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Plastic Infantry & transports sprue, crowdfunding.

 Post subject: Re: Plastic Infantry & transports sprue, crowdfunding.
PostPosted: Fri Jun 21, 2013 8:56 pm 
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Sorry if this sounds like a kicking.

Not at all. I'd appreciate advice from an architect!

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has the order of upgrades to the sprue (even if not the exact targets required) been decided yet ?

Not entirely. We're currently working on getting the last sculpt (the gobbler) processed for the tool cutting rig. I hope to know where we are soon.

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 Post subject: Re: Plastic Infantry & transports sprue, crowdfunding.
PostPosted: Sat Jun 22, 2013 9:46 am 
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Evil and Chaos wrote:
Not at all. I'd appreciate advice from an architect!


You'd be the only one ! :D

Looking again at your pics (now on a PC not a phone screen) i actually closer than i thought. Its the windows and how they are organised that needs some work. Anyway, i quickly googled images of a few gothic buildings to illustrate what i'm talking about.

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As you have done in both your models : Usually the facades are organised into bays incorporating very chunky columns which support the floorplates behind - this may be roughly 3-8m bays depending on technology and size of building - and these are modeled to resemble an approximation of medieval church buttresses (though rarely flying / detached from the wall.) Again, like the model, this are usually doubled-up in the corners. This gives the whole building an over arching vertical rhythm.

Into that the windows are organised by a secondary framework which supports the wall and is also supported off the main columns, and i think this is what your model misses. Wall/windows panels are then infilled and the aim is to create the illusion of vertical emphasis of maybe 5:1 / 7:1 or sometimes more. In practice that means the windows are often grouped into recesses to create the illusion of much taller openings (spanning several floors) as below (generally people like 1:1.5ish shaped windows rather than slits internally.)

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Finally the building is finished with some kind of flourish (as above) which is where the medieval gothic detailing is usually added - structure is a lot freer as you reach the top!

The base is as you would expect beefed up significantly to take the hundreds of tons wanting to crush every square inch. Slightly inconveniently however people do insist on wanting to get into the building at ground level... Usually this is overcome with a "plinth" facade (often incorporating the bottom 3/4 floors) with giant arched door shaped openings in a different but related proportion - all inserted into more solid load baring walls :

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I think this implies you ideally need a 3 sprues - building basses / building intermediate floors / building roofs - for a modular system. You might sell several stacked intermediate floors for every top and bottom... Its the addition of a believable and correctly proportioned plinth and cornice to top and tail the building which makes a modular system difficult to pull off.


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 Post subject: Re: Plastic Infantry & transports sprue, crowdfunding.
PostPosted: Sat Jun 22, 2013 9:48 am 
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Terrain is awesome and something that hasn't been completely tackled from one source in full. Like how EW took on 6mm in full range and different armies. No one has taken on buildings or type of structure in full.

I would love to see something like "Grim Dark Terrain Theme" and then do EVERYTHING you could find in that theme/type like hab buildings, admin buildings, spaceports, military bases, paved roads, bridges, airfields, factories, courthouses, medical facilities etc etc etc

Someone could come along and buy a whole board worth of matching style terrain. Have different types, Ice world, desert world, ork world, warp/demon world, Space Elf world, Robot Zombie world etc

Sure some buildings could cross over or even the base kits could and you could by "World Expansions Packs". But the idea of tackling Terrain at a focus point instead of "oh by the way here some terrain to go with our units" is something that could be awesome.

I can see a Kickstarter based solely on terrain in a manner that the current one is like ie Ork and Human.

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 Post subject: Re: Plastic Infantry & transports sprue, crowdfunding.
PostPosted: Sat Jun 22, 2013 10:02 am 
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I agree!!

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 Post subject: Re: Plastic Infantry & transports sprue, crowdfunding.
PostPosted: Sat Jun 22, 2013 10:02 am 
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@AoC - while i think this is an awesome idea (and something that i have even contemplated giving a shot at myself when i've had a few) i just can't see there is enough demand for bulk orders of high price terrain - simply the production costs massively outweigh the likely sales.

I think it is telling that after a few months DZC has had to revert to selling a card version of their buildings, presumably to recoup some of the investment in the resin buildings. Beautiful as they are i don't imagine they have sold many £70 4" high building kits...(?) Perhaps a better chance in 28mm with greater market share ?


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 Post subject: Re: Plastic Infantry & transports sprue, crowdfunding.
PostPosted: Sat Jun 22, 2013 10:09 am 
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Blip wrote:
@AoC - while i think this is an awesome idea (and something that i have even contemplated giving a shot at myself when i've had a few) i just can't see there is enough demand for bulk orders of high price terrain - simply the production costs massively outweigh the likely sales.


I think you would be surprised how much people would buy terrain if it was there. Guys have many armies why not many worlds worth of terrain? Also who wouldn't want a 4' x 8' board of a Hivecity? Or a couple? What about clubs?

Plus if enough forethought was used I bet a lot of buildings bulk could use the same "Base Set" spure. Then you would only need to buy Specialist Sets to transform your buildings. I mean the majority of a Factory, Hab Block or an Admin Building I bet could be the same? That would off set the cost if Core Spure kits were used for multiple buildings.

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 Post subject: Re: Plastic Infantry & transports sprue, crowdfunding.
PostPosted: Sat Jun 22, 2013 10:09 am 
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To be fair, I'm pretty sure DZC were talking about card scenery before the insanely-priced resin stuff was announced, so that they'd have three levels of cost - free print-your-own, cheapish card stock buildings and then the expensive resin stuff.

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 Post subject: Re: Plastic Infantry & transports sprue, crowdfunding.
PostPosted: Sat Jun 22, 2013 10:36 am 
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I think the DZC resins have been reduced in price, not suprising really.

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 Post subject: Re: Plastic Infantry & transports sprue, crowdfunding.
PostPosted: Sat Jun 22, 2013 11:22 am 
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I'm willing to give a terrain project a go. I'm not convinced it'd fund, because I doubt we can put the same kind of behind-the-scenes funding in place that we did for the first crowdfunder. We're talking about 5k of pre-orders to fund a basic sprue for this if we're doing them for £2 a shot, offhand, unless we can find some cash to invest upfront.

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 Post subject: Re: Plastic Infantry & transports sprue, crowdfunding.
PostPosted: Sat Jun 22, 2013 11:25 am 
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It is also a matter of scale. Is the DZC not 10mm? Maybe the price plus the not so common scale pose problems not necessarily relevant here?
I like your thinking of 3 types of section, Blip. That would work very well.

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 Post subject: Re: Plastic Infantry & transports sprue, crowdfunding.
PostPosted: Sat Jun 22, 2013 11:30 am 
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If plastics is out of bounds, would molds for e.g. Durable plaster or resin be an option?

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 Post subject: Re: Plastic Infantry & transports sprue, crowdfunding.
PostPosted: Sat Jun 22, 2013 11:40 am 
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Resin casting building walls to sell for 50p each is not a great way to spend your work hours. :-)

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 Post subject: Re: Plastic Infantry & transports sprue, crowdfunding.
PostPosted: Sat Jun 22, 2013 11:43 am 
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Just to add more differing views … ;)

I don't care about extra street lamps and what-not for buildings. I just want some cheap-ish 6mm gothic buildings. From anyone, please, it's been years, and so many projects have gone nowhere :{[] don't need roads, or fire hydrants or churches, just something basic to work with which is less effort than building it all from scratch.

That said, any extra details or improvements along the lines of Blip's suggestions would be welcome, and, as has been mentioned, windows that are not the full floor height.

… to be fair if you just made one solid sheet of wall and window with some surface details and maybe a few lines for cutting guidance i'd buy a stack :D (that's probably just me though)

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 Post subject: Re: Plastic Infantry & transports sprue, crowdfunding.
PostPosted: Sat Jun 22, 2013 11:57 am 
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Evil and Chaos wrote:
Resin casting building walls to sell for 50p each is not a great way to spend your work hours. :-)

I was thinking you selling the molds. But that is probably still not a good investment.

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 Post subject: Re: Plastic Infantry & transports sprue, crowdfunding.
PostPosted: Sat Jun 22, 2013 1:40 pm 
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Hi

Fence sitter on the pledge.... Are the smaller aliens going to be on the sprue or just metal?


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