Tactical Command
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World Eaters v1.0
http://www.tacticalwargames.net/taccmd/viewtopic.php?f=82&t=14058		 Page 1 of 5
Author:  Dobbsy [ Fri Nov 28, 2008 3:53 am ]
Post subject:  World Eaters v1.0
I took the liberty of adjusting the WE list to a more usable state. I basically used Lord I's v0.2 list with a few changes that have been discussed in the World Eaters thread that I started a while back. I tried to keep most of the units from Lord I's list and mainly tweaked the formation sizes and costs then added the odd unit type to make the list more playable. I also removed the Blood rage rule and made them 1+ Initiative as a trial.

Please let me know of any amendments needed. I would hazard a guess that perhaps some of the formations may still be too large but I was wondering what people think in general.

Thanks for reading and ... Blood for the Blood God and all that.... :))

EDIT- just found a typo - The bloodthirster is missing DC3, Insiring, Walker, Wings
Author:  Dobbsy [ Sun Nov 30, 2008 11:29 pm ]
Post subject:  World Eaters v1.0
No feedback? Dobbsy sad...
Author:  Chroma [ Mon Dec 01, 2008 3:48 am ]
Post subject:  World Eaters v1.0
Give it some time, man!  It's been the weekend!  *laugh*
Author:  Dobbsy [ Mon Dec 01, 2008 3:51 am ]
Post subject:  World Eaters v1.0
LOL! I wasn't expecting play testing just preliminary thoughts, errata etc etc :D
Author:  Dave [ Mon Dec 01, 2008 3:27 pm ]
Post subject:  World Eaters v1.0
I think that's a lot of completely fearless units. Being able to claim They Shall Not Pass is going to be extremely difficult against an army that's nearly all fearless. Not to mention how much the opponents maneuverability will suffer.

I really liked LI suggestion of the Stubborn rule. Essentially, units are given saves for hack down hits. Removing Fearless from the LRs, Preds, rhinos, bikes and legionaries would help with the issues all the Fearless units are causing.
Author:  Lord Inquisitor [ Mon Dec 01, 2008 7:09 pm ]
Post subject:  World Eaters v1.0
You should have asked - i'd have sent you the original Word document, might have saved you some effort! Actually, I do have some suggestions. In fact, looking through my files it seems I did have a WEv1.0 in the making. Umm  :whistle:  

How about you shoot me an email, Dobbsy, and I'll email you the version I was working on and you can take it from there. That version doesn't include Stubborn, however.

One thing, though. Why did you remove the Bloodrage of Khorne? I like that rule...  :sigh:
Author:  The_Real_Chris [ Mon Dec 01, 2008 7:15 pm ]
Post subject:  World Eaters v1.0
After the tourny at the weekend I'm fed up to the back teeth with fearless stuff and would prefer it never existed! Failing that, that it was a bit more limited.
Author:  The_Real_Chris [ Mon Dec 01, 2008 7:25 pm ]
Post subject:  World Eaters v1.0
And there is a typo on the pred weapons. Plus you want to up gun the pred?
Author:  Dobbsy [ Mon Dec 01, 2008 10:33 pm ]
Post subject:  World Eaters v1.0
Okie dokie. I'll take fearless off all the transports, vehicles and legionnaires - I think these guys would be less in-your-face assault troops and more just "We love Khorne  :wow: " troops) and see how that goes. My logic is that the Daemons(including machine-daemons) and assault troops are basically your nutter's nutters in combat so tend to shrug off losses. Basically, the non-close assault troops could definitely have it removed.

TRC & Dave - One question I have is would the fact that they'll lose a lot of troops to fire before entering combat be a balance to your concerns about so many fearless units? Or does that not really enter into it?

Lord I - as I said, I'd only like to trial the list without the Bloodrage rule from your list but if you're really keen on leaving it in I can pop it back. I think my thinking was in line with Scarik (or was it Olly) who made a good point that they didn't need to be forced to enter combat because you're going to want to anyway. I like to keep things simple to start.

No worries on the word doc - I like to create things and this was good because I've never made a list up before  :;):

Email forthcoming.

Thanks for the heads up TRC. Should I make it a basic pred destructor with auto cannon instead?

Cheers guys
Author:  The_Real_Chris [ Tue Dec 02, 2008 6:03 am ]
Post subject:  World Eaters v1.0
Pred - no idea, tis your call, was more asking was it intentional. The BL list has a mark 1 config (autocannon and lascannon) but the chaos preds are quite eccentric in weapons load outs so whatever you want! Just mind the roles between vehicles - pred, vindi and raider (hell could have whirlwinds as well, csm used them all in the heresy). So one doesn't negate another. Broadly the raider was the tank killer, the pred the medium tank to fight stuff all round (ideally lv's), the vidi the infantry killer and so on.

Instead of the stalker you could consider the mk1 whirlwind with some sort of AA capability? Maybe bp1 AA5+ / AT5+ AA5+ (the whirlwind used to fire krak missiles) or somesuch? Then again the stalker could be them resupplying in the eye?

Oh I would remove the annoying 1 and 6 rule as well. How often is ti remembered? Now the word bearers should get it, but the opposite way round! Not only does this stop success being reinforced but you can have a bit of fluff saying if they pray to much for demons do poorly in fighting and if get carried away the demons slink off home :)
Author:  Mark_Logue [ Tue Dec 02, 2008 1:27 pm ]
Post subject:  World Eaters v1.0
Berzerkers should have FF5+ like in Black Legion list. Also they are probably on cheap side as it's 275 for 8 + lord. BL list has them at 150 for 4. I'm thinking that Bikes might also be tad cheap.

The BL list doesn't really give a good starting point as they were an upgrade to a formation adding extra CC power to a unit.  On there own they don't have the capacity to shoot and inflict blast markers.

I think it will just require playtesting to work out an appropriate value.  275 does seem like a reasonable starting point to me.
Author:  The_Real_Chris [ Tue Dec 02, 2008 4:17 pm ]
Post subject:  World Eaters v1.0
Quote: (Dobbsy @ 01 Dec. 2008, 21:33 )

TRC & Dave - One question I have is would the fact that they'll lose a lot of troops to fire before entering combat be a balance to your concerns about so many fearless units? Or does that not really enter into it?

Nope :) Lots of armies rely on assaults and having high init survivors in your objective areas, most nlikely waiting in cover to rally can be very hard to deal with. Plus the more fearless there is the more they cost and the less models in the army and the sharper the knifes edge they are on with regards to balancing against shooting armies.
Author:  Dobbsy [ Tue Dec 02, 2008 10:31 pm ]
Post subject:  World Eaters v1.0
Also they are probably on cheap side as it's 275 for 8 + lord.
Also keep in mind the allowance for the cost of equipping with rhinos at a later time in selection of the army - with rhinos the formation costs 315.... I considered the size of the formation for the points and I figured 225 points and a rough 50 for a lord would be a fair starting point. When it comes to power armour troops I always tend to compare vs the standard Tactical marines as I see them as a starting point for costs. IMO, you can't get much more even stats than AR4+ CC4+ FF4+.... And I don't think zerkers are a match in costs for Tac marines given they have no ranged attack.

Pred - no idea, tis your call, was more asking was it intentional.
No you were right it was a typo. I'm kinda thinking about giving it an autocannon though, as it just seems more Khorne-like to have a weapon that shoots heavy slugs into people instead of zapping them :)) It will focus AT on the Land Raider too.

I'll probably keep the stalker in as it's in the updated BL list. I've tried to keep as much of the BL list as I thought prudent.
Author:  Dobbsy [ Tue Dec 02, 2008 10:43 pm ]
Post subject:  World Eaters v1.0
If I remove fearless from the vehicles should they get a points drop in comparison to standard Marine costs? i.e Pred is 75 each in SM list. But with no leader option or ATSKNF on the WE preds, are they worth 75?
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