a lot of people agree with the petition otherwise there would easily be a hundred signatures.  That's okay too.  The real purpose behind it is to stir Andy to action in any form and I doubt even this will work with such a low turn out.

But either way we win.  If Andy does nothing then the community sees that he isn't interested and we move forward with NetEA.  If Andy does something then the ERC gets revamped and people get the revised rules as we were initially promised.

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 Post subject: Andy Hall on SG future
PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2007 3:39 pm 
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Yes, Good job, "M" ! And if they are going to discuss E:A, they should do it here !  SG has "turned a Nelson's eye" to Epic ... Like talking to my Dog about politics ... she looks at me ... then walks over to her food bowl ...  ???

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 Post subject: Andy Hall on SG future
PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2007 3:49 pm 
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(Legion 4 @ Oct. 10 2007,16:39)
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Like talking to my Dog about politics ... she looks at me ... then walks over to her food bowl ...  ???

Heh - she's got her priorities right, I guess  :;):  :p  :p  :p  :devil:

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 Post subject: Andy Hall on SG future
PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2007 3:52 pm 
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Indeed ... much the same way SG treats Epic ! :;):

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 Post subject: Andy Hall on SG future
PostPosted: Thu Oct 11, 2007 12:30 am 
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(blackhorizon @ Oct. 09 2007,23:46)
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What amount does BFG stand for in sales?

On Epic Armageddon:
Maybe GW didn't go full steam on this system since Netepic already gained a lot of following as a fan-driven system?

Hi!

Doubtful. I just believe that at the decisional level, GW doesn't believe supporting epic is in their best interest. When/if/how/why the many change this stance is anybodies guess.

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 Post subject: Andy Hall on SG future
PostPosted: Thu Oct 11, 2007 12:32 am 
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(blackhorizon @ Oct. 09 2007,23:46)
QUOTE
What amount does BFG stand for in sales?

On Epic Armageddon:
Maybe GW didn't go full steam on this system since Netepic already gained a lot of following as a fan-driven system?

Hi!

No clue on what percentage BFG is. Its safe to say however it may not even reach one full percent of overall sale since supposedly half was due o epic. That leaves about 2.5% for ALL remaining SG games. So that leaves little room for BFG to have scored high.

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