(The_Real_Chris @ Dec. 18 2007,06:45)
QUOTE
I think the fragility is a problem. The model is weighed down by so much ordanance - MBT levels really - yet lacks the armour to match. Net result does terrible things if left alone or dies fairly quickly if targeted. How to point such a beast that can do all this damage yet remains so fragile?
That thing certainly is beast enough so that is must be targeted before going in.
(The_Real_Chris @ Dec. 18 2007,06:45)
QUOTE
Saying that its stats in 40k are apparently a bit worse than a dred (WS, BS, I etc) so perhaps it should be relative to the dreds stats? Speed is dred plus fleet, but infantry in Epic don't always get this 'fleet' rule ported over, so that should be cost dependant.
Why do people use 40k as their bible? Wouldn't it be smarter to try and balance stuff compared to the existing units instead of trying to take everything from 40k literally.
(The_Real_Chris @ Dec. 18 2007,06:45)
QUOTE
How about to keep the cost down
Type - AV
Speed - 15cm, Infiltrate OR 20cm (one or other, ones infantry support the other stretches to vehicles)
Armour - Same as Dreadnaught (whatever that will finally be). I believe the two are the same? So no invulnerable etc.
FF - 4+ (with IC makes it slightly better than a russ with comparable weapon fit and ability)
CC - 5+ (slightly worse than Dreadnaught as fitting its abilities)
Battlecannon 75cm AP4+/AT4+
Reaper Autocannon 30cm AP4+/AT6+
Twin Heavy Flamer 15cm AP3+ Ignore Cover, Small arms Ignore Cover
Big crab claws Base Contact +1EA, MW
OR (if you want an alt fit and this one goes all CC, doubt I would want it though)
Battlecannon 75cm AP4+/AT4+
3xBig crab claws Base Contact +1EA, MW
Special stuff - Walker, Fearless
So now it has fearless too, 4 for 500?
(The_Real_Chris @ Dec. 18 2007,06:45)
QUOTE
Points wise maybe 75. Got the firepower of a russ, far better CC ability, better FF but less armour, walker and fearless. Note if dread armour increases that would becomes less true.
At 75 it would be a bargain. Maybe instead 2 for 175 or 3 for 250?
It would be better to compare it against one unit that resembles it the most (dreadnought) than giving it everything and then comparing parts of it to one unit and other parts against other unit. Oh look it's doing its job splendidly, now it's better than a russ and better than a dreadnought, little more and its better than both of them combined.
You noticed the fragility is a problem. There's already been posts that they're too expensive for a 1DC unit. Others would like to see them cheaper so they would end up on the table yet everyone keeps on adding extra MW attacks and/or guns that will make it more expensive. Also the stats are starting to look like something that can kill 2 dreadnoughts before ever reaching 15cm and two more after that. Give it 3MW attacks and nobody in their right mind will assault the unit that has those in it. The 75cm cannon alone is better than a single dreadnought if you know how to use it.
If the "bible" says it likes to run around the enemy and kill stuff and if we're not trying to make it every fan's wet dream and it is actually scaled to some existing unit, like dreadnought, then this is something it should look like.
AV 15cm 4+ 4+ 4+
Defiler (Short Range) Battlecannon: AP4+/AT4+/30cm, Indirect
Autocannon: AP4+/AT6+/30cm
Power Claws: +MWCC
Infiltrate, Walker
Cost: 50pts
Compared to a dreadnought it has extra ranged indirect weapon and infiltrate instead of ATSKNF (and possibility to be transported). Yeah I know it looks like crap compared to the other one but I'd rather keep the existing units the way they are and scale new stuff using them.
Thank you Tiny-Tim and Soren for bringing any sanity to this thread..
