Second bat rep for me with the Red Corsairs this time against another solid player from my group John using his WIP Baran Siegemaster list. John picked up 4th at this year's Cancon IIRC so he's a solid player and Baran are a solid gaurd variant. Paritcularly challenging for marines IMO because marines are looking for that tactical spot to hit to do maximum damage whist Baran are just hordes of crap with no single thing of any particular value.... Kind of fighting Da Blob.
Anyway here's the lists.
My Red Corsairs (Or black Corsairs as I call them)
Red Corsairs (3.4)
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RENEGADE WARBAND [375]
8 Chaos Space Marine units, Chaos Warlord, Chaos Hunter
RENEGADE WARBAND [325]
Chaos Lord, 4 Chaos Space Marine units, 4 Khorne Berzerker units
RENEGADE WARBAND [275]
8 Chaos Space Marine units, Sorceror Lord
TERMINATOR RETINUE [275]
Chaos Lord, 4 Terminator unit
CHAOS THUNDERHAWK [200]
1 Chaos Thunderhawk Gunship
CHAOS THUNDERHAWK [200]
1 Chaos Thunderhawk Gunship
ARMOURED COMPANY [250]
4 Chaos Predator, Chaos Hunter
BLOOD SLAUGHTERER PACK [225]
5 Blood Slaughterers
BLOOD SLAUGHTERER PACK [225]
5 Blood Slaughterers
CHOSEN [200]
6 Chaos Space Marine Units - all have the Scout ability
TWO HELL TALON FIGHTER-BOMBERS [225]
TWO HELL TALON FIGHTER-BOMBERS [225]
John's Baran Siegemasters
Incompertus, 3000 POINTS
Baran Siege Masters (NetEA Tournament Pack 2014)
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REGIMENTAL HQ [350]
Supreme Commander, 9 Siege Infantry, Griffon Battery (3 Griffons), Siege Infantry Platoon (6 Siege Infantry)
INFANTRY COMPANY [225]
Commander, 9 Siege Infantry, Griffon Battery (3 Griffons)
INFANTRY COMPANY [225]
Commander, 9 Siege Infantry, Griffon Battery (3 Griffons)
INFANTRY COMPANY [200]
Commander, 9 Siege Infantry, Sniper unit
INFANTRY COMPANY [175]
Commander, 9 Siege Infantry
ARTILLERY BATTERY [150]
3 Götterdämmerung Howitzers, 3 Bruenhilde
ARTILLERY BATTERY [150]
3 Götterdämmerung Howitzers, 3 Bruenhilde
FLAK BATTERY [100]
3 Blitzen AA Guns, Gun Emplacements
FLAK BATTERY [100]
3 Blitzen AA Guns, Gun Emplacements
FLAK BATTERY [100]
3 Blitzen AA Guns, Gun Emplacements
HEAVY TANK PLATOON [300]
6 Ragnarok Heavy Tanks
LIGHT TANK PLATOON [150]
6 Siegfried Light Tanks
LIGHT TANK PLATOON [150]
6 Siegfried Light Tanks
SUPER-HEAVY TANK PLATOON [200]
Shadowsword
DEATHSTRIKE MISSILE BATTERY [200]
2 Deathstrike Missile Launchers
FORTIFIED POSITION [75]
Up to 50cm trenches, 50cm razor wire, plus 6 Gun Emplacements.
FORTIFIED POSITION [75]
Up to 50cm trenches, 50cm razor wire, plus 6 Gun Emplacements.
FORTIFIED POSITION [75]
Up to 50cm trenches, 50cm razor wire, plus 6 Gun Emplacements.
With 27 activations between us this bat rep was a long one to write!
Some shots of the overall setup and the two main concentrations of Baran for me to deal with. The bits of paper are marking Baran Barbed wire/Trenches/Bunkers (usually in that order as you get further away from the Chaos Forces. Basically everything Baran started in some sort of pit, he has many.
The Trench formations on my RHS leading back to the Baran Blitz in the middle of that horde on the baseline
The theoretically softer fortifications on my left hand side gaurding an objective from each side and with the shadowsword/arty/deathstrikes/scout tanks on the back edge.
Turn 1Chaos terminators teleport in to go for an early big hit.
But lose the initiative roll off and get nuked and broken by the Shadowsword
Marines - empty thunder hawk comes in for a snipe breaking the Deathstrikes
Baran - sustain with artillery hitting 3 marines from BTS and killing 2
Marines - scouts advance and shoot the Baran AA on my left killing 1 and breaking them.
Marines - retain and engage Baran on my left with thunder hawk full of berserkers and manage to break a single unit.
Baran - sustain with 2nd artillery and kill a terminator wiping the formation out.
Marines - hell talon bombers strike the arty on the back left killing 2 and breaking them with the bonus kill of one scout tank and a blastie on the Shadowsword.
Baran - scout tanks engage the landed thunder hawk doing nothing but the support fire from the guardsmen do 5 hits killing the thunder hawk! (Photo)
Baran retain with guardsmen to put a blast marker on the marines occupying the bunker and break them
Marines - bombers come in to hit those unkillable gaurdsmen... Bombers hit 8 guys but kill 2... Rolling 5 ones....
Baran - initiative stalling - gaurdsmen on front right go over watch
Marines - BTS marines advance and put a blastie on the ragnaok tanks
Baran - AA batter at rear goes on over watch
Marines - advance right most unit against right most Gaurd copping 2 casualties from the over watching Gaurd
Baran - activate Siegfried tanks for an engage with the marines that just lost 2... Losing 2 marines to combat res and broken. Damn commissars.
Marine - Bloodslaughterers advance to go for a big turn 2 hit
Baran - sustain with infantry company
Marine - Bloodslaughterers advance for a big turn 2 hit fail to activate so advance and take a blastie
Baran - sustain with ragnaok tanks killing 2 blood slaughterers
Baran - BTS goes on overwatch
Rally phase - barren fail a few but rally front left AA, Deathstrikes and arty and clear blasties off a couple of things.
Marines rally all broken units!
(Photo) My rear attack on the bunker left bunker line clears them out after the terminators failed to do the same job but costs me the thunderhawk which dies to scout tanks with a commissar....
End of first turn LHS with marines occupying the Baran bunkers
End of first turn RHS with marines having not made much of a dent...
Turn 2Marines win initiative - Bloodslaughterers engage scout tanks and wipe them from the board.
Baran - sustain BTS infantry and bomb Bloodslaughterers with griffons breaking them.
Marines - thunder hawk with one blastie fails to activate
Baran arty sustain onto predators - hitting and killing 3.
Marines - berserker marine unit comes charging out of the bunkers they took and slaughter unkillable gaurdsmen which also breaks the AA and Siegfried tanks around them. They lose 2 in the process and get broken.
Baran arty (single gun) - sustains and puts a blastie on the marine unit my back left (4 stands left)
Marine thunder hawk cruises down the back and kills an AA gun breaking the unit.
Baran arty sustain and hit/kill 2 bases on marine BTS
Marine bombers attempt to kill the forward AA unit losing one but breaking them.
Baran gaurdsmen sustain with griffons on the Bloodslaughterers doing nothing
Marine bombers - break the arty on the back edge
Baran ragnaroks advance and kills the hunter breaking the BTS
Marines - rally small marine unit on RHS
Baran - Deathstrike sustains and kills a Bloodslaughterers
Marine scouts advance and kill off the last gaurdsmen from a broken unit
Baran Shadowsword sustains and picks off another Bloodslaughterer from the unbroken unit. Breaking them...
Aircraft fly off unmolested
Marines don't rally either Bloodslaughterer unit or the BTS (with a sup com) but do rally the last 3 air assaulting berserkers in the bunkers. Yay
Baran rallied 2 AA guns and Siegfried tanks on those damn bunkers again. Failed to rally 1 arty and 1 AA.
End of second turn left with less marines holding on to those bunkers!
Turn 3Marines win strategy and use marines in bunkers to destroy Siegfried tanks
Baran single arty piece kills a model from broken BTS killing 2 extra including sup com with blasties
Marine scouts engage the AA guns near bunkers on left wiping them from the board.
Baran ragnaroks advance and kill the last marine from BTS
Marine thunder hawk flies in and bombs the rear AA killing one and breaking them
Baran Shadowsword runs up to kill chaos marines in bunkers but fails to hit breaks them
Marine single bomber fails to activate.
Baran Deathstrike doubles up to put a blastie killing another marine
Marine double bombers fly down to bomb the broken arty on the back edge
Baran infantry double to put a blastie on the last bunker marine only to be reminded afterwards that he's fearless. Lulz.
Marine predators fail to activate and break
Baran BTS sustains to drop griffons onto broken Bloodslaughterers but don't hurt any
Marine - small unit triples forwards to get into enemy half
Baran infantry engage the small marine unit killing 2 with 5 troopers including the chaos lord who got snipered. Rude!
Marines would have lost here except berserkers in bunker rallied in the enemy half!
Marines rally 1 unit of slaughterers (the unit on the enemy board edge) and the predators. Everything else fails.
Baran rallied the AA units again.
End of turn 3 LHS - A single berzerker holds the bunkers surrounded by mountains of gaurd corpses....
End of Turn 3 RHS - 2 Bloodslaughters have survived to penetrate deep into striking distance of the enemy BTS! Will it be enough! No it won't!
Turn 4
Marines win strategy
Marine Bloodslaughterers engage Baran BTS killing 4 but losing on the roll off and breaking.
Marines retain and the single berserker engages the Shadowsword. Gets two hits but fails to hurt it and is broken by double numbers/commissar.
Baran BTS sustains to put a blastie onto broken marine unit killing it
Marines fail to activate double bombers.
Baran Shadowsword double forward anD kills the last bunkerzerker.
Marine single bomber breaks the Deathstrike
Baran infantry unit engages the last Bloodslaughterer and kill him with FF
Marine predators fail to activate and break again
Baran - single arty piece sustains to put a blastie on Marine scouts
Marine scouts fail to activate so just move up.
Baran ragnaroks fail to activate so shoot into broken Bloodslaughterers but kill none
Marine thunder hawk kills last Deathstrike.
Baran infantry in middle fail to activate.
Everything on both side rallies
Baran have BTS and Marines have nothing
Countback on points sees marines on 1325 and Baran on 1675 so a narrow win to Baran.
These useless Bloodslaughters which failed to activate in turn 1, got broken in 2 and haven't rallied are currently sitting about 30cm away from their own starting line just glaring at the siege tanks...
Overall thoughtsThat was my first game against Baran Siegemasters and they are a tough nut to crack. I used the phrase "pissing into to ocean" quite a few times because it really felt hard to make substantial headway. Over and again I would do damage only to not finish the units off and then have them rally. Basic plan for turn 1 was all about trying to balance the activation advantage they had but it never really come off. Now that said I reckon I could have beaten them but a few critical things went against me. The teleporting termies with 9 attacks killing on 3s should have put a huge dent in the Baran defence but just died for nothing instead. That meant that I needed to drop the thunder hawk full of marines that I'd planned to save for the BTS/blitz down there instead which did the damage eventually but cost me the thunder hawk etc etc. In fact I think that what happened to the termies in this game really highlights why they shouldn't be increased in points beyond the 275 of Black legion. They die so much more easily than Imperial ones and yes you can put them into a thunderhawk to avoid the teleporting issue I had her but guess what... that thunderhawk dies so much more easily than an imperial one too from blast markers. Sure in this case it was killed by insane dice from generic gaurdsmen but the point stands that one more blastie would have seen it 'broken' and two more after that would have killed it. The same cannot be said for loyal marines. Chaos is a far higher risk factor in these equations because of the as they interact with blast markers and this is never more noticable than with the units whose size we can't increase.
The blood slaughterer unit that failed to activate in round 1 took huge pressure off the Baran and in hindsight I should have used the sup com on that but who knows. In fact both blood slaughterers were disappointing because they broke and neither unit ever rallied even with the sup com reroll.
Ultimately the gaurdsmen fought s great attrition game and that plays into their strategy well. If I played again there's not much I would do differently except perhaps just accept that even if the termies fail to do their job I need to reserve the marines in thunderhawk to go after the blitz. Perhaps even load another unit in there and just go for it hard.
After my practice games with corsairs now I really don't see how anyone can say they are OP, they make big sacrifices in the lack of titan support for what they gain in thunderhawks and I really love the flexibility of the list. In terms of power level I would point anyone who thinks the Corsairs need a nerf towards the Emperors Children that just got approval. They can do everything flying assault wise that my list could do probably just trading terminators for the khorne assault troops or just making it a FF engage unit rather than a BC engage unit which is just as good IMO. Swap out the Blood Slaughters for Titans or knights and off you go. If anything they also get access to cheaper core options and better Daemons (including a WAY better Daemon Prince option) if that's what floats your boat.
Red Corsairs is a great army, themey and fun. I've never had an opponent complain about them which I can't say for all my armies! John will hopefully post his thoughts below.
Cheers
