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Dark Angles

 Post subject: Dark Angles
PostPosted: Sun Jun 18, 2006 9:34 am 
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Anyway. Some ice DA ideas on the SG forum - heres a link.

And heres the short batrep i posted trying some of these ideas out.

Rules used
Space marine changes stuff (http://www.epic40k.co.uk/epicomms/ikonboard.cgi?act=ST f=73 t=6906 st=40) bar the ignore outnumbering suggestion.
The following DA special rules.
Intractable - Except Deathwing and the Ravenwing when you take a hold action you can't move (so out of coherancy ynits die) but all units in the formation become fearless till end of turn
Deathwing - 400 points for the formation of 4 terminators, gain Fearless
Ravenwing - 250 points - Any 5 of the following units: Bikes, Speeders
(All Ravenwing units gain a 3+ Armour Save and the Walker special ability.) Upgrades: Attack Bikes, Commander, Tornado, Typhoon

450 points Deathwing, Chaplain
825 points Deathwing, 4 Land Raiders, Hunter, Techmarine (Librarian counts as in LR)
250 points Ravenwing (Land Speeders)
200 points Thunderhawk
275 points Predator Destructors
400 points Tactical, Hunter, Lascannon Razorback
225 points Assault, Chaplain
175 points Assault
200 points Scouts, Heavy Bolter Razorback

Played 'Guard
'Russ, SC, Hydra, 2x Manticores, 2x infantry, Rough riders, Vultures, Baneblade (I think).

Experimental rules used
Barrage 3BP
To hit rule
Assault rule
Skimmer rule

2-0 to marines (Blitz and Take and Hold)

Turn 1 notable events - The Thunderhawk shot up the vultures a bit, the Land Speeders and Tactials soaked up the manticore fire not losing much, predators shoot up infantry to lure out the Leman Russ (and all died as a result) to be engaged on the double by the terminator LR formation, everyone else exchanged fire and moved.
Turn 2 notable events - The terminators teleported into assault range of some manticores and intermingled Vultures and cross fire position for the Leman Russ. The Terminatos in land Raiders crossfired said 'Russ, breaking them (a smooth move and the game winner). Risk the other formation with a blast marker to attack the intermingled Manticores and Vultures. Kill 2 Manticores and a Vulture but Commissars and BM defeat me.
Took withering fire from 'Guard (with scouts going intractable then dying to a man under fire fearless or no!), then for my final trick SC got attacked by Land Speeders and air assaulted with the survivors fleeing.
Turn 3 - More general fire exchanged (surviving manticore formation knocking out a tactical formation), marines secure blitz and another objective (wiping out the remianing infantry on it), screen off counter guard moves with the Land Speeders and assault marines. Oh lost pristine Assault marine formation to a rough rider charge!

End of game - Loses to marines pretty high, but outmanovered the Guard nicely The two 'cunning moves' plus a bit of luck with the Thunderhawk strike turn 1 won the game.

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 Post subject: Dark Angles
PostPosted: Sun Jun 18, 2006 11:48 am 
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Nice report- good to see some playtesting of these rules.

From your experience do you think anything needs tweaking in the right angled list?

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 Post subject: Dark Angles
PostPosted: Wed Aug 02, 2006 8:59 pm 
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And here is the all new shiny PDF...in color :)

http://s6.quicksharing.com/v/4384542/Ep ... 0.pdf.html

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 Post subject: Dark Angles
PostPosted: Wed Aug 02, 2006 11:04 pm 
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Great work Black Legion, the list looks really professional and I think the rusle look great too- flavoursome, capture the feel of the DA and dont look too overpowered.  Cant wait to take them on with my Whitescars!

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 Post subject: Dark Angles
PostPosted: Wed Aug 02, 2006 11:29 pm 
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Great you like it :)

Here a little update. I corrected a spelling error (added the "s" to "Dark Angels" in the header).

http://s16.quicksharing.com/v/8887643/E ... 0.pdf.html

And here in different colors. Instead of green/beige the armylistentries are in green/red. Which one do you prefere?

http://s16.quicksharing.com/v/9377658/E ... 0.pdf.html





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 Post subject: Dark Angles
PostPosted: Thu Aug 03, 2006 12:03 pm 
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Green and beige for sure, but then I like pastel colours  :;):

Its easier to read the green/beige as in the red/dreen both the background and text are dark.  In both cases id lighten the green somewhat to make the text more legible.

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 Post subject: Dark Angles
PostPosted: Sun Oct 01, 2006 3:18 pm 
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Any playtests yet?

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 Post subject: Dark Angles
PostPosted: Mon Oct 02, 2006 4:37 pm 
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For all who have trouble donwloading it:



The Dark Angels Space Marine Chapter


THE UNFORGIVEN

Since the founding of their Legion at the birth of the Imperium, the Space Marines of Dark Angels have been feared by their enemies and held in awe by those they protect. Stubborn and relentless in battle, ever vigilant and zealous in pursuit of their duties, the Dark Angels are among the Emperor's most faithful servants. Yet it was not always so. For ten millennia, the Dark Angels have harboured a sinister secret, an act so terrible and shameful it threatens everything the Dark Angels hold most dear - and may yet bring them eternal damnation.
Dark Angel Chapter, Progenitor Legion M.31


DARK ANGELS SPECIAL RULES:
Intractable

With the exception of the Deathwing and the Ravenwing, the Dark Angels follow standard Space Marine combat doctrine and their dogged resistance against overwhelming odds is legendary. In situations where even other Space Marines would fall back, the Dark Angels will fight to the bitter end rather than give ground to their foes. This is also reflected in their stubborn refusal to move in the face of the enemy, even in situations where it would sometimes be tactically beneficial for them to do so.
Because of this, all units of a Dark Angels formation, which carry out a Hold action, aren't allowed to move, even if some units of the formation are out of formation (and thus are destroyed, see 1.7.4 in the Epic: Armageddon Rulebook). Also all units in this formation gain Fearless for the remainder of the turn.
Units of the Ravenwing are excluded from this rule.

Deathwing
The 1st Company and all Captains (called Masters), Chaplains (called Interrogator Chaplains) and Librarians of the Dark Angels are members of the Deathwing. A group in the chapter who knows the dark secrets of the chapters past always on the hunt for the Fallen.
- all Characters and Terminator units gain the Fearless special ability

Ravenwing
The 2nd Company of the Dark Angels is known as the Ravenwing and consists only of Bikes, Attack Bikes and Land Speeders and thus form a highly mobile force of fast attack specialists.
- Ravenwing Bikes, Ravenwing Attack Bikes and all Ravenwing LandSpeeder variants gain a 3+ Save and the Walker special ability.

Using The Army List
The following army list allows you to field an army based on the Dark Angels Chapter which loosely follows the teachings of the Codex Astartes. It can also be used as a ?stand in? army list for other successor Space Marine Chapters of the Dark Angels such as the Angels of Absolution, the Angels of Redemption and Angels of Vengeance.
Space Marines are organised into small formations called detachments. Each detachment is made up of three or more units, and may also include a number of extra units called upgrades.
The detachments that may be taken in a Dark Angels army are shown on the chart that follows. The chart also shows what units comprise the detachment, what upgrades are allowed, and its points cost. For example, an Assault detachment consists of four Space Marine Assault units for 175 points, and may include the Commander and Vindicator upgrades at an additional cost in points.
Each upgrade that is taken adds to the cost of the detachment, as shown on the upgrade chart. The upgrade chart also lists the units that make up the upgrade. Note that these will sometimes replace units in the detachment they are taken for, and sometimes takes the form of additional units for the detachment. Each upgrade may be taken once per formation. For example, an Assault detachment could include one Commander and one Vindicator. If both were taken it would cost 175 + 50 +75 = 300 points.
Dark Angels Space Marine armies may be supported by Imperial Navy aircraft and Titan Legion battle groups. A maximum of up to a fourth of the points available to the army may be spent on these formations.

SPECIAL RULE
6.3.1 Space Marine Transports


The Space Marines are a highly mobile army.
Because of this, the points cost of a detachment usually includes enough Rhino transport vehicles to transport it and any upgrades that have been taken. The number of Rhinos will always be the minimum needed to carry the formation, you can?t take extras along to cover any losses!
Note that many formations don?t receive Rhinos, usually because they can?t fit into them. Detachments that come with Rhinos will be noted as having ?plus transport? in the units section of the army list opposite.
Also note that you don?t have to take Rhinos if you don?t want to. If you?d rather field the formation on foot instead, so it can act as a garrison for example, or be transported in a Thunderhawk Gunship, then you may do so.
In addition, you may choose to replace a detachment?s Rhinos with Drop Pods. If you do this then the detachment will enter play in a Drop Pod using the rules for planetfall (see section 4.4). Note that if you choose to do this you will also require at least one Space Marine Strike Cruiser or Battle Barge to deploy the drop pods from.

DARK ANGELS ARMY LIST
Dark Angels Space Marine armies have a strategy rating of 5. All Dark Angels and Titan Legion formations have an initiative rating of 1+. Imperial Navy aircraft formations have an initiative rating of 2+. The ?They Shall Know No Fear? rule applies to all Dark Angels formations (see 5.1.1).

DARK ANGELS DETACHMENTS
DETACHMENT/UNIT/UPGRADES ALLOWED/POINTS COST
- Assault/Four Assault units/Commander, Vindicator/175points
- Bike/5 Bike units/Commander, AttackBike/200points
- DeathwingTerminator/Four Deathwing Terminator units/Commander, LandRaiders, Dreadnought, Vindicator/400points
- Devastator/Four Devastator units plus transport Commander, Razorbacks, Dreadnought, Hunter, LandRaider /250points
- LandRaider/Four Land Raiders/Commander, Vindicator/400points
- LandSpeeder/Five LandSpeeders/Commander, Typhoon/Tornado/200points
- LandingCraft/One LandingCraft/None/350points
- Predators/Four Predators (may choose either Annihilators or Destructors or a combination of the two)/Commander, Vindicator/300points
- Ravenwing/Five Ravenwing units (may choose either Ravenwing Bikes or Ravenwing AttackBikes or Ravenwing LandSpeeders or a combination of the three)/Commander, Ravenwing Tornado/50points
- Scout/Four Scout units plus transport/Commander, Razorbacks, Sniper/150points
- Strike Cruiser/One StrikeCruiser/BattleBarge/200points
- Tactical/Six Tactical units plus transport/Commander, Hunter, Dreadnought, Razorback, Vindicator/300points
- Thunderhawk/One ThunderhawkGunship/None/200points
- Vindicator/Four Vindicators/Commander/300points
- Whirlwind/Four Whirlwinds/Commander, Hunter/300 points


DARK ANGELS UPGRADES
UPGRADE/UNITS/COST
- Attack Bike/Replace any number of Bike units with 1 Attack Bike each/Free
- BattleBarge/Replace StrikeCruiser with BattleBarge/150points
- Commander/Add one Dark Angel Commander character to a unit in the formation. The Dark Angel Commander may be a Master, Librarian or Interrogator Chaplain. One Dark Angel Commander in the army may be a Supreme Commander/55points (50 points if added to a Deathwing Terminator Detachment, +50 points if Supreme Commander)
- Dreadnought/Add one or two Dreadnoughts/50points each
- Hunter/Add one Hunter/75points
- Land Raiders/Add up to four Land Raiders/100points each
- Razorbacks/Replace any number of Rhinos with 1 or 2 Razorbacks each /+25points per Razorback
- Sniper/One Scout unit may be given the Sniper ability/+25points
- RavenwingTornado/Replace any number of Ravenwing LandSpeeders with 1 Ravenwing LandSpeederTornado each/+10points each
- Typhoon/Tornado/Replace any number of LandSpeeders with 1 LandSpeeder Tornado or Typhoon each/+25 points per Typhoon +10 points per Tornado
- Vindicator/Add one or two Vindicators/75points each

IMPERIAL NAVY AIRCRAFT
FORMATION/COST
- Two Thunderbolt Fighters/150points
- Two Marauder Bombers/30 points

TITAN LEGION BATTLEGROUPS
FORMATION/COST
- One Warlord Class Titan/850points
- One Reaver Class Titan/650points
- One to Two Warhound Titans/250points each

SPECIAL SCENARIO
The Holy Mission


The Dark Angels are always on the task to find the Fallen or individuals who might know something about the whereabouts of one of the Fallen.
Choose randomly one unit with a Character in the opponents army (obviously not if the opponent plays Necrons or Tyranids). This Character is a Fallen or knows something of the whereabouts of a Fallen.
The destruction/survival of the unit with this Character is now an additional goal for Victory Conditions.
If the Dark Angel players manage to destroy the unit with this Characters he achieve this goal.
If the unit with this Character survives its player achieve this goal.





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 Post subject: Dark Angles
PostPosted: Wed Feb 28, 2007 6:18 pm 
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Got the new Dark Angels Codex today. Expect some updates to the armylist soon :)

At a first glance Deathwing AND Ravenwing gain Fearless. Deathwing Terminators will have only one AssaultCannon attack. Ravenwing has the Scout-Ability in WH40k but i think Infiltrate for a Formation of Units with basic move of 35cm and CC4+ would be too good so i think i will give the Ravenwing Scout instead.

Intractable is gone too but i think i will keep it for fluff reasons.

Stay tuned :)

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 Post subject: Dark Angles
PostPosted: Wed Feb 28, 2007 10:30 pm 
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Remember fearless in 40k is different to epic - I thinks like fearless are best added as a last resort - check out the chaos lists for the problems it causes.

I mean is fearless bikers really possible to point effectively? And whats more why would Ravenwing be immune to hackdown hits from a failed assault.

Further how does ATSKNF interact with fearless?

Scout wise remember scout doesn't mean the scout ability, rather a tactical use - witness scout titans.

For ravenwing ideas check out the whitescar discussions, the other 'good' riders where several issues came up.

Just imagine for a moment a 5 strong unit of fearless bikes with scout........

And those chaos formations don't have ATSKNF which is getting a boost.

Why incidentally do you think they should be fearless anyway?

I would prefer terminators with ATSKNF actually - more firepower, less breaking. Fearless keeps you alive - ATSKNF keeps you fighting (until you break but thats being fixed with the leader idea).

So can normal T squads in 40k have 2 assault cannons?

Oh and you should start a new thread with your new suggestions, the joke at the top of this is somewhat old :)

A 5 strong squad all with leader would certainly be different. Kind of makes a mockery of the whole bm system in a way with ATSKNF :). You could give them that Tyranid ability instead!

So chaos cult marines never take moral tests or anything? I always saw fearless as nowt to do with moral - you still break in epic - rather to do with ability to retain organisation during assaults or coming under fire. the formation doesn't disnintergrate, rather some force keeps it together and keeps it moving.

Fearles sin 40k certainly seems different - an upgraded ATSKNF - whereas in Epic the two are quite different.

Edited to compress my posts into one and make thread shorter.

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 Post subject: Dark Angles
PostPosted: Wed Feb 28, 2007 10:32 pm 
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The fearless chaos formations are way bigger than the DarkAngels ones. I think the formations size is the problem here. Deathwings are small (4) but Ravenwing could be a problem (5+)

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 Post subject: Dark Angles
PostPosted: Wed Feb 28, 2007 10:58 pm 
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They have it in WH40k which is basically the same effect as in Epic.
In WH40k fearless units pass all leadershiptests automatically. They don't fall back, they can't be pinned and don't panik whatsoever. In effeckt their leadership is only used of certain psychic attacks force them to roll for it.
BUT: Deathwing and Ravenwing don't have ATSKNF in WH40k (they don't need it. ATSKNF enables them only to rally automatically after a withdrawal move after a failed leadership test, Fearless in WH40k replaces this).
Perhabs i will cancel ATSKNF form Deathwing and Ravenwing formations as Fearless is some kind of better.

Oh, and the Ravenwing will loose Walker and the better armorsave.  They don't have something similar in WH40k anymore.

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 Post subject: Dark Angles
PostPosted: Wed Feb 28, 2007 11:10 pm 
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Leader idea? Hmmm Terminator and Bike/AssaultBike/Landspeeder units with Leader each could be interesting...

Yes vanilla Terminator squads are 5-10 Terminators and can have 1-2 heavy weapons.
Or there are 5-10 Assault Terminators with Thunderhammer&Powershield or a pair of LighningClaws and no heavy weapons.

I will post a new thread with the updates armylist soon :)

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 Post subject: Dark Angles
PostPosted: Wed Feb 28, 2007 11:29 pm 
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Sure, but they are vulnerable to hackdown hits and can be broken. But if they rally or regroup then surely alle BM will be gone.

Unstoppable woulde be interesting too.
I suggested it for all chaos cult marine armies on the SG forum but no one seems to want it :D

Fearless in Epic seems to be both. Commissars in WH40k aren't fealress. They "only" have ledership 10. But if they are attached to a squad and its leader fails his leadership test then the commissar will execute him and the test is supposed to be passed :D

Cult CSM seem to don't care if they die as long as it is in the name of their god.
- Berzerkers are too crazed as to look for own casualties and will fight to their deaths because Khonre doesn't care whose blood flows.
- ThousandSons simply are automatons and will follow any orders they are given.
- Noise Marines ENJOY dieing as they enjoy all what they do.
- and Plaguemarines still don't care what will happen to them.

Titans/Gargant etc are too "aloft" as to be afraid about the tiny things which weasle around them. They simply walk along and crush all things they encounter under their feet.





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