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Warmaster Nice's Friendly Fleets of Carnage

Warmaster Nice

Post subject: Warmaster Nice's Friendly Fleets of Carnage

Posted: Mon Aug 30, 2004 8:43 pm

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Joined: Tue Sep 30, 2003 9:15 pm
Posts: 7948
Location: Denmark

Uh sorry... Was in sort of a weird mood when I wrote the title.

Anyway I thought I'd start this thread at a Diary to keep you updated on the progress of my recently aquired Chaos and Imperial BFG fleets.

The Chaos fleet as it stands now consists of the following vessels assembled and ready for a spray undercoat:

Desolator Class Battleship
Repulsive Class Grand Cruiser
1-2 Devastation class cruiser
1-2 Slaughter class Cruisers
2-3 Murder or Carnage class cruisers
(I haven't quite decided on what types of cruisers but it is something along these lines for a tootal of 6 cruisers)
1 Infidel Raider Squadron
1 Iconoclast Destroyer squadron

Brewing in the horizon is a Planet Killer, Retalliator class Grand Cruiser (aircraft carrier), more regular cruisers and escorts.

The Imperial Fleet consists of:
Emperor Class Battleship
Venegance Class Grand Cruiser,
2 Tyrant Class Cruisers
2 Lunar Class Cruisers
1 Dominator Class Cruiser
1 Gothic Class Cruiser.
(again I've not completely settled for the exact composition of the Cruisers.)
1 Squadron of Sword Frigates
1 Squadron of Cobra Destroyers

Some of you might have seen my Imperial Dreadnought class Grand Battleship from the What Are You Working On III-thread. I'm still working on some proper stats for this ship. I'll post them here once they've been properly tested. -BTW: I heard someone mention a points value genertor for BFG ships... Does anyboddy know where to get it?

Brewing in the horizon for the Imperials are an Apocalypse batttleship (or variant), more cruisers and various escorts and some sort of a Space Station.

In addition to this I'm of course working franticly on producing some terrain. Mostly planets at the moment, but I guess that's for the Terrain forum.

Next update will be once I've begun painting some of the stuff.

Cheers!

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Xavi

Post subject: Warmaster Nice's Friendly Fleets of Carnage

Posted: Mon Aug 30, 2004 9:58 pm

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Joined: Wed Aug 20, 2003 12:30 am
Posts: 939
Location: University of Essex, Colchester, UK (soon to be Brighton, Sussex, UK)

Hi there!

Looks nice, but I would suggest the following:

CHAOS
- Get some heavy cruisers. The hades and acheron are good. The hades, specially is a favoured HC. Paired with murder or 2 is quite a bargain for its points and looks great as a squadron leader

It is 30 points more than a regular murder and the added firepower is more than good for the extra price.
- I would go for what you list (2 devastations, 2 slaughters and 2 murders/carnages). Then add more murders/carnages. You will rarely use more than 2 of each given kind, but you will be using 2 of a kind in a lot of cases.
- Get a despoiler. I have never fielded mine, bnt it looks too good to pass!

IMPERIALS
- Get more lunars. I find it to be a highly useful shiip. besides, it is supposed to be the workhorse of the IN and as a diference to chaos, it is certainly a worthy ship. Sadly, in the case of thaos you might find yourself not fielding a lot of murders, which is a pitty but they aare slightly overpriced compared to other cruisers, so they are only support vessels for your heavy cruisers and other ships (even if they can do quite well there!). This is not true for the lunar, that is your main asset in a lot of games.
- I deeply dislike the dominator, but that is me. I prefer a nova cannon armed lunar instead. p to you, though. A lot of people like it. If you field tyrants, remember to get the 45 range upgrade. Always, period

It is what makes it a worthy cruiser.
- Get more escorts. Imperial escorts are well wprth their points. I usua?ly use 3 squadrons or 4 and they have never left me with my as.s in the air.
- I would recomend the battle cruisers here. An armagfeddon or mars helps you quite well. An armageddon is like a hades, an upgraded version of your basic design. A mars is a nice catch-all cruiser for when you don't want to field your emperor; a nice flagaship for small games.

Appart from that, nothing to add. Simply beware of the eldatr and whipe the floor with the enemy you are facing in that moment

And remember to have fun and make sure your opponent has fun as well. I think this is the best advise I can offer

regards,

Xavi

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Cuban Commissar

Post subject: Warmaster Nice's Friendly Fleets of Carnage

Posted: Mon Aug 30, 2004 10:12 pm

Purestrain

Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2003 4:32 am
Posts: 2934
Location: Colorado, USA

WNM,

The ship piont system was in one of the early BFG magzines. I have the article.

But with all honesty that things needs a unique stat line. The turrent weapons on top are bigger than any weapon I have seen on the other ships. They look awesome and needs some special stats to reflect that. Something like a Mega lance battery.

Can you tell or show us how big the ship is next to one the the standard battleships.

Thanks

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Xavi

Post subject: Warmaster Nice's Friendly Fleets of Carnage

Posted: Mon Aug 30, 2004 10:19 pm

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Joined: Wed Aug 20, 2003 12:30 am
Posts: 939
Location: University of Essex, Colchester, UK (soon to be Brighton, Sussex, UK)

Oh, yeah, i knew I was forgetting something. The ship calculator can be found in the BFG yahoo group (bfg-list): http://games.groups.yahoo.com/group/bfg-list/

It is called "fleetmaster". Pretty useful tool to tinker with regular ships. Don't know if it would work for super-ships like yours

In any case test it and see if it works for you.

And yeah, we all want a picture side by side with a regular cuiser and BB.

Xavi

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stormseer

Post subject: Warmaster Nice's Friendly Fleets of Carnage

Posted: Mon Aug 30, 2004 10:53 pm

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Joined: Fri Feb 14, 2003 9:52 pm
Posts: 4598
Location: Suffolk, UK.

Quote (Warmaster Nice @ 30 2004 Aug.,20:43)

In addition to this I'm of course working franticly on producing some terrain. Mostly planets at the moment, but I guess that's for the Terrain forum.

Sounds excellent WMN... If you are making planets, I presume you are going for the fully modelled spheres then? - with my terrain, I've decided to just use the card ones from the box, as a modelled one cannot have ships put on top, and I find planets (with their useful free turn) are always focal points, and end up with a fair few ships manauvering on and around them, so I like to be able to use them as easily as possible...

This does mean I do have a load of cool polystyrene balls lying about waiting to be built into something! - Necro/Epic storage tanks perhaps... ? :cool:

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Warmaster Nice

Post subject: Warmaster Nice's Friendly Fleets of Carnage

Posted: Tue Aug 31, 2004 12:09 pm

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Joined: Tue Sep 30, 2003 9:15 pm
Posts: 7948
Location: Denmark

Thanks for the link Xavi. I'm joining the Yahoo group as we speak (well, write...).
I'm not quite suree about the heavy cruisers. Not so much because I doubt their effectiveness but more because of the fleet list which requires 3 cruisers per heavy cruiser and battleship.

CC: You re probably right about the stats for the turret guns. I was thinking some sort of special rule along the line of those for the Apocalyple lances. The size of the turrets are because they house their own power generator which may be supercharged for extra range -at a certain risk of course!

As previously mentioned I'd like to keep the overall range of the Dreadnought's weapons systems relatively low but allowing range for the turrets at a certain risk sounds quite appropriate.

Storm. Yup; I went to the local crafts store and bought myself a bag'o'balls!

Just a quick selection of various sizes to get things started.

Oh, BTW I'll post a comparison with the Dreadnought and a standard Imperial Cruiser hull in the General miniatures section.

Cheers!

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Cuban Commissar

Post subject: Warmaster Nice's Friendly Fleets of Carnage

Posted: Tue Aug 31, 2004 7:44 pm

Purestrain

Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2003 4:32 am
Posts: 2934
Location: Colorado, USA

For the main turret wespons I would make them 90cm range.

My logic:

Normal Lances found on imperial ship go out to 60cm.

The big gun on planet killer travels 90cm when fired.

The Nova cannon can shoot up to 120cm, Maybe 150cm. I think the Nova Cnanon should be the longest range weapon in Imperial arsenal.

Thus I like 90cm placing it between the 60cm - 120 cm range band.

You can either set the "safe" range to 60cm and the ship can boost up to 90cm or set the normal range to 90cm with the ability to boast up to 100 or 120cm. I think either would work fine.

Take Care

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Warmaster Nice

Post subject: Warmaster Nice's Friendly Fleets of Carnage

Posted: Thu Sep 09, 2004 4:50 pm

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Joined: Tue Sep 30, 2003 9:15 pm
Posts: 7948
Location: Denmark

Here's my attempt at a Stats for the Dreadnought IMS Jutland.

Dreadnought IMS Jutland.

Type: Battleship/16
Speed: 15
Turns: 45
Shields: 4
Armour: 5+
Turrets: 7

Armament:
Starboard Weapons Batteries : 20/ 45 cm./Right
Starboard Lance Batteries: 6/ 45cm./Right
Starboard SuperLance Turret: 2/ 60-120cm/Right/Front
Starboard Launch Bays: 2 Fighter/2 Bomber squadrons
Port Weapons Batteries: 20/ 45cm. / Left
Port Lance Batteries: 6/ 45cm./Left
Port SuperLance Turret: 2/ 60-120cm/Left/Front
Port Launch Bays: 2 Fighter/2 Bomber Squadrons
Dorsal Weapons Batteries: 10/ 30cm. Left/Right/Front
Dorsal SuperLance Turrets: 12/ 60-120cm/ Left/Right/Front
Prow Torpedoes: 6/ 30cm. / Front

The Super Lance Turrets usually operate at ?safe? capacity which gives them a range of 60 cm. However the player may attempt to overcharge them and fire the turrets at a maximum range of 120 cm. ?This is not without risk though: On a roll of 1-2 the turrets burn out and inflict 1 point of structural damage and may not be used for the remainder of the battle.

The Dreadnought is a slow and ponderous vessel and may not use ?Come too new heading? orders.
The Dreadnought may upgrade its launch bays to carry Assault Boats at an additional cost of 5 points.
The Dreadnought may upgrade it?s Torpedoes to a Nova Cannon at the additional cost of ?20 points.

The points cost is calculated roughly from the following
100 points: Starboard Weapons Batteries : 20/ 45 cm./Right
75 points: Starboard Lance Batteries: 6/ 45cm./Right
30 points: Starboard SuperLance Turret: 2/ 60-120cm/Right/Front
35 points: Starboard Launch Bays: 2 Fighter/2 Bomber squadrons
100 points: Port Weapons Batteries: 20/ 45cm. / Left
75 points: Port Lance Batteries: 6/ 45cm./Left
30 points: Port SuperLance Turret: 2/ 60-120cm/Left/Front
35 points: Port Launch Bays: 2 Fighter/2 Bomber Squadrons
30 points: Dorsal Weapons Batteries: 10/ 30cm. Left/Right/Front
180 points: ?Dorsal SuperLance Turrets: 12/ 60-120cm/ Left/Right/Front
30 points: Prow Torpedoes: 6/ 30cm. / Front

Turrets: 10 points each: 70 points.
The basic hull cost is guesstimated at around 130 points. This is the basic battleship hull with the extra hardpoints, ?structure points and turrets. This may be way off ?but it?s a start. I was thinking of allowing it Impproved Targeting Matrix making the Weapon Batteries even more deadly at close range. This would however push the cost further 15 points.. I?ve not changed the points cost for the Super Lances compared to normal 60 cm lances. The risk of them blowing up compensates for the extra range IMO. Also note that thee Dreadnought doers not benefit from an armoured prow as the ship design is supposed to be as old (if not older) that the Chaos ships.

Estimated points cost of the IMS Jutland: 920.
A massive price but once within range this ship is capable of dealing out more punishment that several battleships combined. It is yet to be properly playtested but when used in combination with fast escorts I think it will be extremely interesting to ?play. If the Dreadnought is destroyed/withdraws it will almost certainly lose the Imperial Player the game.

Since this is my first attempt att designing my own ship there?s bound to be a lot of errors etc. So criticism is more tthan welcome. Any thoughts, ideas, comments?

Cheers!

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Xavi

Post subject: Warmaster Nice's Friendly Fleets of Carnage

Posted: Thu Sep 09, 2004 5:16 pm

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Joined: Wed Aug 20, 2003 12:30 am
Posts: 939
Location: University of Essex, Colchester, UK (soon to be Brighton, Sussex, UK)

Picture please? It seems that I missed it.

Looks awfully powerful right now, and I have some comments, but would like to see the beast before doing anything with it

Xavi

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Warmaster Nice

Post subject: Warmaster Nice's Friendly Fleets of Carnage

Posted: Thu Sep 09, 2004 5:46 pm

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Joined: Tue Sep 30, 2003 9:15 pm
Posts: 7948
Location: Denmark

'Ere we go. As you can see it is't exactly small...

Cheers!

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stormseer

Post subject: Warmaster Nice's Friendly Fleets of Carnage

Posted: Thu Sep 09, 2004 6:10 pm

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Joined: Fri Feb 14, 2003 9:52 pm
Posts: 4598
Location: Suffolk, UK.

Quote (Warmaster Nice @ 09 2004 Sep.,16:50)

I was thinking of allowing it Impproved Targeting Matrix making the Weapon Batteries even more deadly at close range. This would however push the cost further 15 points..

Wow... fearsome stats....

If you were to allow this improvement, I would say it would cost more than 15 points- remember that it will allow you to roll many more dice for the points, seeing as it is 20 batteries getting a shift, compared to 6 batteries on the Imperious (think thats the right ship)!

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Warmaster Nice

Post subject: Warmaster Nice's Friendly Fleets of Carnage

Posted: Thu Sep 09, 2004 6:31 pm

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Joined: Tue Sep 30, 2003 9:15 pm
Posts: 7948
Location: Denmark

Good point Storm. I'm not even sure it is really nesecary to allow that upgrade. The ship is more than powerfull enough as it is.
This stats is more based on what I can actually see on the model but it is possible that this should be disregarded in order to create a more balanced ship stats.
Maybe I should look at some ork hulks at similar size for comparison. -Does there exist an Ork hull Points generator?

Cheers!

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Cuban Commissar

Post subject: Warmaster Nice's Friendly Fleets of Carnage

Posted: Fri Sep 10, 2004 2:00 am

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Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2003 4:32 am
Posts: 2934
Location: Colorado, USA

I say go with it. I like the fact it's it all modeled. on the ship.

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