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[Experimental] New Chaos Feral Titan List

 Post subject: Re: [Experimental] New Chaos Feral Titan List
PostPosted: Sun Nov 08, 2015 8:34 am 
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So I managed 2 games with the titans on the weekend

Game 1 was Myself with the titans vs Orks (Orks win)
Game 2 was myself with marines vs Chaos Titans (Chaos titans win)

Did not manage full activation reports but have turn summaries which capture the highlights

The Chaos titan list used in both games was the same as the one above

Game 1 - Orks

Fudd my openent ran teh follwoing ork list

Landa - 200
Landa 200
Stormboys - one extra stand - 175
warband normal- dreadnaought - 225
warband normal- dreadnaought - 225
Kult of speed - 7 schorchas, 1 buggy - 200
Kult of speed - 7 schorchas, 1 buggy - 200
Big Warband - warlord - 350
big guns - big size, oddboy - 275 points
blitz brigade - 2 gun wagon, 2 flakk, oddboy - 200
blitz brigade - 2 gun wagon, 2 flakk, oddboy - 200
fightas x 3 - 150
fightas x4 - 200
fightas x4 - 200

Turn 1 - Orks won initiative
So after early fightas and shooting and breaking my war hound i moved it over ready to set up a turn 2 potential engagement however i did not measure intermingle range on my demon knights and this was exploited well by a lander full of orks by fudd which killed the warhound and broke the knights before they could activate. Not much else happened to note down as Fudd had garrisoned his Bts and big guns on the half way line which gave me pause to think so I decided to play patient and wait till turn 2.

Turn 2 - Titans win initiative
So this turn started out well with my defilers moving up prepping an engage on the ork bts which was followed up by my BTS reaver retaining and engaging on them. I was able to roll well and completely wipe out the BTS orks with help from combat res (i won by 5 rolled a 5 fudd rolled double 1). This move worked so well fudd tried to replicate with his skorchas prepping but the landa failed its retain roll. Throughout the rest of the turn i was able to take out some more skorchas. However fudd and his oddboys managed to get into position and kill my BTS reaver. This left turn 3 ina hard spot for me with dwindling activation's

Turn 3 - Orks win initiative

SO Fudd straight up broke 2 units that i failed to rally BMS off which left me with 3 activations on the board. I spent the rest of the game trying to stop a complete whitewash.

Game ended 4-1 orks way (BTS, T&H, DTF, TSNP) to my (BTS)

Now at the end of this game I learned a few things about the list.

Marks - The marks do need to be changed and the idea of having a few different mark options that i mentioned in an earlier post I think will work well

Weapons - This was Fudds biggest point with the list at the current moment the weapons just don't do enough for titans. When a titan is expected to be able to delete a unit every activation it becomes hard with no macro or TK at range. Again currently developing some solutions to this issue.

Units - I dont think there was anything majorly wrong with the list or the list structure so will continue to monitor and tweak when needed.


Onto game 2
Now this was a game where i wanted to use a list that is quite standard and I have used quite often and against titans alot. the idea here was for me to try and test the boundaries of the chaos titans and put them in a favorable match up and see how the weaknesses in the list would show through.

The marine list i took was

1. Tactical Det 500
Sup Comd
2 x Razorbacks
2 x Rhinos
Hunter

2. Terminator Det 400
Chaplain

3. Bike Det 250
Chaplain
1 x Attack Bike

4. Land Speeder Det 250
2 x Typhoon

5. Predator Det 250

6. Land Raider Det 325

7. Thunderhawk 200

8. Whirlwind Det 375
Hunter

9. Warhound Titan 275

10. Thunderbolt Sqn 175

So turn 1 - Titans won initiative

Turn 1 saw myself trying to bait out his activation's which worked well. The Khorne reaver had moved up and allowed me the opportunity to fire my warhound, land raiders, preds and air craft at it from relative safety. However all i managed was 2 dc points and to break it. From hear the marines luck left it.

Turn 2 - Titans won initiative
Now that luck I spoke about. So i Teleported the terminators in to theoretically engage the knights and intermingled warhound with support from bikes and speeders. However I lost initiative and this resulted in the knights breaking the terminators who died later that turn to the Hellblades. The rest of the turn and game followed suit.
It only went to turn 4 as my opponent stuffed up and didn't get the objectives properly. Turn 4 saw me able to steal some luck and push myself around the board and prevent him from out right holding objectives. I ended up losing 2-1.

This game showed that again the weapons just don't have the punch they need for titans. The titans were able to break my units but not kill which in turn 4 hurt him with single land raiders and speeders moving around the board.



So I will continue to theory hammer the list. Would love further feedback, thoughts and ideas from you guys. Plus any list development or game results would be fantastic

Chat later
Caz


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 Post subject: Re: [Experimental] New Chaos Feral Titan List
PostPosted: Sun Nov 08, 2015 1:19 pm 
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How did it go?

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 Post subject: Re: [Experimental] New Chaos Feral Titan List
PostPosted: Sun Nov 08, 2015 11:42 pm 
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How did what go?


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 Post subject: Re: [Experimental] New Chaos Feral Titan List
PostPosted: Mon Nov 09, 2015 11:13 am 
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weird, I must have loaded a cached version from before the batrep went up :)

That's an interesting pair of games. Titans suffer on objective control (to nobody's surprise). The moderate weakness of the weapons was always built in as the reduced range - damaged formations can lurk much closer then in other lists, letting them send more firepower the titans way.
This was supposed to give the fodder a role in mop-up and tie up - much as the hell blades did on the termies in the 2nd game.

The two reavers you took had 2x rocket launchers and and mortar and an energy flail, mortar and rocket launcher respectively, which is a simialr mix to the other games - is driven by table top models?

The points spent on leader seemed possibly wasted since you had so few formation to carry out the mass assaults. That's a nice balancer in the list to have.

I'd like to see a 3xrocket launcher and maybe a 3xtwin hell mortar reaver. The latter was always weak in my theory hammer, but it's the best chance the titan has of hitting multiple formations/discouraging massed assaults.
The poor scatterblaster would have done better against the orks too, and the range synergises with the mortar better.

The Slaanesh speed upgrade with a 2xCC (or 3xcc) reaver seems worth testing - it was always one I had trouble balancing.

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 Post subject: Re: [Experimental] New Chaos Feral Titan List
PostPosted: Tue Nov 10, 2015 7:45 am 
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It was good to face the list Zac, i don't think you went that badly, the Ork list, especially the one that i took is an exceptionally hard match up for the titans, or any titan army for that matter. it's always (and should be) a hard game for them to come out on top of.
Could be important to not get caught up in weapons needing to be powerful enough to delete entire formations a turn, more so something that can dish out enough casualties to yes perhaps delete some of those sub par smaller formations, enough to at least break the mid range formation size etc.

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 Post subject: Re: [Experimental] New Chaos Feral Titan List
PostPosted: Sun Nov 15, 2015 2:45 am 
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Yeah Weapons will be an interesting test

I will look at building some of the reaver load outs you mentioned and plan on getting a new mark table up and running this week


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 Post subject: Re: [Experimental] New Chaos Feral Titan List
PostPosted: Sun Nov 15, 2015 1:54 pm 
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I remembered the logic behind the more complex eopithets - it was to spread the benefits between CC and ranged weapons in one 'block' to encourage people to take a mix of weapons.

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 Post subject: Re: [Experimental] New Chaos Feral Titan List
PostPosted: Mon Nov 16, 2015 8:11 am 
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Yeah the aim is to make 3 or 4 different options inside each mark so you can mix and match. I am also looking at mark specific weapons so this could alleviate some of the issues


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 Post subject: Re: [Experimental] New Chaos Feral Titan List
PostPosted: Tue May 10, 2016 12:32 am 
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Any movement on this?

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 Post subject: Re: [Experimental] New Chaos Feral Titan List
PostPosted: Sun Sep 04, 2016 5:38 am 
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Ok, so just looking at some of the weapons for a bit, and holy shit the Warlord's hex gatling seems a bit OP. I feel like the 14th shots should be knocked down to at LEAST 9 or 10.


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 Post subject: Re: [Experimental] New Chaos Feral Titan List
PostPosted: Sun Sep 04, 2016 11:46 am 
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Apologies for the lack of movement but due to real life preventing me from hobbying and developing the list

At the moment I can't progress it but happy for someone else to take the reigns


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 Post subject: Re: [Experimental] New Chaos Feral Titan List
PostPosted: Thu Sep 22, 2016 5:49 pm 
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LeCacty wrote:
Ok, so just looking at some of the weapons for a bit, and holy shit the Warlord's hex gatling seems a bit OP. I feel like the 14th shots should be knocked down to at LEAST 9 or 10.



People are used to a low number of TK or macro shot weapons. Lots of weaker shots have the advantage of being more reliable and working well across multiple types of targets, but the actual damage output isn't any higher. It's one of those things that has to be playtested to believe.

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 Post subject: Re: [Experimental] New Chaos Feral Titan List
PostPosted: Fri Sep 23, 2016 1:53 am 
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madd0ct0r wrote:
LeCacty wrote:
Ok, so just looking at some of the weapons for a bit, and holy shit the Warlord's hex gatling seems a bit OP. I feel like the 14th shots should be knocked down to at LEAST 9 or 10.



People are used to a low number of TK or macro shot weapons. Lots of weaker shots have the advantage of being more reliable and working well across multiple types of targets, but the actual damage output isn't any higher. It's one of those things that has to be playtested to believe.


Oh ok, I guess its just one of those things that look insane on paper then.


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 Post subject: Re: [Experimental] New Chaos Feral Titan List
PostPosted: Fri Sep 23, 2016 5:11 am 
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LeCacty wrote:
Oh ok, I guess its just one of those things that look insane on paper then.


Against 'soft' targets, that number of dice definitely IS insane.


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 Post subject: Re: [Experimental] New Chaos Feral Titan List
PostPosted: Sat Sep 24, 2016 12:21 am 
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Doomkitten wrote:
LeCacty wrote:
Oh ok, I guess its just one of those things that look insane on paper then.


Against 'soft' targets, that number of dice definitely IS insane.


That was what I was thinking. It would tear up tyranids and the likes. Imagine a carrion class with all hexes :o
But again, I havent playtested so I can't say


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