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EpicUK Space Marine Update
http://www.tacticalwargames.net/taccmd/viewtopic.php?f=88&t=21026		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  Steve54 [ Tue Jul 12, 2011 9:55 am ]
Post subject:  EpicUK Space Marine Update
EPIC UK SPACE MARINE UPDATE
Epic UK are pleased to announce that all 5 of our Space Marine lists have been updated. These lists have now been used in tournaments for nearly 3 years and this update addresses issues and possible improvements that have been highlighted in that time. These updated lists will be legal for Britcon and all events after that

http://www.epic-uk.co.uk/armylists.shtml

Quick reference sheets to follow shortly
Author:  Mephiston [ Tue Jul 12, 2011 10:29 am ]
Post subject:  Re: EpicUK Space Marine Update
Quickly followed by updated files at Adam77's awesome army builder!
Author:  GlynG [ Tue Jul 12, 2011 5:50 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: EpicUK Space Marine Update
Great to see this chaps! :) The various changes look good and help make various under-powered/used units/lists better. I particularly approve of the Predator formation changes, like I suggested a while back on here :)

The only other things I think it's a shame you didn't tweak as well are Las-Cannon Razorbacks to FF 6+ (to make them a bit less obviously better of the two options) and Tacticals to 275.

Is this a one off or will you possibly do it for other lists in future? The Imperial Guard list has a lot of formation upgrade options in particular that are poor.
Author:  Simulated Knave [ Tue Jul 12, 2011 6:02 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: EpicUK Space Marine Update
I would concur with Glyn on this. Nice, but not as much as I'd like.

Then again, since I'm in Canada, that's not that important. :P
Author:  Steve54 [ Tue Jul 12, 2011 6:56 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: EpicUK Space Marine Update
We will review all the lists we have done at some stage though the priority is the development of new lists
Author:  GlynG [ Tue Jul 12, 2011 8:25 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: EpicUK Space Marine Update
Fair play, was just curious.

The changes should make a wider range of competitively viable lists possible and boost ground lists, so I'm pleased by the release. Hopefully we can get the new marine champion here to consider adopting some of these changes here :)
Author:  Simulated Knave [ Tue Jul 12, 2011 8:52 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: EpicUK Space Marine Update
Personally, I don't think it's a time for changes in the SM list. I shudder to think what neal would do to someone who slowed down the army book project any more. ;)

After that's out for a little while, though, I think it'd definitely be worth looking at the list in light of these changes.
Author:  GlynG [ Tue Jul 12, 2011 9:08 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: EpicUK Space Marine Update
Why should we slow down changes one iota due to the army book? Obviously the army book officially freezes in time particular lists for a year from how they were at a time (and I wouldn't want to slow it down anymore than the glacial speed it is taking now!), but development should still be free to happen and change in the meantime anyway no? (it just wouldn't impact till the army book till second year on version).
Author:  Simulated Knave [ Tue Jul 12, 2011 10:12 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: EpicUK Space Marine Update
Because until the army book's out, the various changes aren't in a single, easily-accessible place that makes for effective discussion. Indeed, I think a lot of the draft documents have been taken down - not that they were all current any more.

Plus, the book may encourage higher forum numbers - that can't hurt discussion.
Author:  Kyrt [ Wed Jul 13, 2011 2:38 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: EpicUK Space Marine Update
Hi Steve, devastators seem to have acquired a 30cm move.

Haven't looked any further than that. Does anyone have a quick list of the changes?
Author:  Simulated Knave [ Wed Jul 13, 2011 2:58 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: EpicUK Space Marine Update
They discuss them at the end of the PDF, though they don't entirely itemize them.
Author:  yme-loc [ Wed Jul 13, 2011 3:11 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: EpicUK Space Marine Update
Kyrt wrote:
Hi Steve, devastators seem to have acquired a 30cm move.

Haven't looked any further than that. Does anyone have a quick list of the changes?


Thanks for the spot, its annoying it doesn't seem to matter how many times you check these things something slips through. Obviously the speed of Devs should be 15cm and the 30cm looks like a cut and paste error from the Assaults.

If anyone finds any mistakes in the updated codex please post them here - so they can be fixed.

All the actual changes that have gone into the lists are discussed at the end in the What, How, Why section.
Author:  Evil and Chaos [ Wed Jul 13, 2011 3:27 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: EpicUK Space Marine Update
Aye but the changes since v1, are they in a separate list?
Author:  yme-loc [ Wed Jul 13, 2011 3:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: EpicUK Space Marine Update
Evil and Chaos wrote:
Aye but the changes since v1, are they in a separate list?


Well they are listed separately in the What, How, Why section but for ease

Codex (and variant lists where relevant)
1. Blast Markers rounded down to minimum of 1 in assault.
2. Land Raiders - go to FF4+
3. Predator Destructors - gain FF4+ go to 225pts for 4 with Annihilator upgrade choice (25 for 2 or 50 for 4)
4. Vindicators - gain Walker
5. Tornado/Typhoon upgrade - go to 0 / 10 points
6. Sniper upgrade - 50 for all Scouts get Sniper
7. Marauder Bombers - 3Bp Bombs
8. Warhound Titan - Takes 1 Dam and staggers on critical

Black Templars
1. Hunter upgrade change
2. Land Raider Crusader Twin Assault Cannon goes to AP4+/AT4+
3. Thunderhawk Transporter FF5+, 4+ RA and now has 4 Twin Heavy Bolters.

Blood Angels
1. Baal - gains FF3+ and Twin Assault Cannon goes to AP4+/AT4+, formation receives more upgrade choices.
2. Death Company - gain Dreadnought option

Dark Angels
1. Deathwing Terminators - Gain special rule (effectively Leader - just not the Marine version)
2. Ravenwing formation - changes to 4 Bikes and 4 Speeders, cost reduced to 350pts
3. New Ravenwing Tornado formation added
4. Dark Angel Devs - gain FF3+ and drop to 275pts
5. Hunter upgrade change

White Scars
No change other than relevant Codex stuff.
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