Heya guys,

I am currently in an Epic campaign, playing my Balck Legion (using the original GW list) versus some loyalist astartes.

I know the guy does not have any drop pods or thunderhawks.

Do you guy have any particular strategies you find effective against the loyalists? Any particular units?

Big thanks for any help!

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Space Marines really need to be able to focus their firepower in order to be scary. One of the quickest ways to cripple a Foot/Rhino Marine list (in my experience) is to take out a few Rhinos ASAP. All of a sudden they become unable to get into position to support each other, or have to double/march just to get in the fight.

When playing Chaos vs Marines, I find that you really need to concentrate on your strengths.

Signal was correct in taking out Rhinos. As a Chaos player you have the strength in numbers and characters. Effectively you should be able to provide more shooting, more hits in CC, and you definately have the range (weapons wise) vs Marines. You also have some of the best Fighter planes in the game to fly into any AA and still provide blast markers where necessary.

The problem you will find is that they can match your tactics (teleport) and have a higher Strategy rating (in the case of teleports and who acts first) so it is always going to be risky setting your guys up for a next turn assault. In this case, you need your numbers (and some times the summoning of daemons - to take the casualties), to realise your strengths in these cases. The fact that you get a MW character in CC for the initial cost is something quite valuable when facing any base Marine formation.

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Origional list? Ferals with IC MW barrages, max out on them. Walk the retinues with the awesome oblits and force the marines to come to you piecemeal and pick them off. Use forlorn hope in rhinos as your mobile objective grabbers and it's tough to fight against.

One thing a bout Campaigns, as opposed to Tournaments, is you're going to be playing with the same people over a long period of time. Eventually you'll likely try changing up the scenarios and all that, so you want to make sure a) you aren't going to piss anyone off (the 5 Terminators in Thunderhawks list is an example of what to avoid) and b) you're going to want some versatility to deal with changing scenarios.

Thanks guys some really useful stuff there.

This is a one off battle in the campaign, and we are allowed to change our lists between games etc.

With Chaos I always seem to struggle with Anti-Armour and having any firepower longer than about 45cm. I know that loyalists sometimes have the same problems, but it seems like quite a difficult match up.

I was thinking of taking 2 or 3 Bike companies to hit hard in assault, 2 or 3 retinues either in Land Raiders or with Oblits and a formation or two of Termies. I have 2 Ferals so could take them. This is a 3000pt game btw

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Find room for 2 deathwheels. They can move up and shoot, and then support the bikes with their FF after the bikes Charge. That is a really nice combo.

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I do not own any Deathwheels, nor am I a massive fan of the concept so I doubt I will ever scrathbuild some.

I was thinking of going for soemthing like this

http://traitor-legion.appspot.com/choos ... x1~522~522

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You've got 5 formations that could be the BTS. Would be better to make one of them more expensive and protect it!

*FacePalm!*

I always miss something when I am writing a list! Thanks for pointing it out Mephiston.

I am quite new / inexperienced with Chaos, I usually play Eldar.

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I ended up going with this list:

...click to edit name..., 3000 POINTS
Black Legion (Specialist Games Forum v1.0)
==================================================

BIKE COMPANY [350]
8 Chaos Space Marines Bikes, Daemon Prince (Supreme Commander)

BIKE COMPANY [375]
8 Chaos Space Marines Bikes, Daemon Prince, Daemonic Pact

BIKE COMPANY [300]
8 Chaos Space Marines Bikes, Chaos Lord

BLACK LEGION RETINUE [350]
8 Chaos Space Marines, Chaos Lord, Obliterator

BLACK LEGION RETINUE [350]
8 Chaos Space Marines, Chaos Lord, Obliterator

BLACK LEGION RETINUE [350]
8 Chaos Space Marines, Chaos Lord, Obliterator

CHAOS TERMINATORS [325]
Chaos Lord, 5 Chaos Terminator

FERAL TITAN [300]


FERAL TITAN [300]

----------------------

We played a slightly different scenario involving holding objectives, nothing else. Also it was agaisnt a different player - playing Orks! Game was very close and bloody and went on until turn 5 without a winner. He basically had me beat at T4 but a mistake on his part and me winning the strategy roll on T5 swept me to a 5:1 victory!

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Nice job!

Just on a side note: did the rule of gaining or losing free daemons on the strategy roll actually eventuate throughout the game? It would be interesting to gauge whether this had any relevance in the game.

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No relevance whatsoever.

The DPact was really only there for BTS and to make up points.

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The doomweel is stupid, a DC4, fast, good FF war engine is not. Make a proxy or two and use them. I'd be tempted to just attach another gun or two to a forgeworld warhound (and the obligatory chaos spikes of course) and use them as doomweels.

Do we have a skaven list in Epic?

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