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Dooglebug
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Post subject: Supported Infantry  Posted: Sat Feb 21, 2004 8:03 pm |
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fair enough to say that combined arms is the way forward, it undoubtably is, but in a game system like this the exact way of utilising combined arms within the framework of the rules is what should be questioned. I would personaly tend to keep to more or less vehicle only and more or less infantry only formations for the reason that formations can't split fire so will be either wasting at or ap fire. On the otherhand i think the skill comes in using formations of infantry and vehicles together in support of each other to cover each others weaknesses.
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iblisdrax
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Post subject: Supported Infantry Posted: Sat Feb 21, 2004 9:52 pm |
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It is harder to do under this system, Epic A, but I still like to have at least one tank co. with supporting infantry attached to help ward off assaults and BM.
my 2cents,
iblisdrax
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CrimsonFury
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Post subject: Supported Infantry Posted: Sat Feb 21, 2004 10:59 pm |
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| Quote (Dooglebug @ 21 2004 Feb.,19:03) | | fair enough to say that combined arms is the way forward, it undoubtably is, but in a game system like this the exact way of utilising combined arms within the framework of the rules is what should be questioned. I would personaly tend to keep to more or less vehicle only and more or less infantry only formations for the reason that formations |
I agree. In E:A I tend to keep my infantry and vehicles in seperate formations, but supporting each other. Not due to the lack of split fire, but becuase I find it more useful to be able to split the formations moveent when needed. eg infantry move onto one objective and tanks on the other.
Or if my russ tank comapny get assaulted by the enemy in close combat, next activiation I charge into a firefight with the infantry company sitting behind them  . That kind of thing is harder to if they are part of the same formation. If they were in the same formation i'd only get 6 infantry stands with a 5cm counter charge instead of a 13 infantry (more with upgrades) with a 15cm enage move.
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Shagrat Nutbraker
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Post subject: Supported Infantry Posted: Sat Feb 21, 2004 11:23 pm |
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Fair points one and all .. suppose its just applying real life tactics to the GW rules.
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Dooglebug
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Post subject: Supported Infantry Posted: Sun Feb 22, 2004 2:05 am |
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The point about the movement is also a good one. I hate having very slow units in a formation holding up faster ones. I like to get my moneys worth out a unit.
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Regards Dooglebug aka 'Da Bug'
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Legion 4
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Post subject: Supported Infantry Posted: Sun Feb 22, 2004 5:24 am |
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Well I think you all get the basic concept of combined arms in the real world and E:A. Infantry was given APCs/IFVs to keep up with AFVs. Dismounted infantry can't walk as fast as tanks can move. I know as I lead an Air Assault Plt. in the 101 and commanded a Mech Co. in the 197th Mech Bde. That being said, we used activation since SM1 in '90. Infantry with or without transport should not be in mixed dets with tanks. Example of using combined arms in Epic : You activate an artillery unit and shoot at an enemy formation and do some damage. He activates a unit and does an action. You move and shoot a unit of your tanks and do more damage to the same Enemy unit. He activates ... maybe shoots at your tanks ! You then activate an Infantry unit and shoot/firefight/Close Combat the attrited enemy unit and wipe it out. Now I know this is a simplistic and contrived example, but I think you get the point. Tanks and Infantry don't have to be in the same det. to do combined arms. Combined Arms means in Epic using different units together to accomplish whatever your mission is. Now Infantry transported in APCs/IFVs will obviously activate together in some cases.
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nealhunt
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Post subject: Supported Infantry Posted: Mon Feb 23, 2004 8:29 pm |
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Opsmed on the playtest board seems to be a very good tactician and he uses mixed formations extensively. ?Primarily, he uses Russ companies with mechanized infantry platoons.
The loaded chimeras stay near the back of the formation. ?Since they have good distance weapons, any suppression will probably be applied to them before the heavier Russ in front. ?It gives a tremendous boost in numbers for assaults, almost doubling from 10 to 19 units. ?It also gives a huge boost in FF for the same reasons.
But the thing that really surprised me when he pointed it out is that it gives a huge boost if the company is assaulted in hth. ?The chances of getting into base contact with the Chimeras in the back is slim, so the usually the troopers can pile out during countercharge and use their FF. ?Also, while your more valuable units (the Russ) are in base contact meaning they get hit first, they also have reinforced 4+ armor. ?You actually want them to take the hits first (from CC), even before the cheap infantry. ?That way, you shrug off more casualties, resulting in a much higher bonus on your assault resolution. ? Winning is the most important thing because it will actually result in a better preservation of your forces than "preserving" the expensive units during the assault only to lose them without a save if you lose the assault resolution.
Yes, you take a bit of additional risk if the chimeras are hit but they are in the back and only vulnerable to teleporters and air attacks and such. ?And since no infantry are exposed AP is still useless against the formation.
Darn slick if you ask me. 
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Almost forgot...
A similar thing works with Russ and mounted infantry companies - keep the Russ in front to protect the transports until you unload. Their firepower is varied enough that not much will be "wasted" by not splitting up fire. Don't forget that any unit in an assault fires the same, regardless of whether they are AT or AP, too. Again, Russ can very effectively lead an assaulting infantry formation due to their high armor.
Griffons with an infantry company in cover can stay behind the terrain, out of LoS so they don't get sniped by AT, but they can still fire indirect.
Hellhounds with mech infantry can make sense. They shield the transports from hits in the beginning and then pile on to any assaults.
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Neal
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Legion 4
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Post subject: Supported Infantry Posted: Mon Feb 23, 2004 9:45 pm |
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Nice example of good tactics and understanding of the rules. I think Jervis made it a point to try and make the rules reflect modern tactics, somewhat. Mech Infantry operating with Tanks is what it's all about ...
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Legion 4 "Cry Havoc, and let slip the Dogs of War !" ... "People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf."
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Tas
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Post subject: Supported Infantry Posted: Tue Feb 24, 2004 1:31 am |
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Thanks neal- that was very clear and an excellent example of success in mixing unit typess.
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Tas
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nealhunt
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Post subject: Supported Infantry Posted: Tue Feb 24, 2004 7:52 pm |
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My pleasure.
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Neal
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nealhunt
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Post subject: Supported Infantry Posted: Tue Mar 15, 2005 4:55 pm |
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As of last night I officially secured a venue. I know this isa widely geographically diverse group, but I thought I'd post it here just in case. This is a copy of the post I put in the Event Announcements thread on the SG board.
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For those of you in commuting distance of Nashville, Tennessee Nashcon '05 will be held Memorial Day weekend, May 27-29.
Nashcon is sponsored by HMGS (Historical Miniature Game Society), a national gaming organization here in the US. Traditionally, Nashcon has been almost entirely historical games. While it will still be dominated by historicals, they are branching out into fantasy and scifi.
They have agreed to allow us to run an Epic Tournament on that Saturday. It will be RTT structure, with a minimum of 3 rounds. I will post more details as we get them hashed out.
The event is $18 for HMGS members, $23 for non-members through pre-registration, $20/$25 at the door. Convention Info, Registration Form, and a preliminary game schedule are available at:
http://www.hmgs-midsouth.org/convention ... ashcon2004
Also, GJLane and some of the crew from Memphis will be putting on an Epic Demo at some point during the weekend.
There is a small chance that we may pull off an official RTT event and gain the official GW support therby (trophies, prizes, advertisement in White Dwarf, etc.), but we will need 12 solid commitments and a few more for extras before we can qualify. Mostly, I'd really like to have the free ad in WD but that takes a 2 month advance notice. Anyone who can commit at this point will be much appreciated.
Those of you who are interested, please email me at neal.e.hunt@vanderbilt.edu and I will put you on the email list. If you can confirm at this point, so much the better.
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Neal
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iblisdrax
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Post subject: Supported Infantry Posted: Tue Mar 15, 2005 10:52 pm |
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Arrrgh! So close, yet too far away (6+hours). Such is my lot in life... 
my 2cents,
iblisdrax
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"Have Leman Reuss, will travel"
"Hallo. My name is Indigo Montoya. You killed my father prepare to die!"
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nealhunt
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Post subject: Supported Infantry Posted: Tue Mar 15, 2005 11:08 pm |
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Ahh... don't be such a sissy. At 6 hours, you ought to be able to day trip it.
Seriously, where are you? And if you are west of here, did you know about the Memphis tourney March 19 (this Saturday)?
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Neal
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iblisdrax
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Post subject: Supported Infantry Posted: Tue Mar 15, 2005 11:53 pm |
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Sorry, north. I live in Ohio. And as much as I would LOVE to come, I cannot get that holiday off. #$#@$# ! Maybe next time...
I swear...once in my life I will get to a tournament...sometime...somewhere....
One that has Epic, anyways....there is one in Columbus, OH, but they don't advertive Epic at all...
my 2cents,
iblisdrax
_________________
"Have Leman Reuss, will travel"
"Hallo. My name is Indigo Montoya. You killed my father prepare to die!"
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nealhunt
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Post subject: Supported Infantry Posted: Fri Apr 01, 2005 9:48 pm |
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Location: Nashville, TN, USA
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From the flier I created for the tourney. If anyone is within driving distance of Nashville, I would appreciate it if you posted a flier at your local game shop. Drop me an email and I'll send you a copy.
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The Epic tournament will be a 3 round tournament in Rogue Trader format. Points will be scored based on margin of victory and sportsmanship. Armies will be judged on painting and overall composition. Winner will be based on the aggregate score in all categories. Each round will be 2? hours, with 30 minutes between each. 2700 point army limit. In addition to published lists, the following will be allowed*: Ulthwe, Black legion, Lost and the Damned. If you have questions, please contact Neal Hunt at nealhunt@yahoo.com. RSVP?s appreciated but not required.
When: May 28 (Saturday of Memorial Day Weekend)
Where: Cool Springs Marriot
How much: $18 for HMGS members, $23 for non-members through pre-registration, $20/$25 at the door.
Sign in: 9am
Battles start: 10 am
Nashcon membership grants access to all convention events in addition to tournament. Convention Info, Registration Form, and preliminary game schedule are available at:
http://www.hmgs-midsouth.org/convention ... ashcon2004
* Allowed army lists are still under discussion and may include others. Published lists include those in the core book, Swordwind supplement and Fanatic magazine. All lists are available at the Specialist Games Epic website.
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Neal
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