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[BatRep] Steel Legion vs Tyranids

 Post subject: [BatRep] Steel Legion vs Tyranids
PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2007 2:02 am 
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Well, we were able to fit in two games of EPIC this afternoon (and one game of MYTHOS).  The first was Steel Legion vs Tyranids, which will be detailed here, and the other was Steel Legion vs Scions of Iron, which will be detailed elsewhere.

Here we go!

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 Post subject: [BatRep] Steel Legion vs Tyranids
PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2007 2:05 am 
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Rules Used

Fearless units destroyed if end withdrawal move in enemy zone of control, may "stand ground" and not move.

Enemy formations not "directly involved" in an assault  may not be considered intermingled.

One Commissar per 450 points
Tyranids 7.4.1
Mycetic Spores 25 points

Armies Used

Heavy Mechanized Battalion - 3000 points

Mechanized HQ
1 Supreme Commander
12 Infantry
7 Chimera
1 Hydra
2 Snipers
1 Chimera
1 Commissar

Tank Company - (BTS Goal)
9 Leman Russ
1 Vanquisher
1 Hydra
1 Commissar

Mech Infantry Company
1 Commander
12 Infantry
7 Chimera
1 Hydra
2 Snipers
1 Chimera
1 Commissar

Super-Heavy Tank Company 1
3 Shadowswords
1 Commissar

Super-Heavy Tank Company 2
3 Baneblades
1 Commissar

Thunderbolt Squadron
2 Thunderbolts

(Turns out we forgot to actually put the IG Snipers and their Chimeras on the table, so the Steel Legion was playing 150 points "down".)


Tyranid Nexus - 3000 points - (BTS Goal - 7 Synapse Creatures)

Nexus Swarm 1
1 Hive Tyrant
2 Tyranid Warriors
4 Carnifex
2 Dactylis
4 Biovores
3 Zoanthropes
1 Malefactor

Nexus Swarm 2
1 Hive Tyrant
2 Tyranid Warriors
1 Malefactor
2 Harupsex
3 Zoanthropes
4 Gargoyles
4 Hormagaunts
4 Raveners
4 Termagants

Assault Swarm
3 Tyranid Warriors
8 Gargoyles
8 Hormagaunts
8 Raveners
8 Termagants

Lictor Swarm 1
3 Lictors

Lictor Swarm 2
3 Lictors

4 Lesser Synapse Nodes

8 Mycetic Spores





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 Post subject: [BatRep] Steel Legion vs Tyranids
PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2007 3:12 am 
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Deployment:

Both Lictor Swarms and all five Lesser Nodes were kept in reserve.

Steel Legion had no garrisons.

Tyranids garrisoned Nexus Swarm 1 on the fortified hill and put them on overwatch.
Remaining deployment as shown below:





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 Post subject: [BatRep] Steel Legion vs Tyranids
PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2007 3:28 am 
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Turn 1

No teleports

Strategy Roll: Steel Legion

The Leman Russ Company doubles forward, just out of Tyranid range, and hammers Nexus Swarm 1 with all they've got? and do no damage.

Nexus 1 responds by sustaining fire on the closely packed Shadowswords and Mechanized Infantry? places 2 Blast markers on each, and kills a single Infantry stand? what a great start to the turn!  *laugh*

The Shadowswords attempt to advance, but have some comm trouble and just fire on Nexus Swarm 1, evaporating 2 Carnifex and 1 Malefactor.

Nexus Swarm 2 then marches forward into the ruins of the "T"-shaped building, and loses a Haruspex to an open manhole.

The Baneblades then double on Nexus Swarm 1 and knock out 1 Biovore, 1 Dactylis, and 1 Zoanthrope!

Assault Swarm 1 prepares to march, but fails, and just mills about in the woods near the Tyranid Blitz

The Thunderbolts don't feel that they are needed and stand down.

The Mechanized HQ mounts up and doubles on Nexus Swarm 1 and kills a Carnifex.

The Mechanized Infantry Company marches right into the middle of the fortress on the hill?

End of Turn:

All Steel Legion formations rally.

Nexus Swarm 1 uses a Spore to get a Haruspex.

Nexus Swarm 2 uses a Spore to get a Malefactor.

The Assault Swarm uses a Spore to get? a Dactylis.

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 Post subject: [BatRep] Steel Legion vs Tyranids
PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2007 3:50 am 
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Turn 2

Lictor Swarm 1 shows up in a position to harass the Tank Company and the Shadowswords while Lesser Node 1 pops up in the ruins near the Imperial Blitz.


Strategy Roll: Tyranids

Lictor Swarm 1 pounces on the Shadowswords, going for their weak backsides. ?

One Lictor slashes a fuel line causing a massive explosion that crisps the Lictor. ?The Commissar gets out and kills another Lictor in close combat, and the final Lictor is gunned down as well? *sigh* ?The Imperials clean the bug juice off and reposition themselves slightly.

The Assault Swarm gets ready to rock? and then stays in place and the Dactylis puts 2 BM on the Mechanized Infantry Company.

The Baneblades rumble up to advance on Nexus 1, scoring nine hits, but only managing to kill 1 Biovore and 1 Zoanthrope.

The Mechanized Infantry advance to take more of the fort and kill 1 Tyranid Warrior from Nexus Swarm 1.


Battered from almost all sides, Nexus Swarm 1 also tries to sustain fire, but fails, so they drop spores on the Baneblades and inflict 4 Blast markers.

The wounded Shadowsword Company doubles on Lesser Node 1, and easily kills it.

Nexus Swarm 2 gets ready to attack the Baneblades? but it too gets confused and only shoots to put a Blast marker on them. ?(Wow, that was a lot of "1"s? I guess I had it coming, last Tyranid game I failed a *single* activation in four turns. ?*sigh*)

The Thunderbolts strafe Nexus 1 to no effect.

The Regimental HQ mounts up? and engages Nexus 1 in a clipping firefight, staying in their tanks and getting support from the Mechanized Infantry!

The Steel Legionaires' Chimeras get hit three times? but the armour holds and they rout the Tyranids, only a single Tyranid Warrior and a Carnifex escapes towards Nexus 2. ?The HQ scrambles into the cover of the fortifications.


The Tank Company doubles on Nexus 1 and kills 2 Gargoyles and 1 Hormagaunt?

End of Turn:

All Steel Legion formations rally.

Nexus Swarm 1 uses a Spore to get 2 Gargoyles and 1 Zoanthrope.

Nexus Swarm 2 uses a Spore to get a Haruspex and a Hormagaunt.

The Assault Swarm fails to spawn.





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 Post subject: [BatRep] Steel Legion vs Tyranids
PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2007 4:12 am 
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Turn 3

Lesser Node 2 tries to sprout near the Imperial Blitz but hits its head on a buried gas main and dies.

Lesser Node 3 tries the same thing, but succeeds!

Lesser Node 4 shows up near Imperial Objective 2

Lictor Swarm 2 reveals itself in a threatening position?



Strategy Roll: Tyranids!

Nexus Swarm 2 is ready to engage the nearby Tank Company? and my opponent graciously allows me a free re-roll of what was initially a "1"? I re-roll a "4".

It's ugly.

The Tyranids base all the tanks, splitting them open like tin cans. ?Two Raveners are ground down, and the Commissar takes out a Hormagant, but he's the only one to survive the carnage for the Imperials and makes haste away from the killing field.


Lictor Swarm 2 is ready? to sit on its butts. ?*SIGH* (My opponent felt one re-roll a turn was enough. *laugh*)

The Mechanized HQ advances on the Assault Swarm firing to little effect.

The Baneblades double on the tiny Nexus Swarm 1 and kill 1 Zoanthrope, 1 Gargoyle? and the last Tyranid Warrior of the Synapse Group.

The two surviving Brood creatures of Nexus Swarm 1 rush to engage the vile Baneblades with a little support from Nexus 2. ?The Commissar kills the Carnifex and the Imperials win quite easily.


The Assault Swarm finally gets into the action, rising like a tide to engage the intermingled Baneblades, Mechanized Infantry, and Regimental HQ in a massive conflict? though they lose the Dactylis on the way, due to a tree stump. ?*CLUNK*

The Tyranids score a whopping 21 hits, while the Imperials inflict a respectable 15. ?One Baneblade suffers 2DC damage, the Commissar's Baneblade suffers 1DC damage and 4 Chimeras, 1 Hydra, and 1 Infantry unit are also cut down. ?The Tyranids lose 5 Hormagaunts and 5 Raveners in the initial fray, and then 3 more Raveners and 2 Gargoyles as the entrenched Imperial push the Bugs back towards their Blitz, while securing Tyranid Objective 1.


The Shadowswords go Node hunting again and double to take out Lesser Node 3, clearing their Blitz.

The Thunderbolts missile attack Lesser Node 4 and take it out as well.

The Mechanized Infantry advance to spread out a bit and claim Tyranid Objective 2?

End of Turn:

Steel Legion 2 (BTS, T-n-H) vs Tyranids 0 (none)





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 Post subject: [BatRep] Steel Legion vs Tyranids
PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2007 4:46 am 
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(Hena @ Jun. 04 2007,04:39)
QUOTE
Interesting battle. I kinda expected that Intermingled assault on turn 3. Had it succeeded IG would lost quite much.


Yep, it was a scene right out of Starship Troopers... *laugh* ?But getting those IG out of the fortifications was a bit tough to the 'Nids. ?Was a close fight, and having the Commissars in the fray really helped the Imperials a *lot*. ?*laugh*

And what's with the 7.4.1, eh? You holding back from us, are you :D?


I'm never sure how often to release updates; I always start working on the next one (and hopefully clearing up typos!) as soon as I've posted the latest. ?I just keep a "working draft" with all the changes that come up as people play/discuss the most recent list.

The only "7.4.1" change I was using in this battle was the Mycetic Spores - 25 points change.





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 Post subject: [BatRep] Steel Legion vs Tyranids
PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2007 6:03 am 
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Great report and those new fortifications look terrific! :D

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 Post subject: [BatRep] Steel Legion vs Tyranids
PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2007 2:20 pm 
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(Markconz @ Jun. 04 2007,06:03)
QUOTE
Great report and those new fortifications look terrific! :D

Thanks, it was a lot of fun, even with failed activations a-plenty!  *laugh*

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 Post subject: [BatRep] Steel Legion vs Tyranids
PostPosted: Tue Jun 05, 2007 5:07 pm 
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Chroma:  As much as I hate to do it, I have another round of "why'd you do that?" questions.

Setup:  Just a comment.  It looks a little heavier than normal GT terrain.  That's not a problem, but facing mech IG, the terrain should favor tyranids.

Objectives:  Why did you place the objectives where you did?

The IG blitz went down first and was good for you regarding the proximity to strong cover.  I would have suggested placing the Nid blitz directly across, right behind the hill with the tower.  This serves several purposes.  It starts to concentrate the action in a smaller area, which favors the Nids.  Plus, it concentrates action near one board edge, making a line easier.  It is also highly constricted by LoS, which makes it ideal for a Node grab.  Finally, the terrain on that end of the board looks like it's a little thin on the Nid side but strong in the middle/IG side.  That means a quick opening move puts you across the "killing field" and into cover with restricted LoS.

As noted, constricted areas favor the Nids.  I would suggest keeping the T&H objectives close together.  With a normal deployment, bringing them back near the center line means you can reach them quickly, putting the enemy on the defensive.  It also makes it easier to push past them, knowing Nodes can pick them up if you've pushed too far forward.

If your opponent wants to run his T&H over on the opposite board edge at that point, let him.  He only has companies so if he wants to take them he has to divert a serious amount of his army to do so.  Divide and conquer.

In the building/ruins terrain, you have the advantage.  You are mostly infantry and walkers.  He is mostly vehicles and even the infantry have vehicles with them.

Nodes:  Just a strategy note here.  I think 2 of each are better than 5 LSNs.  GSNs are much harder and chances are you'll need to keep one of the backfield objectives covered.  They are more than worth the difference in price.  Don't bring them in without a well-defined purpose.  Most of the time it should be Turn 3, with placement based on what you will need to do to win that turn.

===

Obviously, it's a radically different game with such a different objective setup, but I still have a few questions, mostly starting in turn 2.

Lictors:  I don't understand the placement.  Russ are a threat, but the Shadowswords can't do very much to you.  I also don't understand activating them first.  If they sit there the enemy has to react to them.  That's their purpose.  Assaulting with them was likely to result in exactly what happened.  At the risk of sounding demeaning, you used your activation to kill them off so your enemy didn't need to.

Also, it seems to me that the Mech infantry were a much greater threat.  It seems to me that placing them in between the two infantry formations would have been advantageous.  You could have forced some of the formations to be cleared due to ZoC.  It prevents the Reg HQ from Sustain fire, so you could move the lagging Swarm out and into the fight, possibly even leaving part of it in the open if necessary.  If either of the companies uses an activation to clear them, it relieves considerable pressure from the nearby Nexus swarm.  Before knowing who won strategy (which you had a good chance of winning), it sets up the possibility of you doing a move/fire/assault with the Nexus and the Lictors.

Was firing on the Baneblades driven by LoS issues?  It seems with the HQ in range to assault with major support that placing a BM on them would have been priority.

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 Post subject: [BatRep] Steel Legion vs Tyranids
PostPosted: Tue Jun 05, 2007 5:54 pm 
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(nealhunt @ Jun. 05 2007,17:07)
QUOTE
Chroma: ?As much as I hate to do it, I have another round of "why'd you do that?" questions.

No problemo! ?*laugh*

Objectives: ?Why did you place the objectives where you did?

That means a quick opening move puts you across the "killing field" and into cover with restricted LoS.

I specifically didn't want to go through that "killing field" area, even on a first move; with two very mobile Mechanized formations, the road could've had them on my "out of cover" Assault swarm, probably on Turn 1. ?I favoured having the "fortified hill" as a solid LOS blocker.

As noted, constricted areas favor the Nids. ?I would suggest keeping the T&H objectives close together. ?With a normal deployment, bringing them back near the center line means you can reach them quickly, putting the enemy on the defensive. ?It also makes it easier to push past them, knowing Nodes can pick them up if you've pushed too far forward.

If your opponent wants to run his T&H over on the opposite board edge at that point, let him. ?He only has companies so if he wants to take them he has to divert a serious amount of his army to do so. ?Divide and conquer.
While my opponent placed the two Tyranid side objectives close together, I went for the deeper, 4 foot "split", to try and split his army. ?I knew I'd be focusing on the "tan" portion of the battlefield, especially with the Tyranid side objectives so close together. ?With Imperial Objective 2 placed off to the side, my opponent would have to divert one of his precious formations even to go take out a lone Node.

Against an army with larger formations, I don't like placing the T-n-H objectives to close together as one formation can control/contest both of them on occasion? I don't like making it easier for my opponent! ?*laugh*

In the building/ruins terrain, you have the advantage. ?You are mostly infantry and walkers. ?He is mostly vehicles and even the infantry have vehicles with them.
The main problem is that the walkers can't get into the buildings! ?*laugh* ?This became frustratingly apparent when it was discovered that Carnifex and Assault Spawn can't actually close combat units in Bunkers, since they can't get in! ?In fact, if a Bunker is filled (three unit), even assaulting infantry can't get in at them! ?Since we've played so rarely with fortifications, it was an odd thing to discover in the heat of battle.

Nodes: ?Just a strategy note here. ?I think 2 of each are better than 5 LSNs. ?GSNs are much harder and chances are you'll need to keep one of the backfield objectives covered. ?They are more than worth the difference in price. ?Don't bring them in without a well-defined purpose. ?Most of the time it should be Turn 3, with placement based on what you will need to do to win that turn.
I haven't used the Greater Nodes that often, I probably should.

I went with some earlier turn Lesser Nodes in the hope of spawning creatures in the IG backfield as well as being a "distraction" to the enemy.

===

Lictors: ?I don't understand the placement. ?Russ are a threat, but the Shadowswords can't do very much to you. ?I also don't understand activating them first. ?If they sit there the enemy has to react to them. ?That's their purpose. ?Assaulting with them was likely to result in exactly what happened. ?At the risk of sounding demeaning, you used your activation to kill them off so your enemy didn't need to.
Well, I never expected to go first? it's just an assumption I work with when fielding Tyranids, and sometimes that limits me.

I actually feared the Shadowswords as "synapse killers" against whittled down swarms or Nodes. ?I didn't think I could take the Russes with the Lictors and, if I didn't activate them, the Shadowswords could just back up and blast them, so, I felt, it was "use 'em or lose 'em" at the time and I wanted to make some dent with them, even the Thunderbolts might have been able to see them off.

As well, I really wasn't used to playing with so few swarms/formations, so that put me off a bit. ?My opponent certainly had formations to "stall" with at the start of the game.

Also, it seems to me that the Mech infantry were a much greater threat.
Yes, in retrospect, harassing the Mech HQ and Infantry would?ve been a better placement, though, again, the T-bolts could've cleared them before they could do something. ?Against such big formations, I just see the Lictors getting gunned down, even if the enemy is forced to base them.

One thing I *do* have to try and remember, is using Nexus Groups and Lictors in combined assaults. ?It seems combined assaults are rare with Tyranids, but I have to keep it in mind with Lictor placements.

Was firing on the Baneblades driven by LoS issues? ?It seems with the HQ in range to assault with major support that placing a BM on them would have been priority.
Yep, it was LOS, the "fort" in the middle of the fortified section blocked it for the firing units in Nexus 1.

Thanks for the questions, Neal!

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 Post subject: [BatRep] Steel Legion vs Tyranids
PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2007 6:03 am 
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You can close assault a full bunker - you are in essence fighting your way in.

Tough luck with the av's though.

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 Post subject: [BatRep] Steel Legion vs Tyranids
PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2007 12:29 pm 
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(The_Real_Chris @ Jun. 06 2007,06:03)
QUOTE
You can close assault a full bunker - you are in essence fighting your way in.

How can you do this?

If it's not "full" I can understand, but it is, can you just but the attackers "on top" of it or what? ?If you can't "base" the enemy because of walls or such does it still count or do you just assume the attackers are reaching in to vision slits?

I still wish bunkers were weaponless war engines so they could be breached/collapses as opposed to *just* being terrain.





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 Post subject: [BatRep] Steel Legion vs Tyranids
PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2007 1:34 pm 
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Toss grenades in the firing slits, blow the doors etc.
It is like trenches. If you are say a battlewagon (tim) you can close assault a trench. You do not physically move in but you do enter CC and therefore 'enter' the trench (which for an AV requires a dangerous terrain test).

A rules interpretation would be terrain does not 'block units - well 10cm does - a bunker is not impassable to infantry and therefore the walls only exist to give a cover save to those within. They do not stop you getting in base to base etc.

And as to 'getting in' it is irrelavant to an attacker as long as you can get into close combat/firefight as they do not gain any cover save - only the defender does (so tyranid scouts 'calling out' siege troops is highly annoying!).

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