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Effective Krieg army list http://www.tacticalwargames.net/taccmd/viewtopic.php?f=95&t=27779	Page 1 of 2

Author:	Draccan [ Sun Jul 06, 2014 3:10 pm ]
Post subject:	Effective Krieg army list
Hi Wondering how to construct an effective Krieg army list. A game is coming up soon where I will play against 4000 pts. nids and thinking about playing a Krieg army. If all else fails I may do regular guard or SM instead. My question is how to do a list that is effective. Epic Armageddon is all about grabbing objectives. A Krieg list can be very static. And it is very tempting to get 2 times trenches and lots of infantry and earthshakers. But how to get those coveted objectives then? Also if you purchase gorgons for your krieg army will the enemy not just target those instead of your troops in the trenches? Since you can't really give them cover? I was thinking drills and rough riders could be a good way to grab objectives, but rough riders would probably be targeted just because of that. So those of you with experience in this, how would you go about fielding a Krieg list? bonus question: Which heavy tanks is best against nids. I am thinking baneblade can dish out a lot of AT or AP shots. Or Stormblade? EDIT: I am thinking the list below could be used as a static gunline with the exception of the one infantry company with gorgons which could operate more forward, the rough riders as well for objective hunting and the heavy tanks could maybe push ahead down the middle. The earthshakers ensure that he needs to move ahead with their 120 cm indirect barrages. Also do you think I should have two earthshaker artillery companies?

Author:	Draccan [ Sun Jul 06, 2014 3:22 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Effective Krieg army list
Toying around with a list like this - which maybe lack some macharius or leman russ tanks? (I haven't checked if the point values are still valid, so this is just to exemplify my thinking in a quickly made list) Death Korps of Krieg / Death Korps of Krieg 3900 Death Korps Regimental HQ 400 Death Korps Supreme Commander 19xDeath Korps Infantry Death Korps Infantry Company 425 Death Korps Commander 19xDeath Korps Infantry 2xDeath Korps Gorgon Siege Transporter Death Korps Infantry Company 300 Death Korps Commander 19xDeath Korps Infantry Death Rider Company 250 12xDeath Korps Rough Riders Artillery Support Company 600 9xEarthshaker Platform Deathstrike Silo 250 Deathstrike Missile Silo Flak Battery 125 3xHydra Platform Medusa Battery 275 3xMedusa Platform 3xGun Emplacement Medusa Battery 275 3xMedusa Platform 3xDeath Korps Trojan Super-Heavy Tank Company 500 3xBaneblade Trenchworks 100 80cm of Trenches plus 4 Bunkers. Trenchworks 100 80cm of Trenches plus 4 Bunkers. Thunderbolt Squadron 150 2xThunderbolt Fighter-Bomber Heavy Squadron 150 Marauder Heavy Bomber

Author:	Kyrt [ Sun Jul 06, 2014 8:03 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Effective Krieg army list
I personally like the offensive style, ie not at all "static". 3 coys in gorgons is pretty hard to deal with and you just send them up the field threatening the objectives.

Author:	kyussinchains [ Sun Jul 06, 2014 9:53 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Effective Krieg army list
Yeah krieg companies in trenches are a waste, can't shoot or move effectively and they're easily clipped, the list was built around infantry mounted in gorgons, one of the most potent engagement formations in the game Stormswords are the tank of choice against infantry hordes, 3 templates of ignore cover + disrupt barrage, backed up by twin heavy bolters and ignore cover flamers Don't forgrt also that your gorgons can lob out barrages too

Author:	Draccan [ Mon Jul 07, 2014 12:31 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Effective Krieg army list
I see why trenches are a waste in the current rules. Esp. since infantry in the trenches are unable to shoot heavy weapons. And you can't even entrench tanks a get a benefit. Fire support teams are anti-personnal mostly (AT6+). I was kinda hoping someone had some input that proved me wrong. As I would love the idea of playing with entrenched Krieg. Not only is it fluffy, but I have tons of bunkers and defense lines (count as trench) and would love to put it to use.. Another thing: I wonder how effective offensive Krieg in Gorgons would be against a charging Tyranid horde. Sounds a bit like rushing to your death :p EDIT: Maybe engineer heavy for digging up around the board (seem a tad expensive) and a lot of fliers (Nids seems to be weak against fliers)? I wonder if Thunderbolts or Marauders are better for this task... I know Marauders are bombers, but still...

Author:	novemberrain [ Mon Jul 07, 2014 7:55 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Effective Krieg army list
If youa re looking for a defensive siege list, try Barans. Even though everyone whinges about how boring they are, I actually quite like them.

Author:	kyussinchains [ Mon Jul 07, 2014 10:04 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Effective Krieg army list
krieg were developed pretty much specifically to be the opposite of the baran siegemasters, I agree with novemberrain, if you want to play a defensive list, the siegemasters are the way forward Gorgon-mounted infantry are awesome, three companies would be great at chewing through a nid force, you start with a unit count of 26 and the first 6 hits are going on the reinforced armour of the gorgons, you'll also have a commissar, so with your arty prepping, you're starting anywhere from +3 to +5 up on combat resolution, and you put out 26+1MW attacks, which will do a lot of hurt to most infantry formations, you're also equally good at CC or FF which means nids swarming into BTB are no better off....

Author:	Onyx [ Mon Jul 07, 2014 11:30 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Effective Krieg army list
kyussinchains wrote: Gorgon-mounted infantry are awesome, three companies would be great at chewing through a nid force, you start with a unit count of 26 and the first 6 hits are going on the reinforced armour of the gorgons,... This is mostly true and quite situational. The FAQ clarification on War Engines barging friendly infantry aside (ie, they can't do it) has hampered the ability of the Gorgons to soak up the first 6 hits. This was necessary to stop this exact situation. This formation that was designed to be an attrition force (20 stands with no armour save) was suddenly almost always guaranteed of 6x 4+ reinforced armour saves in engagements... That is simply not on. So remember that infantry in base contact with an enemy unit cannot be moved at all by a charging/counter charging Gorgon. The Gorgon has to either be able to move completely over the friendly infantry or move around it (towards the nearest enemy).

Author:	Draccan [ Mon Jul 07, 2014 12:28 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Effective Krieg army list
26? There are 20 infantry, 2 gorgons. Last is fire support? What do you mean by over the infantry Onyx? So each Gorgon soak up 3 hits but only if they naturally can move to the front.

Author:	Onyx [ Mon Jul 07, 2014 1:07 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Effective Krieg army list
20 Infantry + 2x 3DC war engines = 26 dice Over the infantry means exactly what it says. A war engine that is counter charging cannot move in any way a friendly infantry stand that is in base contact with an enemy unit. A counter charging war engine must be able to move completely over the friendly stand or move around it. This will be very hard for Gorgons as they only have a 5cm counter charge. There are other situations where it would be easier (Ork Battle Fortresses in a Boyz formation for example) with war engines that can move 30cm (and get a 10cm counter charge). Each Gorgon will soak up 3 hits first as long as they are the nearest unit to the enemy. If there are many units in base to base with the enemy, then the defender places the hits as he chooses (meaning it's the defenders choice if the Gorgons receive the hits before the armourless infantry... a no brainer ).

Author:	MrGonzo [ Mon Jul 07, 2014 1:43 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Effective Krieg army list
Based on my own eUK Krieg army, what about something like this? Not sure about the Macharius to be honest, but 4k gives room for them and they do provide some great range fire. Incompertus, 4000 POINTS Death Korps of Krieg (NetEA Tournament Pack 2013) ================================================== REGIMENTAL HQ [525] Death Korps Supreme Commander, 19 Death Korps Infantry units, Gorgon Siege Transporters (2 Gorgons) INFANTRY COMPANY [425] Death Korps Commander, 19 Death Korps Infantry units, Gorgon Siege Transporters (2 Gorgons) INFANTRY COMPANY [425] Death Korps Commander, 19 Death Korps Infantry units, Gorgon Siege Transporters (2 Gorgons) DEATH RIDER COMPANY [250] 12 Death Korps Rough Rider units DEATHSTRIKE SILO [250] Death Korps Deathstrike Missile Silo SUPER-HEAVY TANK PLATOON [200] Shadowsword SUPER-HEAVY TANK PLATOON [200] Shadowsword HEAVY SUPPORT BATTERY [125] 3 Hydra or Heavy Anti-Aircraft Platform, 3 Trojans HEAVY SUPPORT BATTERY [125] 3 Hydra or Heavy Anti-Aircraft Platform, 3 Trojans THUNDERBOLT FIGHTERS [150] 2 Thunderbolts WARHOUND TITAN [275] WARHOUND TITAN [275] WARHOUND TITAN [275] DEATH RIDER SCOUT PLATOON [150] 6 Death Korps Rough Rider units (with 'scout' ability) HEAVY TANK PLATOON [350] 2 Macharius Tanks, Macharius Command Tank

Author:	Draccan [ Mon Jul 07, 2014 1:47 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Effective Krieg army list
Thanks Steve for clarification. And thanks MrGonzo for the list. Looks interesting! Are you keeping the shadow swords and warhounds separate for activation and deployment purposes? Also aren't the baneblade better against nids?

Author:	MikeT [ Mon Jul 07, 2014 3:01 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Effective Krieg army list
Shadowswards are awesome against everything; in this particular case sniping the nasty bio war engines or 4+RA carnifexs etc. After that, Stormswords with all their Ignore Cover and disrupt are going to be better than Baneblades. In fact, I'd take Stormswords instead of Macharius.

Author:	Draccan [ Mon Jul 07, 2014 3:04 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Effective Krieg army list
Good points. Maybe sacrificing the Macharius and death strike and get an artillery company with earthshakers... with 120 cm range they can still support an advance?

Author:	Draccan [ Mon Jul 07, 2014 3:34 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Effective Krieg army list
How about this? Death Korps of Krieg / Death Korps of Krieg 4000 Death Korps Regimental HQ 525 Death Korps Supreme Commander 19xDeath Korps Infantry 2xDeath Korps Gorgon Siege Transporter Death Korps Infantry Company 550 Death Korps Commander 19xDeath Korps Infantry 2xDeath Korps Gorgon Siege Transporter 3xHellhound Death Korps Infantry Company 500 Death Korps Commander 19xDeath Korps Infantry 4xDeath Korps Support Squad 2xDeath Korps Gorgon Siege Transporter Artillery Support Company 600 9xEarthshaker Platform Death Rider Scout Platoon 150 6xDeath Korps Rough Riders Death Rider Scout Platoon 150 6xDeath Korps Rough Riders Flak Battery 125 2xHydra Platform Heavy AA Platform 3xDeath Korps Trojan Super-Heavy Tank Platoon 200 Shadowsword Super-Heavy Tank Platoon 200 Shadowsword Warhound Titan 275 Warhound Titan Warhound Titan 275 Warhound Titan Thunderbolt Squadron 150 2xThunderbolt Fighter-Bomber Heavy Squadron 150 Marauder Heavy Bomber Heavy Squadron 150 Marauder Heavy Bomber

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