The Phase III list will have "Brood Swarms" to allow for the "waves of Gaunts" often encountered in such situations.

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According to 3rd Edition Codey Tyranids inearly Phase IV Gaunt swarms led by Tyranid Warriors accompanied by some Genestealers and Lictors are the main forces which are supported by accurate spore drops which reinforce these swarms.
Later in Phase IV Hive Tyrants, the different Carnifex genotypi, bio-artillery, etc appear.

Hmmm have to read IA 4....

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I've got these excerpts:

Phase III: Attack

The Tyranid invasion is begun by the hiveships releasing spores into the target's planets atmosphere. The mix typically includes mycetic spores for landing 'vanguard' and 'main force' ground assault swarms, spore 'mines' of a corrosive, poisonous and/or explosive capability, zoomorphic symbiotes and parasites, plus fertilisation, weather modification and necrotic varieties. Flying creatures are also dispatched, primarily swarms of winged Gaunt species tended to by the dropship-sized Harridan brood organisms.


Phase IV: Subdual

In the initial phases of invasion the flying swarms make concentric attacks in an effort to herd lifeforms into the path of ground swarms. Pre-existing Vanguard organisms will move to join the advance, presumably sharing their information of local DNA, topography and resistance with higher synaptic receptors of the Tyranid hive mind. Battles are frequently reinforced and expanded by the direct dropping of reinforcements in mycetic spores from the hive ships in orbit.

The ground swarms are continuously reinforced with increasingly powerful contingents of Tyranid Warriors, bio-artillery and specialised organisms like the Carnifex assault-beasts and Hive Tyrants. As resistance lines stabilise they are infiltrated or smashed with coordinated wave attacks and mycetic spore drops. Centres of resistance are surrounded, besieged by the gathering of increasingly large and powerful swarms until they are overrun.

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Strange. In my Codex (german) there is the exact same but between "Pre-existing Vanguard organisms will move to join the advance, presumably sharing their information of local DNA, topography and resistance with higher synaptic receptors of the Tyranid hive mind."
and
"Battles are frequently reinforced and expanded by the direct dropping of reinforcements in mycetic spores from the hive ships in orbit."

It says (translated by me): "The swarms at the ground move rapidly and consists mainly of different types of Gaunts and Tyranid Warriors with accompanying Lictors and Genestealers.
At this point the main weapon of the Tyranids ist sheer terror; the mobile lifeforms of the planet flee before them - into a even narrower circle where the Tyranids herd them together to be devoured. Points of resistance will be attacked and crushed as fast as possible."

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To add a bit more the Apocalypse book has a nice diagram (p147) if some details seem a little strange. Some background text and critters present given below.

Phase 1 - Vanguard - "Tyranid vanguard entities gather genetic and topographic information, communicating it to the Hive Mind through psychic or pheremonal channels. Command structures are disrupted or destroyed. Rebellion and panic is sown throughout the populace"
Tyranids Present - Lictors, Broodlords, Genestealers, Harridans and Gargoyles.

Phase 2 - Primary Incursion - "Mycetic Spores arrive, deploying countless minor attack organisms whose function is to deplete enemy resources, identify centres of resistance and engage the front line of defence, allowing larger synaptic organisms to approach"
Tyranids Present - Genestealers, Gaunts, Winged Warriors and Winged Tyrants.

Phase 3 - Synapse Swarm - "Should the enemy still prove capable, the Hive Fleets will alter the content of the Mycetic Spores to include larger bio-constructs and self sufficient synaptic nodes to better control the Tyranid attack. Most centres of resistance are defeated at this stage. If this is the case the Hive Fleets will initiate the consumption process. If the enemy proves capable of repelling even the Synapse swarms, the Hive Fleets will deploy larger line-breaker units and gargantuan assault organisms"
Tyranids Present - Warriors, Genestealers, Biovores, Tyrants, Tyrant Guard and Zoanthropes.

Phase 4 - Heavy Assault Wave - "Tertiary incursions are characterised by massive assault organisms ranging in size from battle tanks to Titans. This attack wave also includes rapid response forces that burrow directly into fortified areas bristling with heavy firepower, therby bypassing their guns"
Tyranids Present - Carnifexes, Hierodules, Hierophants, Trygons, Raveners, Dominatrixes and Assault Spawn.

First Phase is infiltration by freighter, space hulk etc (Questionable for anything other than genestealers) and the rest are Mycetic Spore drop. It also appears that each Phase represents reinforcements to existing forces on the ground. The two Nid lists are pretty spot on for Phase IV and Phase III swarm composition.

The only part that probably doesn't quite fit in the lists is the role of raveners as primarily tunnellers rather than brood creatures. Both options are available but LV makes the latter more popular than the former.

Shoot the big ones in 40K only refers to Hive Tryants and Carnifex's not Warriors or Raveners. Warriors should be infantry in Epic IMO, because they are just that expect a little larger then gaunts and such. Orgyns would be considered the same size and they are infantry! I am still testing out the 9.2.1 version and feel it still needs quite a bit of tweeking. I would prefer that the selections are a little more flexible, for instance being able to add extra carnifex's say up to 6 max per entry otherwise you are quite limited to the quantity of Uncommon broods you can take because your selection is already so limited with needing to take 2 common for every uncommon. Anyways I am digressing.

Roberious

Tyranid Warriors are the same size as Dreadnaughts which are classed as Armoured Vehicles.  Unlike the Dreadnaught controllers the Tyranid Warriors are exposed to enemy fire, sounds like the very definition of Light Vehicles to me.

"LV" really does not work here guys

Apart from movement and Difficult Terrain problems, the big issue with classing warriors as LV is that it allows the opponent to ignore the swarm and concentrate fire on them (unless the swarm also consists of a mix of other AP and AV targets). Even if the swarm actually consists of 50% vehicles and 50% infantry, the enemy only needs to use one style of weapon to kill that half of the swarm, and this negates the whole 'swarm' principle. Doing this will make it relatively easy to destroy these swarms by killing the synapse creatures and it will make it correspondingly easier for opponents to gain the BTS - so no-one will use warriors at all.

If we want to go down this path, IMO the only viable solution is to use a new definition of "BIG" (or whatever you want to call it) that permits these 'Big' critters to be targeted while in some way restricting the number of units that can do so - Eg

"A minimum of one and up to 25% of eligible units in the firing formation may target 'Big' critters".

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Actually, so far, almost all play examples have shown it to work fairly fine... it's a weakness for the Bugs, but an *intended* weakness, it hasn't been the "kiss of death" that many feared.

As to getting BTS, in almost all version of the list my opponents have tended to get BTS against the Bugs... again, that is an *intended* design choice... the only "spirit" the Tyranids have is the link to the Hive Mind, disrupting that "breaks" it!  So, an enemy fighting Tyranids "the way they should" is working towards this goal... it's supposed to be that way.

Swarms in a Phase IV configuration are *supposed* to be "mixed"... again, that's *intended*.

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That depends what you're listening to and who you're overlooking.

I have yet to play a game with 9.2 where my opponent hasn't scored BTS yet. Prior to that, I can count the number of times on one hand.

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But you've tended to play very infantry heavy, no, Dave?  With Tyranid Warriors hidden deep within Guant swarms to protect them?

Your experiences with you opponent achieving BTS have been the exact opposite of mine... my opponents got it a lot more in previous versions and are having to work for it now.  I'm not overlooking you, it's just that your experince seem anomalous to me, but it is being noted.

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I guess that this boils down to playing style and so on. The point I was trying to make is that with "LV" Warriors, they cannot be used in pure infantry swarms because they would be far too easy to kill. Indeed, I thought that the principle behind the main list was to encourage the extensive use of commons - precisely the opposite effect to what "LV" would encourage.

For what its worth, the lists I have used in the past have tended towards maximising the use of WE and "big" critters with minimal spawning capabilities, whose sole aim is to rush across the table and pin opponents in their half. I did use a few infantry based formations to improve the number of activations but never put any AV in with them

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Going back over 40 Battle Reports (20 games pre-9.x and 20 games post-9.x), Tyranids have had BTS scored against them 18 times and have scored it against the opposition only 7 times; Ten of those times have been Tyranid v9.x games.  Many of the v9.x BTS losses have been commented on as "new version" syndrome.

In 15 out of the 40 games, the Tyranids have acheived *no* Victory Conditions and I've found no instance of them achieving all five.  Ten games have gone to tie-breaker.

Pre-v9.x, Bugs won six of twenty games, post-v9.x Bugs won nine of twenty games.

Fun Fact - Hena has a remarkable number of games go to tie-breaker... and still wind up a tie (less than 10% difference)!

Note that this is just battles reported here... and found via "Search", data can have easily slipped through the cracks.

Fun Fact 2 - In the past two years or so, Bugs have never played against Lost and the Damned!

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Would it be worth going through those 40 games and trying to characterise the army style. Obviously the post 9.x lists are doing better but is that because it's a "better list" or certain units are becoming more or less common.

As gaunts are required and usually they're paired with warriors are there enough games to gauge the change to LV alone (without a greater influence from other changes).

With Tyranid Warriors treated as infantry, why would you not surround them with other infantry?

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