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Elysian Drop Troop 3k (ish)/ 4k
http://www.tacticalwargames.net/taccmd/viewtopic.php?f=95&t=25544		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  jimmyzimms [ Tue Jul 09, 2013 6:35 pm ]
Post subject:  Elysian Drop Troop 3k (ish)/ 4k
Using the Elysian List 2012 Compendium with 3k and 4k variations

Feedback greatly appreciated:

3k Version
=======================
Regimental HQ
- 1 Elysian Supreme Commander unit, 7 Elysian Drop Troop Infantry units 375 points
+ support squad
+ hardened vets (2)

Drop Troop Company
- 1 Elysian Commander unit, 7 Elysian Drop Troop Infantry units 200 points

Drop Troop Company
- 1 Elysian Commander unit, 7 Elysian Drop Troop Infantry units 200 points

Drop Troop Company
- 1 Elysian Commander unit, 7 Elysian Drop Troop Infantry units 200 points

Storm Trooper Platoon
- 8 Elysian Storm Trooper units and 4 Valkyries 350 points

Storm Trooper Platoon
- 8 Elysian Storm Trooper units and 4 Valkyries 350 points

Drop Sentinel Squadron
- 4 Drop Sentinels 150 points

Drop Sentinel Squadron
- 4 Drop Sentinels 150 points

Lightning Squadron
- 4 Lightning Interceptors 300 points

Vulture Squadron
- 4 Vultures w/Punishers Upgrade 350 points

Tauros Squadron
- 4 Tauros w/ Tauros Venator 150 points

Tauros Squadron
- 4 Tauros w/ Tauros Venator 150 points
=======================
2925 pts
I've got a few points to play with left over that slotting them in would be nice. In addition I intend to play BTS games between the Lightnings and the HQ if needed.


4k Version
=======================
Regimental HQ
- 1 Elysian Supreme Commander unit, 7 Elysian Drop Troop Infantry units 375 points
+ support squad
+ hardened vets (2)

Drop Troop Company
- 1 Elysian Commander unit, 7 Elysian Drop Troop Infantry units 200 points

Drop Troop Company
- 1 Elysian Commander unit, 7 Elysian Drop Troop Infantry units 200 points

Drop Troop Company
- 1 Elysian Commander unit, 7 Elysian Drop Troop Infantry units 200 points

Drop Troop Company
- 1 Elysian Commander unit, 7 Elysian Drop Troop Infantry units 200 points

Storm Trooper Platoon
- 8 Elysian Storm Trooper units and 4 Valkyries 350 points

Storm Trooper Platoon
- 8 Elysian Storm Trooper units and 4 Valkyries 350 points

Drop Sentinel Squadron
- 4 Drop Sentinels 150 points

Drop Sentinel Squadron
- 4 Drop Sentinels 150 points

Strike Squadron
- 2 Lightning Strike Fighters 200 points

Strike Squadron
- 2 Lightning Strike Fighters 200 points

Destroyer Squadron
- 2 Marauder Destroyers 375 points

Vulture Squadron
- 4 Vultures w/Punishers Upgrade 350 points

Vulture Squadron
- 4 Vultures w/Punishers Upgrade 350 points

Tauros Squadron
- 4 Tauros w/ Tauros Venator 150 points

Tauros Squadron
- 4 Tauros w/ Tauros Venator 150 points
=======================
3950 pts.
Again leaves me with some play on the upgrades. This seems to push more on the air power tip.
Author:  Ginger [ Sun Jul 21, 2013 9:42 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Elysian Drop Troop 3k (ish)/ 4k
I tested out Elysians some time ago, and found that they really need *lots* of sentinels. I would suggest at least parity with the number of Drop troops and up to a ratio of 2:1. One of the key ideals is to use "commander" to allow combined attacks with the sentinels in support. These lightly armed troops also need to make extensive use of cover. The other thing being sentinels can provide a lot of cheap activations to allow the Elysians to re-position at the end of each turn.

The Air mobile units are 'nice' but provide a tendency towards splitting up the army into several parts in the face of the enemy, which usually allows the enemy to concentrate on destroying each in turn. They are best thought of as mobile 'reserves' used to support the front-line troops which come under extreme pressure.

My 2 cents as they say.
Author:  jimmyzimms [ Thu Aug 01, 2013 11:14 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Elysian Drop Troop 3k (ish)/ 4k
Good feedback.

So something more along these lines for 3k?
=======================
Regimental HQ
- 1 Elysian Supreme Commander unit, 7 Elysian Drop Troop Infantry units 350 points
+ support squad
+ hardened vets (1)

Drop Troop Company
- 1 Elysian Commander unit, 7 Elysian Drop Troop Infantry units 200 points

Drop Troop Company
- 1 Elysian Commander unit, 7 Elysian Drop Troop Infantry units 200 points

Drop Troop Company
- 1 Elysian Commander unit, 7 Elysian Drop Troop Infantry units 200 points

Drop Sentinel Squadron
- 4 Drop Sentinels 150 points

Drop Sentinel Squadron
- 4 Drop Sentinels 150 points

Drop Sentinel Squadron
- 4 Drop Sentinels 150 points

Drop Sentinel Squadron
- 4 Drop Sentinels 150 points

Drop Sentinel Squadron
- 4 Drop Sentinels 150 points

Vulture Squadron
- 4 Vultures w/Punishers Upgrade 350 points

Storm Trooper Platoon
- 8 Elysian Storm Trooper units and 4 Valkyries 350 points

Tauros Squadron
- 4 Tauros w/ Tauros Venator 150 points

Tauros Squadron
- 4 Tauros w/ Tauros Venator 150 points

Lightning Squadron
- 4 Lightning Interceptors 300 points
=======================
Author:  Ginger [ Fri Aug 02, 2013 2:25 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Elysian Drop Troop 3k (ish)/ 4k
yup - that looks more like it. Good luck.
Author:  Moscovian [ Wed Aug 14, 2013 2:21 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Elysian Drop Troop 3k (ish)/ 4k
You may want to consider at least two air formations, whether they be fighters, fighter/bombers, or bombers. Here is why... If you are going up against an opponent with two air formations, you are going to want them focused on your airplanes. Even taking bombers forces your opponent to CAP or intercept. That means he isn't hunting your army that is composed of AVs with 5+ armor and your LVs which can get chewed up pretty easily by aircraft.
Author:  jimmyzimms [ Wed Aug 14, 2013 6:50 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Elysian Drop Troop 3k (ish)/ 4k
=======================
Regimental HQ
- 1 Elysian Supreme Commander unit, 7 Elysian Drop Troop Infantry units 400 points
+ support squad
+ hardened vets (2)
+ mortar squad

Drop Troop Company
- 1 Elysian Commander unit, 7 Elysian Drop Troop Infantry units 200 points

Drop Troop Company
- 1 Elysian Commander unit, 7 Elysian Drop Troop Infantry units 200 points

Drop Troop Company
- 1 Elysian Commander unit, 7 Elysian Drop Troop Infantry units 200 points

Drop Sentinel Squadron
- 4 Drop Sentinels 150 points

Drop Sentinel Squadron
- 4 Drop Sentinels 150 points

Drop Sentinel Squadron
- 4 Drop Sentinels 150 points

Drop Sentinel Squadron
- 4 Drop Sentinels 150 points

Vulture Squadron
- 4 Vultures w/Punishers Upgrade 350 points

Storm Trooper Platoon
- 8 Elysian Storm Trooper units and 4 Valkyries 350 points

Tauros Squadron
- 4 Tauros w/ Tauros Venator 150 points

Tauros Squadron
- 4 Tauros w/ Tauros Venator 150 points

Lightning Strike Squadron 200 points
- 2 Lightning Interceptors

Lightning Strike Squadron 200 points
- 2 Lightning Interceptors
=======================

Comes out to exactly 3k
Beefed up the HQ as there were actually 3 BTS capable formations. Exact composition of upgrades is variable depending on play-style preferences but that's pretty straight forward.
Author:  Moscovian [ Wed Aug 14, 2013 6:57 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Elysian Drop Troop 3k (ish)/ 4k
Looks good, although you could easily exchange one of the drop sentinel formations for a support sentinel formation. They shoot 45cm on the indirect and can hide easily in terrain or behind buildings. Teleport them in and zap artillery formations. They won't do much except place BMs, but that could be the difference between a 4BP and a 3BP strike from your opponent.
Author:  jimmyzimms [ Wed Aug 14, 2013 7:02 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Elysian Drop Troop 3k (ish)/ 4k
Moscovian wrote:
Looks good, although you could easily exchange one of the drop sentinel formations for a support sentinel formation. They shoot 45cm on the indirect and can hide easily in terrain or behind buildings. Teleport them in and zap artillery formations. They won't do much except place BMs, but that could be the difference between a 4BP and a 3BP strike from your opponent.


Don't see that in the compendium list. There a newer one I should be looking at?
Author:  Moscovian [ Wed Aug 14, 2013 7:26 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Elysian Drop Troop 3k (ish)/ 4k
jimmyzimms wrote:
Moscovian wrote:
Looks good, although you could easily exchange one of the drop sentinel formations for a support sentinel formation. They shoot 45cm on the indirect and can hide easily in terrain or behind buildings. Teleport them in and zap artillery formations. They won't do much except place BMs, but that could be the difference between a 4BP and a 3BP strike from your opponent.


Don't see that in the compendium list. There a newer one I should be looking at?


I wouldn't call it "newer" but I would call it the most recent one. Honda made this list up before he left the forum and that is the list I've been playing with since 2011.

Personally I think the list is due for another update based on a lot of games I've had with them over the past two years.

The bombers need to go back to being offered in pairs. It was reduced to singles to keep them from doing the bomber shuffle (where the healthy one takes point and the damaged one remains in the back), but it has made them extremely vulnerable and not worth taking.

The Cyclops needs to be clarified as expendable. It's implied and the guys I play with know what it is for, but that doesn't help much if you are playing against somebody who is unfamiliar with the list.

Vendettas IMO are underpriced and should be at 325 or maybe 350. 12 x AT4+ shots is a lot to throw at an opponent. They should also have their own stat box.

Vultures with Punisher Cannons are also underpriced at 325. They should be 350... Or reduce the number of shots. Right now they have 16 x AP4+ at 30cm. Sure the range is short, but when you are doubling you are belting out a lot of firepower after skimming upwards of 70cm. It becomes 16 x AP5+. I just can't think of anything that it would compare to.

Attachments:
Elysian_Drop_Troop_Army_List_v3.1.5a.pdf [68.96 KiB]
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Author:  jimmyzimms [ Wed Aug 14, 2013 7:54 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Elysian Drop Troop 3k (ish)/ 4k
Yeah this is pretty different, actually this is more like 4.x as opposed to what's in the compendium.
This an abandoned list then? Bummer. When things get more settled around here we need to go do something about that, methinks.

So the above list I will call good for Compendium and switch to this other version for an alternative list.
Author:  Alf O'Mega [ Wed Aug 14, 2013 7:56 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Elysian Drop Troop 3k (ish)/ 4k
That list looks pretty wildly different from the one in the compendium - have they both been thoroughly tested?
Author:  Moscovian [ Wed Aug 14, 2013 8:02 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Elysian Drop Troop 3k (ish)/ 4k
I can tell you I've played almost every list for the Elysians and the 3.1.5a (not sure about the wacky designator but...) is the most playable. Externally I would say it is still slightly underpowered, with the notable exceptions I made on the Vendetta and Punisher armed Vulture.

The Elysians originally had the bombers come in pairs and they were the 'titans' of the list. 4 DC of flying madness. Then a few vocal players were complaining about how that configuration can be abused. I agree there is a chance of it being manipulated, but the Elysians needed every dirty trick they could squeeze out. Honda split them into single flying units anyway. Since then those bombers haven't done much.
Author:  jimmyzimms [ Wed Aug 14, 2013 8:11 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Elysian Drop Troop 3k (ish)/ 4k
*edited*
misread above post
Author:  Alf O'Mega [ Wed Aug 14, 2013 9:29 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Elysian Drop Troop 3k (ish)/ 4k
I really don't want to derail the topic but I've only just noticed the change of the marauder to war engine status. Anyone able to give me a very brief history of that and why it's not reflected in the steel legion list? Looks like it happened around the time of the Krieg list, probably due to fw releasing a model?
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