We live with the TLD being the most attractive weapon overall, and return it to being 25pts.

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What about this?:

Implement the Wh40k weapons restriction but you are allowed to have one Battle Titan (or up to one Warlord AND up to one Reaver) without any weapons restriction.

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No 0-x limits. Noooo.

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Oh so no 0-1 limits on Supreme Commanders too? Great!

Ok without 0-x limits:
First Titan whithout weapons restrictions is without surcharge. The second costs +25pts, the third costs +50pts, the fourth +75pts, etc.

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As I've said before, I think this would be acceptable since it no longer competes with the free weapons. At the very least I think it's a worthy option to explore before turning to other solutions.

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-Vaaish

It even competes with 50pt weapons, due to how the slots work.

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For the record, my views are very similar to Dwarf Supreme's.
We did vote on using the 40K restrictions and it was soundly rejected.

Surely we don't want to follow 40K... to paraphrase - it is a game designed for kids after all
Sorry E&C I wish there was a tongue in cheek smiley face.

On a more serious note, the 40K restrictions don't make sense for Epic. As Vaaish pointed out, it would invalidate the GW Reaver and that isn't a good look for prospective Epic players.

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if we move to 40k restrictions, i will stop playing AMTL. aside from restricting options, i dont think it does anything good. it also invalidates many common builds that dont appear to be better than ones it allows. i literally cannot see any positive to doing this except perhaps that if you're running a mixed 40k/epic campaign, you can take the same titan in both... except wait, you can do that already!
if we move to an 'old model surcharge' i will stop playing AMTL. its an idea that, when you look at it, is absurd. try convincing the marine players that anyone using a less than current Thunderhawk that they have to pay a surcharge. or try to bring in a systemwide Proxy tax, where anyone not using the official model has to pay a surcharge. i don't see any of the above ideas going down well. :P
as i own 30 or so titans at the moment, i'd rather not do stop playing. but i'd even more rather not have wasted the money i've invested in them. luckily, it seems that almost everyone agrees with me, so yay ^_^

i'm with Vaaish, i dont see the TLD being better than the other 25pt weapons, just different. i also see no issue with changing the warhounds TLD to a 45pt range. just add a new weapon to the scout bracket, just call it a Turbolaser and leave the destructor on the higher hull versions, and move the TLD into the 25pt Battle titans weapons. you'll never see it on the battle titans, since there is a demonstratably better variant, but so what? hell, with a 45cm range couldnt you just bring the TL into the free weapons batch? aside from the range difference, i am really not seeing any big difference between the TLD and the VMB. if they both had the same range, they have perfectly mirrored stats. is AT just plain 25pts better than AP? cause i dont see it.

also, dropping the TLD in price would make the official titans match in price again.

isnt the point behind these being beta lists that we can try out ideas, see how they fit, and adjust? i realise with the new war engines book looming we wanna bring this as close to perfect as possible, but those of us calling for cheaper TLDs do think it's an improvement. can we not just try it out? if it becomes too good, then we can change back

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Other idea:
Increase the range of the Vulcan-Megabolter to 60cm After all it has a 60" range in Wh40k.
Ok bad argument as the Turbolaser-Destructor also has a 96" range whichis rougly +30% more range. Same as in Epic (45cm and 60cm).
The funny thing is that the Turbolaser-Destructor in Wh40k is more like the Epic Plasma-Blastgun (2 very powerful shots = 2 smaller erea of effect Volcano Cannon shots) and the Plasma-Blastgun with it's two fire modi is either 2 Battlecannon shots at 75cm or one Demolisher shot ar 90cm but both with slighty increased damage output (or wth something like Disrupt) because of the bigger blast templates.

If you really want to follow Wh40k in regards to Titan weapons then there would be some major changes in range and damage output. Perhabs then it would balance out...or would create an even bigger mess as the rulebook Titans would change too.

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You mean it competes with the laser blaster? That is true, 6 shots for 50 points or 8 shots for 50 points. I think it comes down to what you want. If you don't mind using both slots for the same thing the take 2x tld, if you need more weapons take the laser blaster. With the surcharge rule, it actually makes a lasbaster and two TLD a better option on a reaver than 3x TLD.

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-Vaaish

Yes, yes, a thousand times yes.

I do think it's a shame so many people are against them, as the 40k restrictions really do solve so many problems. Sigh.

It's understandable. People don't want to cut up their existing Titans.

So I guess we'll put the TLD back to 25pts, and live with it being the best weapon.

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"Count as" rule is always an option.

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