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Finished Lists - locked until next review period (at least 1 year).

BLACK LEGION
LOST AND THE DAMNED
http://www.players.tacticalwargames.net ... fileId=112

Wth these additional changes - PDF will be updated with these

These include the collated typos from the above version

SPECIAL RULES
‘Range’ of all-faction hatred reduced to 15cm

UNITS
Remove Stalker
Daemon assault engines - remove INV
LoB - remove INV
Plague Tower - remove INV
- should be 3+D3
Subjagator should be CC3+ FF5+
Chaos Spawn should have D3 extra CC attacks
Demagogue should have CC5+
Add Chaos Altar
Daemon Prince should only have +1 EA in FF
Land Raider refers to Chosen rather than Terminators in transport notes
Rhinos - need Chosen added to transport notes
Great Unclean one -changes to Stream of Corruption 15cm small arms EA+1 Ignore Cover
OR 15cm 3BP Ignore Cover
Bloodthirster - should read TK(1) rather than (+1)
BLACK LEGION LIST
Terminators - change to 275 for 4 Terminators+Lord Character, 0-2 additional terminators for 60pts each
Raptor Cult - change to 175 for 4 Raptors+Lord Character, 0-4 additional Raptors for 35pts each
Defilers - formation drops to 250pts, initiative to 3+
Upgrades - Remove Stalker
hell blades should be 225 for 3
Helltalons should be 175 for 2
　
LATD LIST
Remove free pact for Coven
Add Daemonic Pact to upgrade list - 25pts

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www.epic-uk.co.uk
NetEA NetERC Human Lists Chair
NetEA Chaos + Black Legion Champion

2nd Wave Lists - these are now the focus of development and testing

World Eaters
http://www.wargamer.com.au/epic/World_Eaters_pd34.pdf
AC is Frogbear, list frozen until Jan 2011

Emperors Children
http://www.wargamer.com.au/epic/Emperor ... n_pd34.pdf
AC is Frogbear, list frozen until Jan 2011

Death Guard

AC is Hena

Thousand Sons
viewtopic.php?f=82&t=18514

AC is Neal Hunt

Red Corsairs

AC is BlackLegion

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www.epic-uk.co.uk
NetEA NetERC Human Lists Chair
NetEA Chaos + Black Legion Champion

Since when have Hell Talons 2BP?

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We are returned!
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When they come in a squad of two perhaps?

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Frogbear is responsible for...
Previous World Eaters
Previous Emperor's Children
Previous Death Guard
Previous Imperial Fists
Previous Chaos Squats

As far as I'm aware they always have - netEa beta, list from GW site, list from old-old GW site and last version before finalisation by Pixelgeek are all 2 BP

_________________
www.epic-uk.co.uk
NetEA NetERC Human Lists Chair
NetEA Chaos + Black Legion Champion

As far as I'm aware they always have - netEa beta, list from GW site, list from old-old GW site and last version before finalisation by Pixelgeek are all 2 BP

_________________
www.epic-uk.co.uk
NetEA NetERC Human Lists Chair
NetEA Chaos + Black Legion Champion

Well ok. Thought they where BP1 only.

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We are returned!
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We not only have the World Eaters and Emperor's Children list with 1BP, we also have Hena with the Death Guard using 1 BP. Back this up with Black Legion stating 1BP and we all derived it from somewhere.

Looking back at the initial Black Legion playtest changes V1.0 by Lord I seem them printed as 1BP.

So somewhere along the lines either the V1.0 playtest changes changed it or got it wrong with a misprint.

So until otherwise changed, I guess 2BP is it with the latest advise.

_________________
Frogbear is responsible for...
Previous World Eaters
Previous Emperor's Children
Previous Death Guard
Previous Imperial Fists
Previous Chaos Squats

This is where the change originated, I think. This was the same point that they had their cost dropped to 175 points. I thought the two changes were supposed to go together.

But if people are finding they're still only worth 175 points with 2BP, I'm not going to argue. They never seemed worth 300pts, anyway.

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Honestly, with 1 bp they're completely useless.

About the Greater Daemons.

Bloodthirster > the Whip indicates TK(+1). Shouldn't it be simply TK(1)?

Great Unclean One > Does it still use the Flamer template? There are no rules for it in the current list (or anywhere else, unless I'm mistaken). Why not give it something like 4x or 6x AP4+/AT5+?

Otherwise I really like this version of the list, particularly the army list's structure. Much better now.

EDIT - Plague Zombies: Why not replace "Infestation (treat placement just like teleport)" with "Teleport"?

Up, hoping that somebody will answer my questions.

Bloodthirster - typo will be changed though both produce the same result

Plaguebearer - as, due to RL absences, the doc has not been finalised yet I'll change this to
Stream of Corruption 15cm small arms extra attack +1 ignore cover
OR 15cm 3BP Ignore cover

Any objections?

Zombies - leave as they are

_________________
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NetEA NetERC Human Lists Chair
NetEA Chaos + Black Legion Champion

Thanks for the answers.

No objections at all, I was just wondering.

I haven't looked at the lists until recently and I didn't realize that the plan was to go with the core/elite/support structure like EUK.

I have to say that I don't like that for a couple reasons. The most important is that it is pretty darn restrictive and it seriously hinders the "warband" variety that is available in the original list and cuts some very reasonable and flavorful options.

It hinders a deepstrike list. With Forlorn Hope using a drop/summon combo and Termies as an "add on" option, it was possible to deepstrike nearly everything: Retinue (1 Retinue on the ground), 2x FH+ daemon kit, 2x Termies . With FH and Termies coming out of the same pool there's no similar option. Instead of being able to deepstrike ~2000 points, you'd be doing well to drop ~1200 points.

I have a Slaanesh cult that's centered on armor. It is a couple reinforced Retinues, a bike/beast formation, Land Raiders, Terminators (1 formation), 3 Decimators and some air cover. I don't think that's an abusive list and it has a lot of flavor. It's a big infantry line backed by superheavies and a maneuver element of LRs and beasts. However, that would not be possible.

Even my very simple and straightforward area denial strategy loses critical elements - 2 garrison retinues, 1 mech retinue, 2 FH screens, 2 termies. It has to lose a formation of scout coverage (vital for slowing and baiting the enemy) or a formation of terminators (critical counter-attack, because the force is otherwise lacking mobility, and also the only heavy hitters in the force if it faces something heavy). I don't think that an infantry force based around a core of 3 Retinues is out of line for a chaos force.


That's 2 infantry heavy forces and even the "armor" force is 50% infantry. I know those kinds of armies aren't seen in the EUK tourney circuit so deleting them means nothing to them, but I think this is a big deal for a list that is supposed to be general purpose.