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| Painlord and Reviler http://www.tacticalwargames.net/taccmd/viewtopic.php?f=82&t=11002 |
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| Author: | rpr [ Thu Nov 15, 2007 9:39 am ] |
| Post subject: | Painlord and Reviler |
I took a look at Painlord and Reviler in EC4.0 Alternative Units and boy do they weapons suck. So here is change proposition to put their weaponry to same level as weapons in AMTL: Psi-Pulse: 3BP (45cm, TK d3, fxf) (OR: as Warlock titan psi cannon) Energy Whip: extra attack (+6) (MW, as Chain Fist) Hellblades: extra attack (+3) (TK d3, as Power Fist) (after all, they have same number of weapons as warlord/reaver. Then they have +5cm move but -1 DC) There is mixed information of should Reviler CC be 2+ or 3+ if armed with hellblades... Similarily, in my opinion, if Power Fist is +3A (TK..), then Subjugator claws should be, in total, be +3A (as Questor replacement guns are equal to Vulcan Megabolter) EDIT: I did some extra calculations... |
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| Author: | Tiny-Tim [ Thu Nov 15, 2007 10:27 am ] |
| Post subject: | Painlord and Reviler |
(rpr @ Nov. 15 2007,08:39) QUOTE I took a look at Painlord and Reviler in EC4.0 Psi-Pulse: ?3BP (45cm, TK d3, fxf) ?(OR: as Warlock titan psi cannon) Energy Whip: extra attack (+6) ?(MW, as Chain Fist) Hellblades: extra attack (+3) (TK d3, as Power Fist) (after all, they have same number of weapons as warlord/reaver. Then they have +5cm move but -1 DC) There is mixed information of should Reviler CC be 2+ or 3+ if armed with hellblades... Things to consider with these changes, the Psi-Pulse change coupled with the Painlord Excruciator would result in a 6 BP MW attack, should we be creating this? Energy Whip, yes could go with that. (Would be even better if we could justify the whips on a Reviler) Would be very careful about having +3 attacks for the Hellblades as we would be creating an 11 CC attack titan on 2+ to hit for only 650pts nightmare. I would convert one for that price. |
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| Author: | Ilushia [ Thu Nov 15, 2007 10:33 am ] |
| Post subject: | Painlord and Reviler |
I vehemently oppose any attempt to add more BP TK weapons to the list with a TK value greater then 1. Due to the way BP weapons work against titans these are absurdly good, as the bigger the titan is the harder they'll get hit. As for the other weapons: Keep in mind the limitations on what weapons the AMTL can arm their units with make it extremely difficult to field more then 1 assault weapon or support weapon on an individual titan typically. Warlords can, at best, fit 3. If they have another Battle Titan in the group sporting 3 standard weapons. The Excrutiator is already pretty close to a Quake Cannon as is (Half range, +1 BP, Disrupt, Ignore Cover). And the Tormentor is likely -better- then a Vulcan Megabolter (Same range, 1 less shot, Disrupt). Giving the rest of their weapons those kinds of stats would be.. Pretty darn crazy good. Especially considering you can get a Painlord for 50 points cheaper then a Warlord as well... The extra move speed make assault weapons a -lot- nastier, to boot. Not sure if I'd call their base stats undergunned or not... I think some of the AMTL weapons are a bit over-powered/under-powered, really. But the weapon restrictions make fielding lost of assault weapons quite difficult. |
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| Author: | rpr [ Thu Nov 15, 2007 11:33 am ] |
| Post subject: | Painlord and Reviler |
(Tiny-Tim @ Nov. 15 2007,11:27) QUOTE Things to consider with these changes, the Psi-Pulse change coupled with the Painlord Excruciator would result in a 6 BP MW attack, should we be creating this? Yeah you are quite right here, but I tried to avoid 2x thing, too. Anyway, I try to compare these to Banelord and Ravager, respectively. Ravager has doomburner, battlehead, tail and +DC, Reviler has psi-pulse and +5cm move (death storm and tormentor are quite equal) .. I feel that the Reviler combination is worse, but maybe that is not that much off so cannon Reviler could be ok. Similarily Painlord if Ernegy whip upgraded. Which leads to melee Reviler.. (Tiny-Tim @ Nov. 15 2007,11:27) QUOTE Would be very careful about having +3 attacks for the Hellblades as we would be creating an 11 CC attack titan on 2+ to hit for only 650pts nightmare. I would convert one for that price. That is quite true - dangerous combination. Make it more like other multi-use things, like +2A tk d3 and then some guns on it, like: 30cm 4x AP3+/AT5+ (like Banelord Doomfist) And then CC 3+, FF 4+ for that version (not 2+/5+) That would be 9 CC attacks that would hit 3+ (6 hits vs. previous 9..) |
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