OK, fully rested and awake AC here... The document is now ready as a single file for download. Sorry to all who may have d/l'd the first lot already.

Hey Brother,

Couple of things in there, you forgot to change the points values for the following:

Land Raiders - still 350
Thunderbolts - still 150
Warlord - still 850

I had a guess at what changes you would make in my urrent playtest. It is 3k Vs Knights, Orton is righting the BATREP with one turn to run at this stage. I will post suggetsions once the BATREP is up.

Cheers
Aaron

Oh man

Hey Matt,

What happened to the unit data sheets in the list? 2.3.1 had the no pics variety, any chace 2.4 can get the indiviual unit datas back with the rhino pic in there to tease us.

Cheers
Aaron

Nah I haven't painted enough miniatures to fill those data sheets yet. You'll probably see them when Nemesis gets done. For now I wanted to just put the reference sheet in for stats and save people the download of incomplete data sheets.

Hey Matt,

Thanks for the changes, looking at the Great Company as a unit and pricing, I have to ask, why you haven't thought to drop its price? In comparing the GC to Tac Det I think that they are on par in some ways and taken as a base formation should cost around the same.

Tacs can now take LR = GC
Tacs have 6 x AP5/AT6 > GC with Nil ranged attacks
Tacs are CC4 FF4 < GC @ CC3 FF4
GC can take upgrades in GH, BC, LF & WG > Tacs with nil upgrades

I dont think that the GC is a significantly better unit to the Tac Det, the +1 at CC is a trade off aginst 6 ranged shots, could they not cost 275?

Secondly, from my playtesting, I was wondering why I can only take 0-1 of the GH, BC, LF and WG. Well WG I can understand, but I think being able to take 2 of the other three gives more flexibility to players. One thing we have discussed is the lack of ranged firepower. Being able to take 2 LF in a GC would add some firepower that they need in order to deter/repell advancing foes.

Blood Claws are not really a good option to add to a GC, the 25 points more to take GH is a better otion and they are a better unit. Maybe Blood Claws could have Infiltrate, this would make them more desireable to a player. It would add to the theme of Unblooded and further denote their thirst for battle.

I like the no Warhounds, although I miss their firepower, the Land Raiders are doing well. Orton should have a full BATREP after we finish on Sunday.

Cheers
Aaron

Thanks CAL.

Don't forget they come with a built-in hero to start with (+50 points included) so they are in actual fact around 250 as they have no ranged weaponry but get the pip of CC as you mention. I don't feel the change to Tacticals applies to a GC as they are a different beast and I want to take careful steps with the Codex changes. I also don't feel every single list has to incorporate everything. Some formations are just different and their place and cost within a list doesn't have to be copied in every sub-list. It should be judged on its merits in terms of the build as a whole.

You can take 0-2 of the upgrades for a GC. My usual GC has 2 LFs most times. The trade is the cost adds up.

The Blood Claws in the GC use the initiative of the GC not Blood Claw initiative. The lesser cost reflects their lesser FF in comparison to GHs but you have the option of a cheaper GC if you need/prefer. So you can still get the CC you require but at a slightly cheaper cost as their reduced FF is often a negative because there's only so much B2B space in an engagement so you get lesser results. Infiltrate will be reserved for the "stealthy" Fenrisian Wolves

Anyway hope this helps show where the list is driving

Looking forward to the batrep, Ortron.

Cheers

Cheers Mate

I think my reading of "(you may select each option only once per Great Company):", is off then. I read it as I can take 1 LF upgrade of 2 x LF with Rhinos. Am I reading it wrong. I think being able to add 0-2 of the ugrades and taking the same choice twice would be great. That would allow me to add 4 LF to a GC. Alternatively a cheaper option as you say with 4 x BC and rhinos.

Cheers
Aaron

Ahh I see what youre saying now. Sorry you're right. Once per GC is the way you do it. I thought you meant the number of units.

The reason for the once per GC is that it represents the rarity of the upgrades in comparison to the numbers of Grey Hunters - the majority of troops in a Great Company. The design is to kind of show the transition from Blood Claw to Long Fang all the way through the ranks working as a pack. It is a bit more abstract than a simple Company design though. But I like that. Also taking 2 upgrades of Long Fangs would get a bit OTT with 12 shots coming out of a GC and that's not exactly how I picture (or want) the Great Company working in the list. That's what Hunting packs are for - if you want massed firepower take an upgraded Long Fangs pack. It costs a lot for a fairly small pack but does put out good amounts of shooting.

Hey Dobbsy,

Hope you got the PM, the game went well, in the end I was a little over what Geoff was with my guess at what changes you would apply to SW. The drop was unsuccessful, however the GH maxed out is a hard nut to crack. The infantry feel good and they appear to be on the money for strength. I have not played with the Army defensively yet, so I don't have an idea on how that wll play out.

I would like to face off against Guard next and move from Assault armies to the more Shooty orientated ones. Is there anything you want to look at in particular to test, something in your head that you think may be OTT or a little undercooked.

I am enjoying the list, its cool to be that menacing in assaults. I will try some TH loaded up in the next list to see how that goes. I am keen to see what a TH with two formations of LF can do.

Cheers
Aaron

Landing Craft actions could use some testing. I've tried it once or twice so far and didn't do all that well. It had been a while since I had played with war engine transports and was very rusty on the rules so didn't utilise them all that well.

Hey Matt,

Back from bush and getting ready to move house, further testing will have to wait till I make it to Canberra. What have you been working on, what do you need done? I may get a couple of games in the next month and will look at the Landing Craft actions.

Cheers
Aaron

Hi Dobbsy!

I'm working on space wolves for Adams armyforge app. I've downloaded 2,4 from this thread. No Formations actually has the Wolf Lord upgrade in it's notes, so I'd just like to ask which formations should be able to take the wolf Lord upgrade?

cheers

Hey Borka,

I would have thought that it would be limited to the Great Companies, that is how I have been playing the list. I will wait to see what Matt has to say. Tahnks for doing this, I am tired of writing out my lists for playtesting. What sort of timeframe are wel looking at for it to be up?

Cheers
Aaron

A few days at the most depends on how well my 1,5 year old daughter sleeps

I think I've done perhaps a third of the work.

cheers