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Markconz	Post subject: Ordinatus! Posted: Sat Aug 16, 2003 9:46 am
Purestrain Joined: Mon Jul 28, 2003 10:43 pm Posts: 7925 Location: New Zealand	Hmmm... interesting thread... When I played the first demo of Epic-A in Epic Magazine, I really liked it and was looking forward to its development and publication. Sadly I haven't played as much Epic-A as I would have liked to this year, as "real-world-stuff" keeps getting in the way. Fortunately I was pretty sure that the rules were going to be ok and I was more than happy to have the people I have met on the Yahoo lists, Epic40k.com, etc. fix the new E-A game up (Of course, then PG showed up and seemed to annoy a lot of people! ) I do know that Jervis replied directly to two E-mails I sent him early on... and that in spite of the small number of posts, I have made on the official forum, they seem to have impact and be worth doing. For example, my suggestions for the Tyranid list were largely taken up, and I feel a lot happier about the bugs now (though the "Expectorator" should really be a vehicle, so we can use our 'dead plucked chickens lying on their backs throwing eggs' - as Jervis described the Dactylis! Or rather an infantry-class model shouldn't have range 180cm weapons with artillery and disrupt abilities.) ? When it comes down to it though, I am about ready for the thing to just be published... Then I can do a page of house rules (including Titan weapon options is about the only one I can think of at the moment) and get on with it, without the rules changing every few weeks! I know most of my local Epic group have similar views. _________________ http://hordesofthings.blogspot.co.nz/
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primarch

Post subject: Ordinatus! Posted: Sat Aug 16, 2003 12:51 pm

Brood Brother Joined: Fri Feb 14, 2003 12:46 am Posts: 27069 Location: Edmond, Oklahoma USA

Hi! It is the "old guard fan-boys" who have tossed that argument around in the Epic-A playtest board. It is others who have used this as a shield to disguise the fact they have no other arguments to offer. Agreed, sometimes I'm too hard on poor ol' Jervis. You are correct in your observation since I have seen this comment on the posts of those people you have mentioned and only remember Jervis's "immediate negative response" regarding the OOP models. Unfortunately it seems they have taken that one instance and have run with it extending it to issues they may not fancy. You gotta really take pity on Jervis's position... ...damned if you do, damned if you don't! Primarch. _________________ Primarch The Primarchload Magnetized Titans Tutorial Net Epic Gold Heresy Rules

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primarch

Post subject: Ordinatus! Posted: Sat Aug 16, 2003 12:54 pm

Brood Brother Joined: Fri Feb 14, 2003 12:46 am Posts: 27069 Location: Edmond, Oklahoma USA

Hi! I've invested in the boards again and I want to see this change. Whether it's through PG becoming a "kinder gentler person" or another more kind person becoming moderator is no difference to me. What is important is that the boards change. Things are simply wrong at the moment. - Maksim-Smelchak. I think that your participation as well as the participation of the others on this list, Epic40k.co.uk, with the E-A Playtest forums may indeed bring about the change you seek if you keep up the renewed presence and activity you are showing now. Primarch. _________________ Primarch The Primarchload Magnetized Titans Tutorial Net Epic Gold Heresy Rules

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primarch

Post subject: Ordinatus! Posted: Sat Aug 16, 2003 12:59 pm

Brood Brother Joined: Fri Feb 14, 2003 12:46 am Posts: 27069 Location: Edmond, Oklahoma USA

Hi! Let's do our best to keep this thread from degenerating into attacks on Jervis or PG. Feel free to unload both barrels on Gandalf (he deserves it, the punk!) or me (smarmy self-righteous know-it-all Maksim!), but treat those guys with respect whether you feel they deserve it or not. - Maksim-Smelchak. Fair enough, I'll now switch my efforts and target Gandalf! Seriously though, the point should be heeded. I suspect that the problem will in time heal itself and things will get back on track. Hopefully all the banter will have pointed out the problem and now all parties will work to correct it. Jeez, I'm in a chipper mood today, eh? See! I told ya I'd open my goodwill six-pack! Primarch. _________________ Primarch The Primarchload Magnetized Titans Tutorial Net Epic Gold Heresy Rules

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primarch

Post subject: Ordinatus! Posted: Sat Aug 16, 2003 1:04 pm

Brood Brother Joined: Fri Feb 14, 2003 12:46 am Posts: 27069 Location: Edmond, Oklahoma USA

Hi! But you know what I like the most? That regardless of if we agree, disagree, or agree to disagree, we treat each other with respect. I can not say how rare this is on the net. For people who have such a wide range of beliefs we are a community here. And for that I will allways be grateful! - Dafrca. Oh I indeed DO know how rare it is, very VERY rare. As I mentioned before, this topic would have gone "grade A ballistic" anywhere else but here. I find my participation here valuable, precisely because there ARE dissenting opinions and views. It makes me think and reassess my notions regarding the game and realize that everything has value whether what you or I may think at the time is or is not that great. If we all agreed on everything, it be one boring place! And where's the fun it that? ? Primarch. _________________ Primarch The Primarchload Magnetized Titans Tutorial Net Epic Gold Heresy Rules

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primarch

Post subject: Ordinatus! Posted: Sat Aug 16, 2003 1:12 pm

Brood Brother Joined: Fri Feb 14, 2003 12:46 am Posts: 27069 Location: Edmond, Oklahoma USA

Hi! the problem with this approach is that what you think is "best" is not what I think is "best" nor is necessarily "best" if of course we can define "best". One of the "best" things about Epic40K for *ME* was the simplicity of the system and how everything was based on strategic detachments rather than individualising units - I had no problems with the fact that all Ork battlewagons (regardless of model) were the same as I felt the Ork detachment was important rather than an individual Bowelburna - my units didn't need to be differentiated within the rules even if the models were differentiated. I know that a lot of Epic players (old and new) do want more differentiated units and think that individualising and adding detail to units is the "best" way of going about this - I don't, we are never going to agree. Jimbo brings a point I have thought about for some time and that is of course "different strokes for different folks", but also that we should assume that the only sides in epic are "old school" and "new wave". There are a lot of epic players like Jimbo who were perfectly fine with epic40k and we should assume that this group will "automatically" convert or like the new version. They may not be as vocal as the old hands, but I have heard quite a few gamers say they were quite please with epic40k and find the heavier detailing unnesseary. Goes to show that there are indeed may "strata" of tastes in epic. You can please some of the people all of the time or all of the people some of the time, but you can never please all of the people all of the time!!!

My guiding principal on the net epic list for 6 years and what I always recommend Jervis should keep in mind. A very meaningful saying!

Primarch