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Ork Landa & other planes without rules.
mageboltrat
 Post subject: Ork Landa & other planes without rules.
PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2007 4:37 pm 
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OK lets have a try at getting the Landa into AI

ORK LANDA - 20 pts
additional weapon loads - 4pts
upgrade transport to jump troops - 12pts


Type: Bomber
Hits: 8
Transport: 8
Manoeuvre: Low
Max Speed: 4
Min Speed: 1
Max Altitude: 9 (Rocket Boosters)
Thrust: 1

Option 1
Weapons
1. Defensive Shootas / Arc: All round / Fire-Power: 4-2-0 / Damage: 5+ / Ammo: 5

Weapon Load 1
2. Rokkits / Arc: Front / Fire-Power: 0-2-1 / Damage: 3+ / Ammo: 2

Option 2
Weapons
1. Defensive Shootas / Arc: left / Fire-Power: 4-2-0 / Damage: 5+ / Ammo: 5
2. Defensive Shootas / Arc: right / Fire-Power: 4-2-0 / Damage: 5+ / Ammo: 5

Weapon Load 1
3. Rokkits / Arc: Front / Fire-Power: 0-2-1 / Damage: 3+ / Ammo: 2

That's my take on how it would convert from Epic to AI, I have really guessed on a lot of things and would like to hear your take on it. Also there are a few other planes missing like Doomwings etc. Anyone got any ideas on them?




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CyberShadow
 Post subject: Ork Landa & other planes without rules.
PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2007 5:18 pm 
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Looks reasonable. Thrust should be dropped to 1, currently both Ork craft have this limit (cant have it outrunning its escorts). Transport should probably be 7, as it carries more than the Thunderhawk or Vampire. I would drop the option to drop jump troops.

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mageboltrat
 Post subject: Ork Landa & other planes without rules.
PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2007 5:25 pm 
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(CyberShadow @ Jan. 13 2007,16:18)
QUOTE
Looks reasonable. Thrust should be dropped to 1, currently both Ork craft have this limit (cant have it outrunning its escorts). Transport should probably be 7, as it carries more than the Thunderhawk or Vampire. I would drop the option to drop jump troops.

I hadn't noticed that Orks have such low thrust across the board, changed it to 1. I also was looking at the transport on the transporter not the thunderhawk, so it should be higher, unless of course it's the ability of the troups dropped which matter if that was the case I would go for around 4 or 5.

Most people seem to load there Landas with stormboyz in Epic, so it seems reasonable to have the option of drop troops.

BTW which weapon set do you think is better option 1 or 2 I prefere 2. but I might add a tail gunner as the model has one.




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CyberShadow
 Post subject: Ork Landa & other planes without rules.
PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2007 9:31 pm 
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Agreed with the jump troops - if the Imperial Guard get the option then it should be open to most races! If you add the tail gunner (which I would, if it is on the model) then I would go with weapons fit #1. If you dont, then I would go with #2.

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mageboltrat
 Post subject: Ork Landa & other planes without rules.
PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2007 10:15 pm 
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I think I would go with this after looking at the model. lots of side guns. no front facing ones, and a tini tail gun.

Weapons
1. Defensive Shootas / Arc: left / Fire-Power: 6-3-0 / Damage: 5+ / Ammo: 5
2. Defensive Shootas / Arc: right / Fire-Power: 6-3-0 / Damage: 5+ / Ammo: 5
3. Tail Gunner / Arc: rear, up / Fire-Power: 2-1-0 / Damage: 5+ / Ammo: 2

Weapon Load 1
3. Rokkits / Arc: Front / Fire-Power: 0-2-1 / Damage: 3+ / Ammo: 2

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ragnarok
 Post subject: Ork Landa & other planes without rules.
PostPosted: Sun Jan 14, 2007 11:07 am 
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Not being near by Epic rule bok I am only guessing here, but shouldn't the rokkits be ground attack only?  Used to satuate the landing zone before dropping the boyz off.

Though other than that I like it.  :D

Now go and make rules for the marine landing craft  :;):

One that I wold like to add to the list is one that doesn't exist at all  :O .  A lightning strike variant that is equipt with sky strike missiles instead of hellstrike.

For the simple reason that the thunderbolt seems superior to the lightning in airial combat but the lightning is surpose to be the interceptor.

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mageboltrat
 Post subject: Ork Landa & other planes without rules.
PostPosted: Sun Jan 14, 2007 9:09 pm 
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OK have a look at the following stat line. I've altered it to have 3 different additional loads, which might need a bit of balancing. One's a ground attak cannon, to soften up the drop site as Ragnarok suggested. The other is bombs, I imagine these being a popped in the transport area on trolleys and being rolled out the front door  by the grots so I've lowered the likeliness to damage and upped the number of dice to represent them being a bit random, I've also lowered the transport capability as the transport area is now stuffed with grots and bombs.

ORK LANDA - 20 pts
additional weapon loads - 4pts
upgrade transport to jump troops - 12pts


Type: Bomber
Hits: 8
Transport: 8
Manoeuvre: Low
Max Speed: 4
Min Speed: 1
Max Altitude: 9 (Rocket Boosters)
Thrust: 1

Weapons
1. Defensive Shootas / Arc: left / Fire-Power: 6-3-0 / Damage: 5+ / Ammo: 5
2. Defensive Shootas / Arc: right / Fire-Power: 6-3-0 / Damage: 5+ / Ammo: 5
3. Tail Gunner / Arc: rear, up / Fire-Power: 2-1-0 / Damage: 5+ / Ammo: 2

Weapon Load 1
4. Rokkits / Arc: Front / Fire-Power: 0-2-1 / Damage: 3+ / Ammo: 2

Weapons Load 2
4. Bombs / Arc: Rear / Fire-Power: 10-0-0 / Damage: 4+ / Ammo: 1 / ground attack, extra damage 6+, Lowers Transport to 4

Weapon Load 3
4. Ground Attak Cannon / Arc: Front / Fire-Power: 4-2-0 / Damage 4+ / Ammo: 2 / ground attack




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Cmdr_Adeon
 Post subject: Ork Landa & other planes without rules.
PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2007 7:44 am 
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The ground attack cannon should really by fire arc "Front, Down" or more likely just ground attack. Also if you look at the existing rules all of them represent external loads and as such always use the same number of hardpoints, whgich the bombs option doesn't. I realize your intent is that it replaces part of the transport space with a bomb bay, but I thought I'd point it out.
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mageboltrat
 Post subject: Ork Landa & other planes without rules.
PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2007 10:57 am 
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Ah thanks, forgot to put ground attack on the attak cannon. I know what you mean about hard points, the landa really doesn't have any, it has some tubes air fixed on to the nose, if it was going to have bombs they would have to be internal.

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Cmdr_Adeon
 Post subject: Ork Landa & other planes without rules.
PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2007 4:14 pm 
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Alright I've got a bit of free time so I'll stat out the Space Marine Landing craft

Space Marine Landing Craft - 50 pts
Upgrade Transport to Jump Troops - 20 pts


Type: Bomber
Hits: 10
Transport: 16
Manoeuvre: Low
Max Speed: 5
Min Speed: 2
Max Altitude: 9 (Rocket Boosters)
Thrust: 1

Weapons
1. Twin Heavy Bolters / Arc: All Round / Fire-Power 3-2-0 / Damage 5+ / Ammo: 5
2. Twin Heavy Bolters / Arc: Left / Fire-Power 3-2-0 / Damage 5+ / Ammo: 5
3. Twin Heavy Bolters / Arc: Right / Fire-Power 3-2-0 / Damage 5+ / Ammo: 5
4. Twin Lascannon / Arc: Left / Fire-Power 0-1-1 / Damage 5+ / Ammo: 5 / Special: Ground Attack, Extra Damage 6
5. Twin Lascannon / Arc: Right / Fire-Power 0-1-1 / Damage 5+ / Ammo: 5 / Special: Ground Attack, Extra Damage 6

Special Rule: If the landing craft's transport is upgraded to drop troops then its transport capacity is lowered to 10


Well, that's my take on it. The landing craft has the transport capacity of 1.5 thawks and 3 thawk transporters but is slightly less than a manta (fewer troops, more tanks) but I think 16 "feels" right. The reduction on jump troops represents the fact that if it's planning to do a jump drop it won't bother carrying tanks. The points for the jump troops upgrade reflects this, normally its a straight 2.5 points per trandsport slot to make them jump, the 5point reduction is due to the fact that it loses 6 points of transport if it takes the upgrade. Finally I realize that it breaks the unwritten rule of no more than four weapons with limited ammo, but like th emanta I think it needs to.
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ragnarok
 Post subject: Ork Landa & other planes without rules.
PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2007 6:15 pm 
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I would make a few changes to the landing craftsbstats.

Firstly I would raplce the three hvy bolter turrets with a single entry for a hevy bolter battery.

Hvy bolter battery, arc all round up, fire power 8/6/0, ammo unl,.

Secondly  I would have the jump troop upgrade apply to half of the transported units (which is something I am going to do with the nid air swarm) to represent it carrying a load of assault marines and 4 battle tanks.

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Cmdr_Adeon
 Post subject: Ork Landa & other planes without rules.
PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2007 8:10 pm 
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I considered doing a combined heavy bolter battery, but the issue with that is that the model clearly has two of them positioned on the wings where they would be hard pressed to fire all round. I didn't give them unlimited ammo basically since they are virtually the same as the THawk ones and those don't get it, although honestly they probably should have it. They aren't an up arc because I see them being used to strafe the landing zone before setting down.

I did consider doing it so that the jump troops applies to 10 of the transport points rather than reducing them if you took jump but I didn't for a number of reasons. The first is simply that I don't think it's pretty effective in game since to take advantage of it the craft has to make a pass to drop the drop troops and then double back to land which seems inefficient.  Basically I see the landing craft doing two different troop transport missions. The first is a "light" configuration where it's plan is to come in low and fast drop its troops and get out of there. This is represented by the jump troops upgrade. The second configuration is heavier and represents it carrying a number of predators or land raiders as well as a half-company worth of infanty. In this case it would come in slower and actually land to disgorge its cargo. To be honest I also wanted to discourage the'light' configuration as I see that as more of a THawk role.
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ragnarok
 Post subject: Ork Landa & other planes without rules.
PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2007 9:19 pm 
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You're right they are on the wings!

I got them mixed up with the ventral storm bolters  :confuse: .

However I would still keep them as upward arc.  A landing craft will be lifting its nose when it comes into land.  They are in the  same position as the marauder destroyers ventral heavy bolter and that is an upwards arc weapon, despite the fact the bomber is designed to straff.

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mageboltrat
 Post subject: Ork Landa & other planes without rules.
PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2007 10:00 pm 
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Next we need rules for this ;)



Do you think if I add the gun on the back and paint it in the reaver pattern in the movie. that I could sneak it into GW as an ork landa :p




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orangesm
 Post subject: Ork Landa & other planes without rules.
PostPosted: Thu Jan 18, 2007 12:04 am 
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No turning that into an abomination.

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