(Markconz @ Oct. 07 2007,19:52)
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(primarch @ Oct. 07 2007,20:54)
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I view threads about epic's "death" with a certain amount of humor, since, for practical purposes epic has been "dead" since 1997. Can you go now to most LGS and find people playing epic? No. Can you go to you LGS in most major US cities and find epic minis? No. For that matter do most GW STORES have it in stock? No. Has there been a complete epic version with a FULL available epic line in the last ten years? No. "Dead" might mean a different thing to different people. But based on current unquestionable facts, perhaps we may be "rationalizing" it a wee bit much.
We are the "worshipers" of a dead game. I have internalized this and accepted this years ago. The problem is we had a past of glory and its a bitter pill to swallow.
For practical purposes EA is very much alive and that is the point.
It's only for highly abstract theoretical purposes that it could be considered dead as you say, in some sense of 'heh wouldn't it be great if GW put it in White Dwarf or sold it in GW stores'. Really? GW's support of Epic is still better than that provided by most game companies, and sorry but I find the idea of playing Epic in a shop abhorrent anyway. Buying from a shop? Why would I bother with traffic and time and nuisance when I can buy it in a few seconds online?
Practically people still play EA, more or less than used to play SM depending on where in the world you happen to be. And like I've said do you have any idea if more total people played SM than play EA now? I doubt it myself. It's active at my club, (which has a bar and restaurant and isn't filled full of GW creatures and redshirts) and more people are playing it now than ever played SM.
The rules are in a much better format than GW's 'we've just sculpted a unit so lets make another set of crappy special rules to sell them and put them in White Dwarf' (quite possibly the worst and most aggravating way to design a rule set).
The thing lacking is tyranids, and a few chaos things. But then there is Tau, and Feral Orks, and Siegemasters, and the extra FW gubbins, and better rule availability, so things are not nearly as crappy as some people would love to make out. Frankly I think view happens only when you view things from the point of view of pre-internet business primitivism, and in a very subjective way Ie current GW core games vs SG, as opposed to SG vs all the other games out there in general.
I guess we'll agree to disagree on this. Like I said we can argue semantics forever. But the marketing realities are there. No support from the game company equals "Dead". IF you cant buy it from the store you usually go or on a non-GW online store you're not going to get a thriving player base.
Epic's player base has been slowly eroding since its 1997 golden era peak. Posts I have seen at the usual GW haunts tell of people who haven't touched their epic stuff in years, are selling them, or would like some other rules to use them. All in all its at its lowest point since the game first came out in 1988-89.
Its hard to put a smiley face on that.
In business as in games, if your not growing.... your dying.
Primarch
