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Salamanders
BlackLegion
 Post subject: Re: Salamanders
PostPosted: Fri Oct 08, 2010 6:34 pm 
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Well ok. But i still struggle to make something useful out of the Preadator Incinerator and i alwayas take some (without Landing Craft).

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The_Real_Chris
 Post subject: Re: Salamanders
PostPosted: Fri Oct 08, 2010 7:07 pm 
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If thats the LR R stats I would drop them instantly. Just don't need those abilities over the regular LR, I'd go for the regular weapons fit every time. Even now its marginal.

Pred incinerator is a good way to make an interesting assault formation or bulked out destructor formation - remember they are on par with vindicators so really should be as usefull (or not depending on your point of view). Making them more flame orientated doesn't do much for them, bumping the to hit stat just tries to make them compete with taking hunters which are rightfully always going to be a main choice, followed by LR for transport. Then again they are supposed to be a characterful addition. If two are used in a game I would see that as success!
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BlackLegion
 Post subject: Re: Salamanders
PostPosted: Fri Oct 08, 2010 7:10 pm 
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In mylast battle i had only regular Land Raiders...and boy did i missed those 2 x AP3+ Ignore Cover shots....even or especially at 15cm.

With the Multi-melta they are even better than regular Land Raiders.

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The_Real_Chris
 Post subject: Re: Salamanders
PostPosted: Fri Oct 08, 2010 7:17 pm 
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Frankly my salamanders have always wanted to be at 30cm if they will be leading the assault - and typically that's what the LR equipped formations are doing. Further you are in the example above essentially trading 4 AT4+ shots and 1 Ap4+ for the shooting you get over 2 rounds for one round of 2 AP3+IC and 1 MW5+. Yes its nice, but its hard to use as easily as regular raiders. Dropping it to 'just' 2 AP3+ doesn't cut it in my armies, I would go for the regular raiders every time.
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BlackLegion
 Post subject: Re: Salamanders
PostPosted: Fri Oct 08, 2010 7:20 pm 
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So you really want a "Salamanders Land Raider Redeemer" with Multi-melta than a "Land Raider Redeemer" without?

Because in the Land Raider thread it is agreed upon that the Land Raider Redeemer has 2 x Flamestorm Cannon 15cm AP3+ Ignore Cover. So that won't change.

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The_Real_Chris
 Post subject: Re: Salamanders
PostPosted: Fri Oct 08, 2010 8:18 pm 
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If its a choice between that without MM and a regular raider, there is little contest. I've not much interest in introducing a new land raider if all it is going to be is a white elephant, or suitable only for landing craft insertion.
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BlackLegion
 Post subject: Re: Salamanders
PostPosted: Fri Oct 08, 2010 8:23 pm 
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So i'm the only one who includes a specific unit in his army because it's enhances the "feel", background and style of a game with this army and not for sheer competetiveness?

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The_Real_Chris
 Post subject: Re: Salamanders
PostPosted: Fri Oct 08, 2010 8:28 pm 
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When playtesting - yes!
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BlackLegion
 Post subject: Re: Salamanders
PostPosted: Fri Oct 08, 2010 8:33 pm 
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Ok.

Option 1: Add Multi-melta
Option 2: reduce cost to 75pts

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Angel_of_Caliban
 Post subject: Re: Salamanders
PostPosted: Fri Oct 08, 2010 8:48 pm 
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BlackLegion wrote:
Ok.

Option 1: Add Multi-melta
Option 2: reduce cost to 75pts

If it is a straight swap at 75 then its alright?

BlackLegion wrote:
So i'm the only one who includes a specific unit in his army because it's enhances the "feel", background and style of a game with this army and not for sheer competetiveness?


I like fluffyness more than Powergaming, but TRC is are list breaker after all.

BlackLegion wrote:
So you really want a "Salamanders Land Raider Redeemer" with Multi-melta than a "Land Raider Redeemer" without?

Noooooooooooooooooooooooooo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Please for the all the is Holy! Make the Variant LR match in all lists stat wise.
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BlackLegion
 Post subject: Re: Salamanders
PostPosted: Fri Oct 08, 2010 8:54 pm 
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Generic Land Raider is 85pts in Salamanders armylist. Same as Land Raider Redemeer curently.

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Angel_of_Caliban
 Post subject: Re: Salamanders
PostPosted: Fri Oct 08, 2010 8:57 pm 
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BlackLegion wrote:
Generic Land Raider is 85pts in Salamanders armylist. Same as Land Raider Redemeer curently.

Right....But is looks like the LR is being dropped (Finally) to 75. See LR Thread.
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BlackLegion
 Post subject: Re: Salamanders
PostPosted: Fri Oct 08, 2010 9:31 pm 
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Then the proposal would change to:

Option 1: Add Multi-melta
Option 2: reduce cost to <75pts (50pts?)

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Angel_of_Caliban
 Post subject: Re: Salamanders
PostPosted: Fri Oct 08, 2010 9:42 pm 
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BlackLegion wrote:
Then the proposal would change to:

Option 1: Add Multi-melta
Option 2: reduce cost to <75pts (50pts?)

Do you really think there not worth a Standard LR? But I'd chose Option 2 if means keeping the Redeemer the same as other SM lists.
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BlackLegion
 Post subject: Re: Salamanders
PostPosted: Fri Oct 08, 2010 9:55 pm 
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TRC seems to think so.

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